Shooting water from the other drain with my Garbage disposal... Sure, it's fun, but...

[John Q Florida]

Although the sink drains ok, there are moments where running the garbage disposal causes at least a little noise in the other drain, sometimes a little gurgling, sometiems splashing, and on special occasions, the fun part, squirting water 2 feet up in the air.

It's a new house to me, and it's more or less always happened. I've found some good suggestions on plunging and there is an access point to run a snake down too, which is what I have to look forward to this evening.

(As a sidenote, running some dishwasher cleaner was apparently the last straw for my garbage disposal, which is now leaking from the holes on its bottom; so it's while I'm down there replacing that, I'll look more closely at the plumbing in general too.)

Independently of my plunging and snaking though, I had questions about the design. To my amateur eye, it seems odd, so I thought I would ask. Pictures (this is an island kitchen, btw) here: https://1drv.ms/f/s!Anl-vA0RiSI_g6pD6EacZhEQBhVt5Q

Also, when I look carefully at the pipe in person, it really looks like the line from the garbage disposal to the junction is going uphill (I realize the pictures don't look that way, I must not have had the camera perfectly level.) I'll check with an actual Level when I get home too.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Terry]

You disposer is ancient. At some point it should be replaced. I like to change them out at 8 to 10 years.
I don't know how that plumbing is vented. Perhaps and AAV would help there.
The disposer may be shooting right across the sanitary cross and pushing the water in the opposing p-trap upward.

I'm a fan of the baffle tee which forces water downward.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[John Q Florida]

@Terry, thanks, and thanks for labeling the diagrams. The new disposal goes in tonight. I'll be curious if there's anything printed on the old one to see how old it was. (It's definitely no older than 2001, that's when the house was built.)

When I first just glanced at the top of the sanitary cross, I saw notches, that made me assume it was an AAV, but that seems unlikely now that I think about it. I'll at the very least add one, it can't make it worse.

It sounds like the basic overall design is OK, other than venting? I'll definitely go baffle tee too.

Thanks!

 

[hj]

That is a "recessed head plug", NOT an AAV. An AAV would be useless there and serve no purpose.

 

[Cacher_Chick]

I would consider that a combination drain and vent.

If it didn't do it before but is does it now, the 3" line has a partial restriction that needs to be cleared.

 

[John Q Florida]

Update: although the garbage disposal was a side conversation, the new one is in. The old one had a QR code on the bottom, so it can’t be all that old.

The AAV is in too. It made a very noticable difference in eliminating any gurgling sounds on the other side while draining and even running the disposal.

With regard to the squirting, it's much improved, but I can still make it squirt by filling the disposal side with a couple inches of water and running the garbage disposal. It's better, but now, at the very end, as the last bit of the water goes down the disposal side, it'll shoot at that very end. (Before, it squirted at the start of running the disposal.) It may take a few days of living to make a full assessment, but it's without a doubt better on the gurgling, and at least somewhat better on the shooting water.

Regarding a baffle version of my double-tee, all I can find that seems like it'll work well, is a 45 degree double WYE, such as the one here.
Am I missing something, in being able to tell which double tee/crosses have baffles?

Thanks all, for the ideas.

 

[MACPLUMB]

Go with what Cacher_chick posted you need to have that drain power snaked with a 5/8" to 3/4" sewer cable, or get pressure jetted to clear the grease build up that is in that drain

 

[Terry]

You can't use a double wye without siphoning the p-traps.
On the vertical it's a santee.

 

[John Q Florida]

You can't use a double wye without siphoning the p-traps.
On the vertical it's a santee.

Thanks... What I have there now is a double sanitary tee (Charlotte Pipe 428). I may keep living with it a while longer to see how it goes. The glub glub gurgling is gone, and the squirting is greatly improved. I'll do a little chemistry and snake the lower drain out some, although a preliminary light snaking, there wasn't anything to see.

 

[John Q Florida]

So, revisiting this a year later: The gurgling had been much improved for a while, then gradually but steadily returned. Recently, for a different reason (a clog elsewhere) I ended up snaking down this drain too since I was already dirty. Ironically, the gurgling is even worse now, after the snaking. There's definitely no blockage here, and the gurgling occurs now even with a smallish amount of water.

