Portable washer in rental. Need help making decision

[qkcam]

Hello
this is my first posting here . I think i have gotten myself into a quandary.
I know a very very small bit about plumbing. I was able to connect new lines to the kitchen i put in back in 2016. I live in an apartment and have a "portable" washing machine. it's not really "portable. it is pretty good size despite having a fairly small drain hose.
I have been connecting it to the kitchen sink to fill and running a long drain hose to the kitchen sink to drain.
the current drain hose is about 12 feet long. I am concerned that this might not be good for the machine over time.
I have started embarking on connecting a washing drain to the exhisiting pipe that goes to the main drain. so far so good.

i decided to keep the pipes to the back of the wall so I will have more room in the cabinet. . this created an issue with the pipe not coming being "straight" or parallel to the wall on what will be the washing room side. ( i also decided to work inside the cabinet instead of trying to pull it out from under the countertop .-not sure that was smart.) I thought it would be easy..attach the Y to drain line and the attach the other pipe and take it through the wall.

my question is.
1. if i scratch this plan and just seal up the wall will draining the washer through 12 to 15' of drain tube harm the pump?
2. does it really matter if the pipe coming out of the wall that the drain stand pipe will attach to is parallel with the wall? other than visual appearances? because when i move they will tear everything out and remodel this whole place.

I am really trying to get the easiest and most efficient way to be able to use the washing machine and get the wall back together as soon as i can. i dont have the stamina i used to for these projects. seems fun when i start but until the neck pain gets aggravated.

also I am thinking about running a hot and cold line to that room but i dont have much room in the wall to squeeze pipes through. so maybe i just use the kitchen faucet and the fill hoses for now.
I will try to attach a picture in a few mins.
thank you
I keep being hard on myself for attempting to do this but it would be so nice to have the washer all contained in one area without hoses running from room to room. It feels like I have gotten in way over my head with this. wasn't expecting to find the small galvanized water supply lines in the wall next to the drain.. was hoping to put in a nice little h/c and drain laundry box recessed into the wall..but my plans took a turn .

i am still tempted to try to run some water supply lines through the 2x4s and over to the right side wall space. is that a good idea? or should i just keep connecting it to the kitchen faucet?

in the image you can see how the drain tube has a bit of an angle. I am thinking this wont hurt anything and it is probably ok to go ahead and put on the p-trap and drain standpipe?

I will greatly appreciate any encouragement and help anyone has to offer. thank you
I appreciate any encouragement and or help available.

also attaching an image of the inside of the cabinet where I put the Y and added the drain (top ) section for the washing machine. I did a hack job on the cabinet it would have been better to take it out. . hindsite is 20/20.

 

[qkcam]

the pipe was in a good place in this photo..except I wanted the trap to be completely on the other side of the wall. whats that saying "measure 2x cut once" ? I dont know why I measure and measure and my cuts are always off. anyway.. this set up wasnt bad .. then I messed it all up. I thought it needed more of a small slope

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Terry]

There is no venting with that configuration. The trap can siphon.

The vent should be above the line to the trap, not below or it will siphon.

 

[qkcam]

this connects to the galvanized which i think is a vent? it is how the sink was configured so i just adding another line to drain the washer- the photo on the left hard to see but the lower right hand elbow screws into the big galvanized pipe inside the wall (photo on right) - I think that works as a vent? when I had the p trap connected yesterday there was water holding in the trap. the galvanized pipe vents at the top of the building i believe..but it also serves as a drain. is that possible that is drains and is a vent as well?
perhaps I just plug up the wall and go back to using the 15 ft hose to drain into the sink. the washer isn't really very "portable" although i have it on a little furniture dolly it does not very easily fit through the small door that goes into this room. thanks for the help!

 

[Terry]

Some pictures.

