Reclaiming depth of well.

Discussion in 'Pumps and Tanks Well Forum & Blog. Water is life.' started by State of Jefferson, Jul 8, 2018.

  1. State of Jefferson

    State of Jefferson New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2018
    Location:
    Nor Cal
    I want to reclaim the original depth of my well. Original depth was 60 feet and is currently at 43. Water is currently at 22 feet. The original casing is 8 inch steel. Im affraid of airlifting such an old casing. My thought is to resleave the well with pvc while pumping out the silt thus insuring not to lose the well if something colapses . Thoughts? Are pump trucks available for this type of thing? Thinking something like a septic pump . Anyone with experiance on dropping pvc down an existing casing?
     
  2. LLigetfa

    LLigetfa DIYer, not in the trades

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    Retired
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    NW Ontario, Canada
    Even the best vacuum pump truck cannot lift more than a shallow well pump can. Static water level may be 22 feet but it won't be if you move a large volume of water. You need to bail, airlift, or use an eductor.

    An 8 inch casing would need a very high CFM compressor but you could use a two-pipe arrangement if you don't have a large enough compressor. What size PVC did you plan to line the well with and did you plan to use outside or inside couplers?
     
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  4. State of Jefferson

    State of Jefferson New Member

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    Jul 7, 2018
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    I was looking at a 5" pvc to line it with. Not sure on the coulplings but would prefer outside in order to leave more room for the pump. Im just not sure if the venturi???? Would fit down it. I would rent what I need for pressure but no one ive spoken to has lined and airlifted at the same time. For me, i believe it is a must for insurance. Ive only got one chance.
     
  5. Boycedrilling

    Boycedrilling In the Trades

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    Sep 30, 2013
    Location:
    Royal City, WA
    Why is the well depth now only 43 feet from the original 60 feet? Did the 8” casing only go to less than 43 feet and that portion has caved in? Did the casing extend past 43 feet, but has rotted out and caved in? Had material been pulled into the well with the water and has filled up the bottom 17 feet? Each of these scenarios may call for a different method. Do you have a well log or and records for this well? Don’t have enough information yet to offer you any intelligent suggestions.
     
  6. State of Jefferson

    State of Jefferson New Member

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    Jul 7, 2018
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    No well log. Well was hand drilled by my grandfather. We believe the casing is 60 feet. Over the years silt and sand has come into the well. Pump has been raised each time. We think this happens in major rain years but did get worse after the napa quake.
     
  7. State of Jefferson

    State of Jefferson New Member

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    No colapsing has occured that we know of. Just setiment and then raise pump.. Ive installed a sand seperator and baby this well.
     
  8. State of Jefferson

    State of Jefferson New Member

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    By bail I asume you mean a device to grab the silt and pull it up by hand?
    Im sorry I dont know what an eductor is?
     
  9. Reach4

    Reach4 Well-Known Member

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    Sep 25, 2013
    Location:
    IL
    Read up on using an "air lift pump" for well cleaning. Include Youtube videos.
     
  10. LLigetfa

    LLigetfa DIYer, not in the trades

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    That exact scenario happened to my 65 foot deep well. In my case the 20 feet of sand/clay silt reduced the production rate so I ended up bailing a lot of it out and then washed out the rest with an old pump once the well could produce enough GPM. I now flow restrict the new pump to keep it from motivating the sand/clay silt.
     
  11. State of Jefferson

    State of Jefferson New Member

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    Thank you.
    How did you bail it? I have this well set up now to only run 1.5 min evey twenty min. It feeds a bladder tank that bleeds off slowly into a 2600 storage tank. Basicaly the well has less demand on it than its ever had. I just want to get the silt out but am really affraid of airlifting that old casing. A neighbor and his buddies colapsed their well two years ago by doing it. So my thinking is sleeve at the same time.
     