Anyway, if I pattern a redesign (loosely) after Terry's original image (rough sketch below), I do have a question: (Orange = what would be removed.) For the high loop hose from the dishwasher, I would have to extend it around to the other side of the disposal and add a U turn to it. (See the green-ish rendering of the new path.) Is that kind of a turn OK in this case?

Also, would it matter in this case to raise the P trap up higher? (I can see where it would make a bit more usable floor space in the cabinet. Any plumbing related reasons regarding whether to raise it or not?

 

[Reach4]

I forget what that draining and venting method with the big pipe is called. You know it's not current code for you.

If that pipe through the bottom is 3 inch, and you were to keep that method, I think you would put

a
3" x 3" x 1-1/2" or 3" x 3" x2" PVC sanitary tee with a trap adapter in the size, and put a cap on top. It would probably work fine. Just not current code.

If you want to meet code, you would use a sanitary tee with a pipe and an AAV on top. In that case, you could could put in a
3" x 2" PVC DWV Reducer Coupling

on the big PVC , with a santee on that. Then a short pipe up to the AAV, like https://terrylove.com/forums/index.php?attachments/img_20161221_125940008-1-jpg.37493/

 

[Jeff H Young]

Although the sink drains ok, there are moments where running the garbage disposal causes at least a little noise in the other drain, sometimes a little gurgling, sometiems splashing, and on special occasions, the fun part, squirting water 2 feet up in the air.

It's a new house to me, and it's more or less always happened. I've found some good suggestions on plunging and there is an access point to run a snake down too, which is what I have to look forward to this evening.

(As a sidenote, running some dishwasher cleaner was apparently the last straw for my garbage disposal, which is now leaking from the holes on its bottom; so it's while I'm down there replacing that, I'll look more closely at the plumbing in general too.)

Independently of my plunging and snaking though, I had questions about the design. To my amateur eye, it seems odd, so I thought I would ask. Pictures (this is an island kitchen, btw) here: https://1drv.ms/f/s!Anl-vA0RiSI_g6pD6EacZhEQBhVt5Q

Also, when I look carefully at the pipe in person, it really looks like the line from the garbage disposal to the junction is going uphill (I realize the pictures don't look that way, I must not have had the camera perfectly level.) I'll check with an actual Level when I get home too.

Thanks in advance.

View attachment 53816 View attachment 53817

Good to hear of your fix for this house. Under the circumstances I think the AAV and the reconfiguring drain should be a permanent fix and serve well.
Just out of curiosity how old is your home? The reason I ask is Im trying to figure out if it was built/ remodeled/ on a slab or a Mobile Home? Oftentimes I see plumbing from around the country on sites like this and wonder why in the world is it plumbed this way. In 100 year old homes I get it , different owners handy men etc trying their best to do it cheap or don't know.
I've been Plumbing new homes 33 years and never seen a lot of the ways people do things and homes that I plumbed in 87 are still kind of like new homes to me when I go in a home built in the 50s 40s I see this kind of stuff. Trying to wrap my head around a 3 inch line to kitchen without a vent? BTW are you on septic? any slow drain issues?

 

[John Q Florida]

Thanks, @Reach and @Jeff.

To answer Jeff's questions, it's an island sink, no walls anywhere for a real vent stack, and it's a house build on a slab, constructed circa 2002. I've only owned the home for a year. I do believe the plumbing (if you scroll up to the top post) was the way the builder did it though. (The, the June 8, 2009 post is my "after" picture as of that time.)

So I'm still wanting to make sure the extra bend in the dishwasher high loop is ok?

And other than the drawing being crude, this new sketch adds the Santee (not double any more) and AAV back, up over specifically the 3 inch drain. In this case, would a baffle tee be better than the santee? (it's definitely going to be a baffle tee from the horizontal from the disposal)

Also, I'm willing to bet I will need a couple elbows to position the AAV behind the cross pipe from the disposal; as it stands, I think it will be very close, whether the AAV and cross pipe would stay clear of each other.

 

[Reach4]

That works. Everybody who likes AAVs should like that.