 

[qkcam]

these diagrams are helpful. I hooked it up yesterday before I saw this. looks like i need to cut it all out and put in a T instead of the wye. I dont have enough pipe to redo. not sure I have enough stamina. although I learned alot connecting this set up so many times. and now I am learning again.
what is worse case scenarios if i keep it as is for a while ? with the wye instead of a T and the weir is not below the top opening the wye? Was hoping to be able to start on connecting the water lines today or at least get the parts i needed. i need to get a working set up so i can take care of the medical things I need to be on top of for my health.

should i just give up and go back to running a long hose from the washer to the sink drain?
thanks for your teachings.

 

[Reach4]

It's not clear to me what this shows:

If that is the other half of a p-trap on the other side of the right wall, then you mainly risk smells. The health aspect is minor I think. I am not a plumber, so consider.

If that is the other half of a p-trap on the other side of the right wall, then you could put a santee on its back in the middle of the high horizontal pipe in your photo. Then on that, put a piece of pipe with an AAV. Even better would be to put a santee on the top of your combo, and feed the trap arm into that.

If that is not a trap on the other side of the wall, and you have your trap elsewhere, I think the main worry would be clogs building up.

 

[qkcam]

Thank you for your reply. Ok I only know a small bit about pluming thanks to my dad that taught me years ago as a kid how to connect PVC for a water line to a dark room. I will look up the items you mention AAV and Santee since I have no idea what they are. yes there is a p trap on the other side of the wall. the pipe in the lower right corner connects to the main drain and there is also a Vent pipe attached to that, I just realized when I looked again yesterday.

Also I found a small leak coming from the P trap..it is threaded and I was told I didnt need tape or Tplus 2 or a washer. perhaps i did not get the threads perfectly aligned. I think this will be an easy fix either with a washer or T plus 2

yesterday I borrowed a tool from the tool library and they mentioned how "easy" it is to work with pex .. so i will embark on this for the hot and cold water lines.
now i need to decide to use sharkbite for the 4 elbows I will need or use the little brass barbed connections with the clamp. I borrow a hand pex clamp from the tool library not sure how smooth that will go. i figure no reason to buy an expensive tool if i am using it only 1x.
this is what i got from the tool library.
https://www.amazon.com/Superior-Tool-07100-Pocket-Crimper/dp/B002RBAADC
my biggest concern is leaks! in the past 3 years i have found so much mold in this unit from water leaks. leaks /issues that were here long before i got here. some of them i have been able to correct on my own . I dont do well with mold at all..so I want to use the safest method for leak prevention. any thoughts?


here is an image with the drain and vent pipe you can almost see they are connected as you can almost see in the bottom left corner - will the vent for the main drain also work as a vent for the washer ? or does the washer need it's own vent like you suggested above?

thank you and Happy New Year!

 

[Kreemoweet]

Notice in the page Terry posted how a vent pipe is connected to the trap arms BEFORE it turns down. Any vents existing below that
point in the plumbing system are irrelevant. You'd probably want to use an Air Admittance Valve there instead of an actual vent,
because it's So Much Easier. Also, that double turn in the black pipe at the bottom of the cabinet is very improper. It uses two
tight-90 "Vent Ells", which are not allowed in drain pipes, just vent pipes that carry only air.

I don't know why you think the wye (actually it's a wye plus eighth bend, AKA "combo") fitting you used is a problem. It's not.

 

[Storm rider]

Do I understand correctly that you are living in a rental apartment? Does your landlord know that you are modifying his plumbing?

