Replaced Short Length Of 1/2" Copper With PEX. Do I Need A Ground Jumper?

[Bluegrass Picker]

Hi,
I removed a 4 foot length of 1/2" copper pipe and replaced it with PEX while installing a T for a faucet line. On the other end of that PEX there is about ten feet of 1/2" copper pipe that leads to another three foot PEX pipe that connects to a different faucet in another room. That section of existing copper pipe would be extremely difficult to remove due to walls, etc. so it had to remain in place.

I have heard stories of pin hole leaks developing in copper pipe due to not being properly grounded.

Do I need to install clamps on the copper on both ends of the PEX where the new T is and install a jumper wire along the PEX which would complete the ground between the PEX and the copper pipe? If so, what size wire?

Or is this really not an issue?

Thanks in advance,
Bluegrass Picker

 

[Reach4]

Perhaps a moderator will move this from Plumbing to Electrical. https://terrylove.com/forums/index.php?forums/electrical-forum-discussion-blog.9/

I think whether you need that jumper would depend on how your electrical panel was grounded.

Newer installs use one or more ground rods, rather than plumbing, as I understand it.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Bluegrass Picker]

Thanks for your reply.

The primary concern is prevention of pin hole leaks in that 10 foot section of copper pipe that is sandwiched between two PEX pipes. Hopefully that's not an issue, but I am very much concerned, and would appreciate it if someone would let me know that it either is or is not an issue.

Thanks

Bluegrass Picker

Edit: The pipes in question are in the basement, about six feet from the panel which is grounded with a ground rod outside the house. 1967 house construction.

Perhaps a moderator will move this from Plumbing to Electrical. https://terrylove.com/forums/index.php?forums/electrical-forum-discussion-blog.9/

I think whether you need that jumper would depend on how your electrical panel was grounded.

Newer installs use one or more ground rods, rather than plumbing, as I understand it.

 

[LLigetfa]

Newer installs use one or more ground rods, rather than plumbing, as I understand it.

Codes may vary as do inspector's expectations. Despite having two ground rods, my inspector insisted that my copper piping in the house be bonded to the electrical ground as well as the black iron gas piping. On top of that, he insisted I bond my metal well casing to the electrical ground. I'm surprised he didn't insist I also ground my aluminum soffit, fascia, and eaves-troughs.

The general idea is that if there was a short to a mains hot, that it would trip a breaker rather than provide a shock hazard.

 

[Bluegrass Picker]

I really appreciate the replies, but is there an issue that would cause pinhole leaks in the copper section between the PEX pipe?

Thanks

Codes may vary as do inspector's expectations. Despite having two ground rods, my inspector insisted that my copper piping in the house be bonded to the electrical ground as well as the black iron gas piping. On top of that, he insisted I bond my metal well casing to the electrical ground. I'm surprised he didn't insist I also ground my aluminum soffit, fascia, and eaves-troughs.

The general idea is that if there was a short to a mains hot, that it would trip a breaker rather than provide a shock hazard.

 

[Reach4]

I really appreciate the replies, but is there an issue that would cause pinhole leaks in the copper section between the PEX pipe?

I never heard of that. Where did you get that? If you took the existing copper out because of pinhole leaks, I would worry, but I would be looking into the corrosivity of the water. But you did not swap out the copper because of such leaks.

That said, I am neither a plumber nor an electrician.

 

[Jadnashua]

Bonding the pipe to ground is a safety issue, but should not affect any corrosive effects. With that stub left between two pieces of pex should not have any reaction since the pex is pretty much non-conductive.

 

[Michael Young]

I really appreciate the replies, but is there an issue that would cause pinhole leaks in the copper section between the PEX pipe?

Thanks

No. the PEX will also function as a dielectric. You'll be fine. But if you're comfortable with PEX and you own the home, re-pipe all of it a little at a time. If one piece of copper had a pinhole, then there's a pretty good chance the entire system is reaching the end of its serviceable life. Acidity in the water can make copper paper-thin where you can crush it in using just your fingertips. So if that's what's going on with your piping, replace all of it now. I'm always suspicious of the water distribution system once I start seeing pin-holes

 

[Bluegrass Picker]

Thanks to everyone for your replies.

I haven't had any leaks in the 40 years we've lived here, my concern was for prevention if needed.

I had heard that breaking the continuity of the conductors by inserting an insulator in a continuous piping system such as inserting a section of PEX in a copper piped system could somehow cause pin-hole deterioration due to improper grounding and I thought this forum would be the place to ask those who would know better than I.

It looks like I heard wrong so I won't worry about it any further. (Whew!)

Thanks to all for your help, and best regards,
Bluegrass Picker

 

[kevreh]

Going to revive this thread, I'm in the same boat. Setting aside the pinhole leak issue, is there a consensus on whether you need to install a jumper wire from the copper pipe to the fixture pipe, with pex in between? This applies to a situation where a bunch of copper was replace with pex, and the pex connected to a short piece of copper with the turn off valves under a sink, for example.

In this case, if a hot shorted against the copper pipe or valve under the sink or in the wall, couldn't there be a shock risk? Or would the water leading back to the ground copper comming into the house be enough to act as a ground?

 

[LLigetfa]

Pure water does not conduct electricity and despite how impure, certainly not enough to trip a breaker.

 

[Stuff]

Codes only state that if it is likely to be energized then it should be bonded/grounded. So up to inspector and common sense. That said, I don't know of anyone saying a stainless steel kitchen sink needs any special attention if fed with PEX.

Old codes allowed grounding of receptacles to water pipes so if your house had those then moving to PEX would be problematic.

 

[hj]

This is only my theory, but it has held up in practice over the years. I believe "residual currents" in copper lines are what causes premature failure of water heaters. When I encounter it, (in one case the top of the heater was eaten away in a straight line between the hot and cold pipes), I install ground clamps on both lines at the wall with a wire "jumper" between them. So far, the heaters I have treated this way have NOT failed prematurely. So, I would suggest, regardless of how the electrical system is grounded, that the jumpers be installed across the sections of PEX.

 

[JohnCT]

It costs little to add a couple of ground clamps and some copper braid to parallel the PEX. No down side that I'm aware of.

John