Moen, Should I Go Ahead And Replace Shower Valve If I'm Replacing Tile?

Users who are viewing this thread

NavySuit

Member
Messages
63
Reaction score
0
Points
6
Location
Florida
I'm going to replace the tile in a bathroom for my rental property. The house was built in 1971, and I'm assuming it is the original valve. Should I go ahead and replace it while I'm in there, or can I just rebuild the valve in place?

moen-chateau-valve-4.jpg
 
Last edited by a moderator:

WJcandee

Wise One
Messages
3,181
Reaction score
170
Points
63
Location
New York, NY
That's going to be a Moentrol valve (because you pull to make the water run and push to shut off, and can control the water volume by how far out you pull).

The valve bodies on these things, as Standardairconditioner said, can last basically as long as the house will stand, but the cartridges won't. Since the thing is dripping, I would change the cartridge, which, as SA also said, you can do anytime from the front.

As far as I know, all the Moentrols use the same cartridge (different from the cheapo Positemps). When you buy a new cartridge, it comes with a little cap that makes it easy to remove the old cartridge. It's a pretty-easy, straightforward job.

And the cartridge is inexpensive, and it's the thing to replace if you have a leak. Well, actually, there are two cartridge options, the same design, but made of different material. One is the brass one, Model 1200, which has a list price of $48 but can be found for about $28. The Model 1225, which has some plastic components, lists for $29 but can be found for about $17.

I would spend the extra $10 to get the brass one, but the 1225 is the biggest seller, of course.

Were I you, I would buy the cartridge and replace it. I would clean up the trim with a Mr. Clean Magic Eraser, which is amazing on tile and shower trim, so it looks nice and shiny. Your tenant will think you just put in a brand new valve, and you will save water from fixing the leak.

(On tile or tub with lots of soap scum on it, I spray first with Scrubbing Bubbles, then wipe with the Magic Eraser, and the stuff comes off like it was never there. After years of using other means, this is far and away the easiest and most-effective combo to make the stuff come completely-clean with no elbow grease at all. Amazing.)

Here's a pretty-good video about how to change the cartridge. It really is easy and straightforward:


Note to nerds like me: I like how, in the video, when he pulls out the old cartridge, there is a piece of water heater dip tube riding on top.
 
Last edited:

NavySuit

Member
Messages
63
Reaction score
0
Points
6
Location
Florida
Thanks for the info. The only reason I was considering replacing it was due to the age and difficulty getting to it. Since I'm removing the tile anyways, it would be easier to go ahead and do it now as opposed to five years from now. I'm glad these things were built to last. I'll replace the cartridge on it.
 

Widgit Maker

Member
Messages
173
Reaction score
21
Points
18
Location
Alexandria, Virginia
That valve body will probably last longer than you or your house. The only thing that needs replacement is the cartridge and Moen will provide a new one free. Call 1-800-BUY MOEN (1-800-289-6636). It probably uses a 1225B . There are only three or four different cartridges styles. Describe the cartridge to the Moen rep to insure you get the proper one.

When inserting the new cartridge align the ears of the cartridge as shown in the video. What is not shown in the video is the need to get the cartridge fully seated. Install the new cartridge with the valve stem open, that is with the stem pulled out. If the stem is closed you can have air or even water trapped in the valve and the cartridge will not seat completely. If not fully seated, the clip will not go in even thought you have the ears aligned. If that happens pull the stem out to open it, then take a screwdriver and push the cartridge firmly into the valve.
Delivery time for the cartridge is usually about 5 days . You can pay for express delivery. I have replaced a number of these. Some time ago I had Moen send me a couple of each style for stock. Now when I replace one, I have the home owner call Moen and request a replacement be sent to me. I do not charge the home owner for the cartridge.

If after installation is complete, you find that the hot and cold are reversed, remove the handle, turn the stem 180 degrees and reinstall the handle. Of course you could check that before putting the handle on the first time.
 