 

[qkcam]

the landlord let me redo my kitchen in 2016 due to a horrible mold issue. (probably was there with the former tenants ) it was just one area under the sink that had black mold and they didnt get anyone to take care of it. after 2 weeks I told them I was going to fix it. so i took the cabinet base out and I could still smell mold. I expressed this concern and one owner walked through with her contractor. the contractor said " we found mold in the flooring when we demo'ed the upstairs unit" I asked the owner to please redo my kitchen and increase my rent. she said " we can't do that" " you can do what ever you want to the kitchen" as i found 1 new cabinet at a time I began taking out the old cabinets each one was covered with a green fungus on the walls between cabinets. I did this in between getting monthly infusions and learning as i went along. it was hard and i was sick. I was so rashed out I was taking predisone that was my saving grace, it actually gave me energy and reduced inflammation enough I could "think" and do math in my head. my health has gotten a little better since getting that mold out. C4A went from 18000 down to 860. ! 2 years later i found another mold issue from a pipe leak in the neighbors unit. it had been a slow leak but eventually took her wall down and has created some small rot spots on the flooring underneath my bathroom. my bathroom closet floor was pretty damaged , i had to deal with that as they denied it .. so the pluming you see in the kitchen the abs was all my work. not the owners. (it took me about 3months and before each infusion i had to reconnect the pluming in the kitchen so i would have running water for a bit after the infusions) it was fun until the predisone taper then i was flat exhausted but had to find strength to finish.
and then even after denying to "fix' my kitchen they tried to increase my rent the following year.


i am glad to read the wye is not a problem. I will look into air admittance valve. although i usually keep the windows open slightly in that back room because there has been so much water damage from the rains and bad paint and window casing seals.. at times the moisture meter had given me readings of 100% on the inside of the walls of that room and even a few places in the floor. since then they have fixed the external paint and I ran a gutter extension so it no longer drains and pools at the foundation in the corner of that room. they had the window eves sealed last year ..after i complained 2 years in a row of the moisture.

i got the stuff to put in the supply lines but I am exhausted from all of the work..and my lungs are needing a rest.
i do have some questions about the structures inside the wall as i would like to put the drain into the washing machine box but have a concern about one wall being load bearing. and i am clueless about all this.

also when I move out they will rip out the kitchen, bathroom and flooring and put in new granite floors and cabinets and counter tops then raise the rent by $2000
so any work i am doing now is just temporary for the time I am here. and once i get/ if i get healthier then i can start to look at moving out of state. just wanting to get things streamline so i dont have to deal with moving that big washer back and forth and tying up the kitchen sink.
i will try to post some more photos later. i really appreciate everyones experience and support. thank you

 

[Reach4]

AAV is air admittance valve
Santee is santary tee.
Space under AAV to santee 4 inches or more usually.
Space above AAV big enough to unscrew AAV to replace.

 

[qkcam]

thank you Reach for making that so easy! ok now I have /may be changing things a bit. I took the cabinet out and I may adapt over to a regular style sink drain tube..since it was draining down the sink before just fine. ( i know it's not code but as long as i dont have any leaks (more mold) it doesnt' matter at this point.

so that abs tubing I would replace above the wye..if i have any room left to cut. and put that san-tee and AAVin then adapt over to the 1.5" tube and run it through the notch i discovered in the doubled 2x4s.

only thing is i dont know if it's ok to drill the holes in the 2x4 before the place of the washer box install. i will attach an image on the next post.

thank you!

 

[qkcam]

Here is what i would like to do .. drill drill drill. 2 small holes for the 1/2 pex. and one hole for the drain pipe or tube. If i can get away with the drain tube at 1.5" it will be alot smaller hole to put in the 2x4.
since the doubled 2x4s were already notched that kinda made things alot easier-. I removed the cabinet in the image above and put a small hole in the drywall and I have access to the mid section .

here is the image.

 

[qkcam]

just for interest and curiosity when I discovered

the leak from next door..last year or 2018.. I had been sick with bronchitis for over a month. a couple times I didnt know if i was gonna make it out of this place or not.

once i got well enough i crawled under the building and saw this water damage.. I will also include an image of what the floor looked like inside my bathroom closet.

