Prevention of Electrocution in Weather

[Ballvalve]

A wire feed Mig/Tig welder will not even come close, when it comes to steel, and a rod in the field. Gas blows away from the nozzle, and does no good.

Stick welders have a hard time welding aluminum.

Got to have the proper shielding gas.

Rosie and Rob the welders built all those Liberty ships with 3 phase stick welders [have one from 1940 still working] look like little torpedos. Damn ships are still sailing. Out of all the thousands, only one was said to break in half in a big storm.

 

[Rich B]

I call those R2-D2's........Big 3 phase electric motor spinning a segmented commutator/armature with brushes riding the commutator...DC weld output....

Very heavy little buggers.....Anyone comes in my shop with one I tell them forget it I am not in the restoration business.
We are probably not going to be a Lincoln repair shop much longer anyway......doesn't mean a thing business wise here anymore......Welder repairs is a dead issue mostly....

 

[Sponsor]

 

[DonL]

Rosie and Rob the welders built all those Liberty ships with 3 phase stick welders [have one from 1940 still working] look like little torpedos. Damn ships are still sailing. Out of all the thousands, only one was said to break in half in a big storm.

They must have been some Big Dia. rods...


And only Eye protection...


Or did you have a space suit ?

 

[Ballvalve]

Those old torpedo's rarely die, if you dont put them in the rain and build a liberty ship, and keep the leads fresh.

But then again, mine came out of a tungsten mine, and was mostly underground for 40 years.

Without this mine, our success in WW2 would have had some doubts. Great story:

http://www.ripleysghosttowns.com/pinecreekmine.html

Its great to read they preserved the mill, because everything sold for 2 cents on the dollar. that mine made enough water to run the ENTIRE mill and a company town below. those were the good days. I did score 1 ton of THHW wire for 700 bucks!

 

[DonL]

Those old torpedo's rarely die, if you dont put them in the rain and build a liberty ship, and keep the leads fresh.

But then again, mine came out of a tungsten mine, and was mostly underground for 40 years.

Without this mine, our success in WW2 would have had some doubts. Great story:

http://www.ripleysghosttowns.com/pinecreekmine.html

Its great to read they preserved the mill, because everything sold for 2 cents on the dollar. that mine made enough water to run the ENTIRE mill and a company town below. those were the good days. I did score 1 ton of THHW wire for 700 bucks!

That is nice.

Did You work there ?

I guess tungsten has been outlawed in light bulbs. But if you want to make heat it is hard to beat.

I think tungsten was also used in arc lamps.

 

[CHOLLA BOB]

There are tungsten photographic bulbs still used.

1000 Volt rated gloves are 50 dollars at Summit Electric. Do these need a leather inner glove?
http://www.summit.com/products/category/tools-workmans-apparel-equipment.php

So if MacGyver had to improvise a dielectric mat; would a 3/4 inch thick rubber livestock flat bottomed feed trough on three 1 inch pieces of plywood do the trick for an episode? Dielectrics seem to be harder to come by and made of rubber. What makes the rubber rated dielectric?

Fiberglass seems to be a highly non-conductive material. Are there any electrician's standing on surf boards?

"Use non-conductive wood or fiberglass ladders when working near power lines." OSHA
http://www.osha.gov/SLTC/etools/construction/electrical_incidents/powerlines.html

 

[Ballvalve]

Think of tungsten alloy steel, tantaloy, and tungsten carbide; filaments did'nt win too many wars. And before we had better batteries, carbide lanterns were the only way to light your mining ambitions.

Any sort of rubber mat and the soles of my shoes do not register any ground potential with an ohmmeter. But standing on 20 tires, 3 quilts, and wearing Army korean war duck boots still won't help if one finger touches a grounded portion of the box you are in, and the other hand catches a hot line. You don't need dirt to die.

 

[CHOLLA BOB]

Face Shield, Dielectric Mat, Fire Retardant Clothing, Rated Electrician's Gloves: sounds like the rated gloves are the most important buffer from ground/hot contact.