Last edited:

hj

Master Plumber
Messages
33,602
Reaction score
1,041
Points
113
Location
Cave Creek, Arizona
Website
www.terrylove.com
It is ONLY a "Moentrol" if it has a balancing spool in the body to the right of the cartridge, otherwise it is just a Dialcet model without pressure balancing. If so, the replacing it with a new pressure balanced valve would be to your advantage in the long run.,

index.php
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Dj2

In the Trades
Messages
2,611
Reaction score
258
Points
83
Location
California
If you are in the mood for changes, replace the trim as well, for a fresh "new" look. Your tenant will thank you for that.
 

Terry

The Plumbing Wizard
Staff member
Messages
29,942
Reaction score
3,459
Points
113
Location
Bothell, Washington
Website
terrylove.com
It is ONLY a "Moentrol" if it has a balancing spool in the body to the right of the cartridge, otherwise it is just a Dialcet model without pressure balancing. If so, the replacing it with a new pressure balanced valve would be to your advantage in the long run.,

I agree with hj. Unless it's a balanced control Moentrol, you should replace it at this time. A new Moen Posi-Temp would control temperature better.
You can replace with a 1225, 1225B or 1200 cartridge if you just want to renew the working parts, but it won't be pressure balanced.
 

Asktom

Member
Messages
745
Reaction score
32
Points
18
Location
Victor, MT
Change the valve. If you don't, when you put the trim on it is going to look older and funkier than it did on the old wall that you are used to. You will probably want to get a new trim kit, so why not put in a more modern valve?
 

Jadnashua

Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx
Messages
32,770
Reaction score
1,190
Points
113
Location
New England
Current code requires an anti-scald technology in any shower valve...so, since you're tearing things up, it is the right thing to do to update it to a modern design. While you may not have issues with spikes of hot or cold water when someone else in the house uses water, a newer valve will prevent that. Think of it as insurance. This is especially important for younger children and elderly, since their skin is thinner, and they can be burned much quicker than those in the middle.
 

WJcandee

Wise One
Messages
3,181
Reaction score
170
Points
63
Location
New York, NY
I have to say there is no way I would ever install a Positemp, or any valve that didn't allow me to vary the water volume. While perhaps not essential in day-to-day use, there are all sorts of circumstances that come up in which you want to vary the flow. A valve that doesn't let me do that just isn't anything I want to deal with.

The Moentrol valve body is minimally-more-expensive than the Positemp -- what? 10%? -- so it's no place to save money.

But personal preferences are what make the world go around, and mine are obviously not others'...
 
Last edited:

Jadnashua

Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx
Messages
32,770
Reaction score
1,190
Points
113
Location
New England
There are a bunch of compliant shower valves that have a volume control in addition to temperature, but they tend to cost a bit more money. A second handle or lever is usually required, but not always. Moen cartridges can be a major pain to remove on some when they get old.
 

Jadnashua

Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx
Messages
32,770
Reaction score
1,190
Points
113
Location
New England
If you're a landlord, and the valve does not meet the current guidelines on anti-scald technology, it is highly prudent for a landlord to replace the valve while doing major work in the shower area! One less thing you might be sued for, should someone have an issue with falling in the shower because of a hot or cold spike that can easily be averted now.
 

Jadnashua

Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx
Messages
32,770
Reaction score
1,190
Points
113
Location
New England
Landlords like to make money, but being sued can be a major pain in both the pocketbook and time. Assuming a permit is pulled, not putting in an anti-scald valve might get you hassles with the inspector, too. If the one installed is already compliant, new or polished up trim with a new cartridge should be fine.
 
Top
Hey, wait a minute.

This is awkward, but...

It looks like you're using an ad blocker. We get it, but (1) terrylove.com can't live without ads, and (2) ad blockers can cause issues with videos and comments. If you'd like to support the site, please allow ads.

If any particular ad is your REASON for blocking ads, please let us know. We might be able to do something about it. Thanks.
I've Disabled AdBlock    No Thanks