 

[qkcam]

ok in looking at the images of the floor from 2018 I posted I am seeing / remember the floor joist are running parallel with the wall I want to put holes in for the wash box line. unless that small back room as an after market add on? the shape of the building is square except for the small rooms that come off the back end and even they are square Here is a quick drawing birds eye veiw and showing the direction of joists and back room - thanks

 

[Mliu]

It's really impossible to "visualize" what your pipes are doing based on your narrative. You need to put labels on your photos showing which pipes on one side of the wall are connected to which pipes on the other side of the wall. For example:

But let's look at the bigger picture...

Any way I view this, you've got some very serious errors in your plumbing. So much so, that I really don't think you should be undertaking this task on your own. BTW, building codes exist because not complying with the code will result in a system that either does not work properly and/or could pose serious health and safety concerns (to you and/or to others). So when you say "I know it's not code but..." then you are already going down the wrong path.

About your landlord, when she said "We can't do that" (about repairing the damage and raising the rent) I assume that's because you are living in a rent-controlled apartment and so she's prohibited from raising the rent until you move out, is that correct? Regardless, she is legally obligated to maintain and repair the apartment to keep it habitable. Leaks, mold, and fungus are NOT habitable. As a tenant, you cannot demand that she remodel the apartment to fit your desires. But you absolutely CAN and SHOULD demand that she make the apartment comply with all code requirements, which includes repairing all leaks and remediating any mold, fungus, or other problems that make the apartment uninhabitable. The law is on your side and your landlord faces serious legal repercussions if she does not properly address these problems.

On the other hand, just because the landlord said you can remodel the kitchen, or that she's going to gut the place after you move out, that doesn't mean you can do whatever you want. By performing unauthorized and unpermitted (and unskilled) modifications, you are transferring liability from the landlord to YOU. If your plumbing work results in a leak that damages the apartment, then YOU will be financially liable to repair the damage (which will probably include all the prior damage, since no one will be able to say what was caused by your leak versus what was pre-existing). I'm sure the landlord will be more than happy to put you on the hook for remodeling the apartment for her. Furthermore, if there are connected apartments and your work causes damage to those apartments, guess who will have to pay to repair those units? YOU. You will also be liable for any damage to the personal property of the tenants in those other units. And if your work results in injury or loss of life (let's say, from damaging a structural member in a load-bearing wall, or nicking an electrical wire and causing a fire), then you will not only be sued for those injuries/deaths, but you could face prison time (like the Oakland "Ghost Ship Warehouse" fire). Are you getting the picture yet?

My advice for you is to immediately cease what you are doing and hire a contractor to put things back to the way they were. Then DEMAND that your landlord fix all the outstanding issues that are making that apartment a health and safety hazard and not habitable.

 

[qkcam]

those are excellent points mliu thank you. I am not as skilled with the labels and designs.. as i have mentioned i have healht issues that limit my time /energy. so i work hard to "balance" things out.

in regards to the city and mold .. I called them and even went and talked to an inspector with photos under the house. 1. they told me they do not "test" for mold..it has to be visa-able. the areas i had mold were not visible except the one board that was under the sink at that time. this was before i knew about the other mold issues. I was trying to be "nice" and work with the owners. I did NOT DEMAND they upgrade my kitchen. I just wanted the mold out, which i could smell. and infact it was inbetween each of the rotten cabinets I had taken out.

the city does not do mold testing and since the mold was inbetween the cabinet walls there was no way the city would see it. also since the leak from neighbors bathroom ran into my place via under the building and was on the floor under the "closet board" that covered the main floor again nothing the city would/could see. when i mentioned i have rotten wood at the bathtub (from a leaking drain on a clawfoot tub/which i fixed) the city said it wasn't an issue unless i was going to fall through. with the lack of housing in the bay area and the amount of homeless tent encampments and new buildings going up, the city also is understaffed. there was a news report of a single mom with a toddler living in an apartment that had leak down her living room wall..a non working toilet a messed up front door and other issues..she filed complaints and nothing was getting done. so she or someone went to the News to report it.