At the main breaker box, a neutral/ground to hot shock would make a human conductor bonded? Neutral to hot would be the same effect?

The bottom line is don't hold onto the grounded steel box and go poking around with a screwdriver around the buss bar on a wet day holding onto a steel ladder.

 

[Ballvalve]

You passed our mod's first class.

 

[CHOLLA BOB]

I'm a qualified working unlicensed animal now! Spent two hours digging out stuck snowbound vehicles and now in the conduit trench surrounded by mud. Now all I need is a class on how to work with Michelin Man sized electrical gloves.

 

[Rich B]

Some very good info here on safety...

http://www.allaboutcircuits.com/vol_1/index.html

 

[JWelectric]

I'm a qualified working unlicensed animal now! Spent two hours digging out stuck snowbound vehicles and now in the conduit trench surrounded by mud. Now all I need is a class on how to work with Michelin Man sized electrical gloves.

Let's hope you are not wiring those gloves while working on the trench

 

[CHOLLA BOB]

Some very good info here on safety...

http://www.allaboutcircuits.com/vol_1/index.html

Download the pdf in the upper right hand corner and you get an entire 560 page electrical text which may raise me above trench animal level. Invaluable.

Right now just sizing up the gloves; luckily my electrician is back from vacation but unluckily the dirt road is snowbound.

jwelectric's number one rule is remove conductors before installing or removing breakers. Unfortunately, it is is demonstrated in UTUBE DIY videos how to work with wires attached, and apparently makes a better human conductor for personal shock therapy. Reason not to work with attached wires:

If the conductor delivering current to the victim faces the palm of his or her hand, this clenching action will force the hand to grasp the wire firmly, thus worsening the situation by securing excellent contact with the wire. The victim will be completely unable to let go of the wire. Pg 79 of the above PDF Chapter: PHYSIOLOGICAL EFFECTS OF ELECTRICITY

Meaning: remove wires before working on breakers.

 

[CHOLLA BOB]

I actually drove to Grainger's today and bought a pair of Voltage Rated Linesman Electric gloves (42 bucks). After reading the Salisbury pdf (as on the Electricity and Death thread) I imagined a seizing arc shock making my hound dog drool as she began to smell my heart getting well-done. Now I have a 3M Polycarbonate Face Shield; welders jacket; a rubber livestock flat bottomed bowl for standing. Still have to get some rubber boots and eventually a dielectric mat. So now I'll be able to use my favorite Harbor Freight multimeter! Fluke meter ahead, insulated screw drive, and the rest of it. Out here I have to be prepared in case I need to get something done, as it gets extreme here. Thanks for showing me some better common sense and Happy New Year!

4+ Amp Current Electric Shock: Heart Paralysis (fatal)
5+ Amp Current Electric Shock: Tissue Burning (fatal, vital organs destroyed)


http://www.salisburybyhoneywell.com...on/Case Studies/personal_electrical_shock.pdf

 

[CHOLLA BOB]

DC VERSUS HIGH AND LOW AC:

How AC affects the body depends largely on frequency. Low-frequency (50- to 60-Hz) AC is used in US (60 Hz) and European (50 Hz) households; it can be more dangerous than high-frequency AC and is 3 to 5 times more dangerous than DC of the same voltage and amperage. Low-frequency AC produces extended muscle contraction (tetany), which may freeze the hand to the current’s source, prolonging exposure. DC is most likely to cause a single convulsive contraction, which often forces the victim away from the current’s source. [1]

AC’s alternating nature has a greater tendency to throw the heart’s pacemaker neurons into a condition of fibrillation, whereas DC tends to just make the heart stand still. Once the shock current is halted, a â€frozen†heart has a better chance of regaining a normal beat pattern than a fibrillating heart. This is why â€defibrillating†equipment used by emergency medics works: the jolt of current supplied by the defibrillator unit is DC, which halts fibrillation and gives the heart a chance to recover.

Pg 79: PHYSIOLOGICAL EFFECTS OF ELECTRICITY
http://www.allaboutcircuits.com/vol_1/index.html

 

[DonL]

Very Nice...