  12. Boycedrilling

    Boycedrilling In the Trades

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    Airlifting does not work in a sand formation that won’t hold open. Neither will bailing. That’s why I asked the well construction questions. Think back to when you’ve gone to the beach and dug a hole in the sand. We’ve all done this. How deep could you dig the hole after you hit water? Only a few inches. The hole would just keep collapsing and getting wider and wider, but not any deeper. This is one of the challenges well drillers face. And have developed methods to overcome this.

    In your case it doesn’t sound like that is your problem. The sand has slowly come into the well as water was pumped. The problem is how to keep this from happening. A Lakos sand separator can be one solution. However that is after the fact. It is better to keep the sand from coming into the well in the first place. Another challenge for drillers.

    I routinely clean out up to 16” diameter wells with a 1” airline inside 3” pipe using a 180 cfm compressor. These are wells that have competent walls and will not cave in. You have 21 feet or so of water in the well above the fill. Airlifting may or may not work. Personally, I would use a sand pump bailer.

    You could use up to 6” pvc. The bells will fit inside 8” pipe. In any case I would not use smaller than 4 1/2” ID PVC. You should consider getting a pvc or stainless steel screen section. The slot size is determined by a sieve analysis of the sand you bail out of the well.
     
  13. State of Jefferson

    State of Jefferson New Member

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    I havent found any that show sleeving it at the same time. What is the smallest
    Thank you. Any recomendation on where to buy a bailer? After I drop the new Pvc , Would you recommend trying to put gravel down the sides for a filter or would that be to much ?
     
  14. Boycedrilling

    Boycedrilling In the Trades

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    Most of my bailers I have made myself, or got them with a drill rig. I don’t think I have ever bought a new one. You might be able to buy or rent one from a well driller. You would still need a way to hoist it in and out of the well. You have to be able to stroke the sand pump when it is on the bottom of the well. It has a piston inside the bailer, and will actually suck material inside it, with each stroke.

    Two reasons for gravel or sand pack. One to stabilize the smaller liner or casing. Two to filter out a sand that is too fine to be held out by the slots in the screen. It is a mechanical sizing issue. That is why I said you need to have a sieve analysis done. I am currently constructing an artificially sand packed well. The sand bearing formation is predominantly 60 mesh. I am using a 8-12 mesh sand pack and and 40 feet of 40 slot 16” screen
     
  15. Boycedrilling

    Boycedrilling In the Trades

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    The sand pack can be 4-6 times the size of the native sand. Then the screen slot size is determined by the artificial pack. Your fine sand is retained by the artificial pack, the artificial pack is retained by the screen. If your native material is course enough, no artificial sand pack is needed.
     
  16. State of Jefferson

    State of Jefferson New Member

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    Jul 7, 2018
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    Thanks man, I really do appreciate this. The drillers out here are 2years out. The well and pump companies dont care about the small personal wells, just the larger farm stuff now. Cant say I blame them its $, but i really want this done this summer.
     
  17. LLigetfa

    LLigetfa DIYer, not in the trades

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    I used an auger that I sleeved with 2 feet of 4 inch PVC that I held in place with a torque arrestor. It was attached to a long string of 3/4 inch pipe sections that I turned by hand the same way a rotary drill would. I then tripped it out to dump. Repeated it until the well recovery flow rate improved after which I just pumped it as one would developing a new well. The recovery rate was not as fast as the pump GPM at the start so I captured the outflow into a barrel and rerouted some of the water back into the well whenever the pump sucked it dry. Eventually the recovery rate improved to where I did not have to recycle any of the water and pumped it until it ran clear.
     
  18. valveman

    valveman Cary Austin Staff Member

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    Mar 15, 2006
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    Pump Controls Technician
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    Lubbock, Texas
    I would use 5" casing, as you would not be able to get much of a gravel pack between 6" casing and the 8" hole. In our area we use a .035 slotted casing and OOJ rock that looks like sand but is just larger than .035 inches.
     
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