I certainly do not want to cause any damage.. and if anything I have prevented damage by fixing things that were leaking and messed up before even moving the gutter extenstion so it drains away from the building instead of a lake at the base of the buliding. (another issue i reported and showed when we had the rent board hearing, the city doesnt' care)

and as far as "rent control" yes I am grateful that my rent at this point is not able to go up to $2500 which is the going rate for 700 sq foot for the other units when tenants vacate. with no parking and only 1 2 prong electrical outlet in 2 of the 3 rooms. that is not safe.

on that note I mentioned to the owners when i was running a space heater that it burnt the plug ..they said " you are not supposed to run more than 15amps through that circuit" I dont have an amp meter and i suspect most tenants do not.

so all that said. I will go back to my original question. will it harm the wash machine if i continue running the 15 ft drain hose to the sink to drain the washer? my last old washer broke a couple months ago and i got another one. i want to make sure it lasts a long time. I hope not to ruin it.. and I also hope that the drain hose does not break and make a huge leak.. that is why i was trying to put a drain on board. I got too excited thinking the washer box would be a nice fun project but sounds like i should take all the parts back and count myself lucky to have a roof over my head. the homeless camps are everywhere here and growign like crazy. I need to focuse on getting rid of things and getting well so i can find a place to move out of state. something for $600 or $800 a month rent or mortgage. .. I dont want to spend $2000 a month, and realy can't afford it. also it is a fire hazard as you mentioned. 3 of the 4 apartment have to use multiple extension cords and even in the kitchen, i cant run the microwave , fridge and stove at the same time..it only has 2 prong outlets as well.

oh and from what i read about electrical codes they are "grandfathered in" so this dangerous electrical is up to code.
you are right i dont want to get blamed for any of the shoddy work that has been done here.

upstairs we had gone through 2 sets of tenants before someone finally smelled gas,, then they found there was a cap left OFF of one of the gas lines in the "remodeled unit" thank goodness she smelled the gas - this was with the "contractors" who did the work the owners had been in the unit and even 2 groups of tenants. again counting my blessings.


also I have a hot water heater that sits directly next to my stove (no vent on my stove) 2 inches away. not something i did.

i can put the plumbing back to how it was before with the old cast iron sink and stinky cabinets.. i will get rid of those 90degree vents. thank you for pointing this out.
Question: i have had those 90 degree "vents" there since 2016 and the sink drains just fine..the reason i designed it that way was so I would have storage space inside the cabinet. I thought it was cleaver. .. what is wrong about it from a pluming perspective? just trying to learn.

and i will continue to drain /fill my washer in the sink. and i can get some money back from the hardware store!! alot actually! that laundry box although they gave me a great deal and sharkbites were expensive! easy to fix up the drywall and this makes my neck happy .

happy new year!~

 

[qkcam]

this is the best I can do for now. I am going to have to "retrain" myself how to use elements but out of time for today.

sorry for the tiny little letters. it stinks having health issues..i have to do and redo and i forget and have to keep relearning. anway thanks

 

[qkcam]

Ps even with rent control my rent has gone up 40% since I moved in 10 years ago. so "rent control" at this point keeps them from making a huge jump in rent .. they can do 10% for 3 years over a 5 year period then cycle back again to 10 % a year for no more than 3 years in a 5 year period. so I really need to focus on getting "better" and or finding a way out of the bay area into a place i can stay for the rest of my life (10 years more maybe) and ideally save money because i am probably going to have to pay to have someone help me. I am sometimes at that point anyway..where the basic everday things are not something i can do. taking on this pluming project was a "dream" idea and not a good one since it has consumed every ounce of energy i have had in the past 2 weeks, and you see i haven't even gotten very far. it will take me another 2 weeks to put the pipes back and plug up the walls(drywall) I only do a little bit each day. but taking this project on has put the rest of my life on hold.. food/ downsizing. physical therapy. last time when I pooped out and needed to finish the closet drywall it was crazy expensive. time for rest and sleep. thank you