Pump and Pressure Tank Combo or Separate Tank and Pump?

[Tim Plumbs]

Hi All,

I have just bought a small cabin (1 bathroom and a kitchen sink, all on one floor). In the basement there is a 400 volt (3 phase) floor mounted pump and a 200 liter pressure tank. It all works but the water pump leaks pretty badly. The tank is the older type with no diaphragm and looks as though it has rusted inside.

From what I have read the system is about 30 years old and although the pump could be refurbished the cost of doing this along with a new tank isn't that different from replacing with a new pump and tank.

So I have been looking at replacing pump and tank. I see two main options. The first is a pressure tank with the pump mounted on it - sold as 1 piece. The second option is a new floor mounted pump and a new tank. This second option is about 40% more expensive when I compare like for like specs and I can't see why.

Is there something I am missing? What benefit is there in a separate pump and tank that justifies the higher price? Thanks for any help!

 

[Valveman]

There is even a better option. Use a regular jet pump with a PK1A control kit like this.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Tim Plumbs]

Not sure why that is a better option. With such a small tank the pomp is going to cycle far more often ... which I thought was a bad think ... ?

 

[Valveman]

Did you not watch the video? The CSV system works so much better pump companies have blacklisted it for making pumps last longer and using smaller tanks. The CSV makes sure there is no extra water to fill the pressure tank. The water goes right past the tank to the house or sprinklers. It wouldn't matter if the tank is 1 gallon or a million gallons. People who have problems from pumps cycling on and off use a Cycle Stop Valve to solve those problems. People who start out using a Cycle Stop Valve just never experience those problems.

 

[Tim Plumbs]

Ah right! I had watched it about a week ago and didn't get it.

But do you need a specialist pump for this. All the pumps I see on the market say they pump at X litres per minute so how does the CSV change this?

The light has now dawned! However I'm in Poland (Europe) and it looks like I would have to get this shipped from the US and then try and persuade a plumber who has never seen one before to fit it. Might be the best option technically but I think I face too many practical problems to make it work

 

[Valveman]

Pumps work on a curve. They pump a of water at low pressure and very little water at high pressure. When operating at 50 PSI all the time the LPS is set at a given amount. When using a CSV the pumps sees high pressure when you need very little water and low pressure when you are using a lot of water. This keeps the pump from cycling itself to death. In the old days we just put on 2-3 times as many pressure tanks as are recommended to slow the cycling down. Adding an additional tank maybe your best option, although I would love to send a Cycle Stop Valve to Poland and hear what the plumbers there said when they see it working.

 

[Tim Plumbs]

In normal times I would say let's do it but plumbers here have work coming out of their ears so they would prefer to move along to the next customer who has a bulk standard job than try out something different. I had this before where I imported some specialist tiles from Belgium and then spent ages looking for someone who was prepared to lay them. Once they did - they were impressed - but you can't take them there in advance!

However, as I see it, a CSV can be retrofitted at any time. Is that right? In which case I might come back to you once the installation is in with photos and you can tell me what I need to order.

 

[Valveman]

In normal times I would say let's do it but plumbers here have work coming out of their ears so they would prefer to move along to the next customer who has a bulk standard job than try out something different. I had this before where I imported some specialist tiles from Belgium and then spent ages looking for someone who was prepared to lay them. Once they did - they were impressed - but you can't take them there in advance!

However, as I see it, a CSV can be retrofitted at any time. Is that right? In which case I might come back to you once the installation is in with photos and you can tell me what I need to order.

Sure you can add a CSV anytime. I like it done this way as you can see the advantages of the CSV very quickly.