NPE-240A: Remote Controller or NaviLink?

Discussion in 'Tankless Water Heater Forum' started by TJanak, Feb 18, 2021.

  1. TJanak

    TJanak Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Location:
    South TX
    New construction with a propane NPE-240A, dedicated (insulated) hot water loop, external recirculation mode, internal pump. The water heater is in the garage so it's roughly 80' to the farthest fixture/end of the loop.

    I want to schedule recirculation to 4:30 am to 10:30 pm. It appears the remote controller will do that just fine. The NaviLink is appealing because it claims to monitor gas usage. I've used what I think is a significant amount of propane in 2 months. If I could monitor usage more accurately with NaviLink, maybe I could adjust some of the parameters to still provide hot water recirc with less gas usage? The downside to me is the complication of WIFI and a phone app.

    Interestingly, I don't see in my operation manual anything on settings such as return line sampling or recirc differential temp that are mentioned in other threads here, though my manual is a version 5.4 Jan. 2020 and the one on the Navien website is version 5.3 May 2019.

    Opinions?
     
  2. Bannerman

    Bannerman Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2014
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    You may want to consider the Navien Hot Button accessory. Instead of scheduling continuous recirculation every day for 18 hours in case someone may be home and might want some hot water, a hot button located in each bathroom, kitchen, laundry etc will provide an easy and convenient method to activate circulation on demand such as when entering the bathroom or loading the clothes washer.

    Once activated, the pump will only operate for the brief time required to circulate hot water to the most distant fixture.

    Recirculation will not be limited to a set schedule and because each run will be brief, the demand option will provide the full benefit of recirculation while offering the most flexibility and fuel savings.

    [​IMG]

    https://www.navieninc.com/accessories/hotbutton
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2021
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  4. PlumbNuts

    PlumbNuts SC Licensed Plumbing Contractor

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  5. TJanak

    TJanak Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Location:
    South TX
    PlumbNuts, I read the manual you linked to but still didn't see anything regarding return line sampling or recirc differential temp mentioned in the other threads. Maybe I missed it.

    I've looked into the HotButton but it's not for me. I reminds me of my old 97 F-250 pickup that I sold last year. I had that truck so modified for performance that any other person would have a hard time working on it. I sold it last year and bought a used 2016 F-350 that is bone stock and plan to keep it that way. My interests have changed and moved on from tinkering on trucks to raising a family. I just need stuff to work when it's supposed to.

    The hot water recirc we have is awesome. I don't have to wait for hot water and I don't have to think about it, it just works. (That's a lie, I think about it all the time.) If I'm going to push a button and wait for the hot water to circulate, why wouldn't I just open the hot tap and wait for the hot water to arrive as we've done for years? Then I need a button at the kitchen sink, the laundry sink, etc. It begins to look like my modified F-250. I have other things to think about.

    So my thought was to eliminate recirculation 25% of the time (6 hrs) and save some propane while not changing ease of use.

    (If fossil fuel prices rise significantly over the next four years I"ll be back here asking you how to install the HotButton :D)
     
  6. Bannerman

    Bannerman Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2014
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    When entering the bathroom or preparing to wash dishes or laundry, seldom will hot water be needed immediately. If the pump is activated when someone enters the room, hot water will usually have arrived by the time it is needed.

    I know some have utilized a motion sensor to replace the button to make activation automatc. In this manner, unlike a set schedule, recirculation will only run when someone is actually present and within the room where hit water is likely to be utilized. A daily 18 hour run schedule will utilize a substantial quantity of fuel maintaining the temp of the loop when no one maybe home and even while someone maybe home but not requiring water.

    While you may plan to utilize the NaviLink App to control the circulation function, that will typically become another unconvienient task to be forgotten.
     
  7. TJanak

    TJanak Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Location:
    South TX
    I've read the operation manuals for both the Remote Controller and the NaviLink. Can anyone confirm if either device will allow you to program a different recirculation schedule for different days of the week?

    For example, 5-8 am and 5-10 pm M to F, 5 am to 10 pm Sat. and Sun.

    The manual for the Remote Controller shows three schedules programmable by time, but does not mention day of week. The manual for the NaviLink mentions absolutely nothing about programming/scheduling.
     
  8. Morgo

    Morgo New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2021
    Location:
    Georgia
    We recently had the Navien 240A installed with the NaviLink. The NaviLink was working initially but will no longer connect. Navien support informs me everything is working on my end; WiFi light is solid color and the Ethernet line is blinking. They said they do not have IT support (really?!?) but thinks it’s most likely on their end - won’t connect to their server in Korea. I’m wanting to know if anyone else is having this issue, if their server is down or what.

    Completely crazy the company sells the NaviLink but has zero support. I am unable to schedule any recirculating without the app working. Appears we paid extra for the NaviLink for no good reason. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
     
  9. Morgo

    Morgo New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2021
    Location:
    Georgia
    The app for the NaviLink allows numerous schedules per day. HOWEVER, I’m currently having connection issues (apparently to their server in Korea). I wouldn’t recommend it at this time because of this issue and they don’t offer support. Mine has been out for over 2 weeks.
     
  10. TJanak

    TJanak Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2009
    Location:
    South TX
    I installed the NaviLink several weeks ago. With the very helpful information presented on this forum, install was easy. I set up two schedules per weekday and a different one for weekends. When I was home during the day early this week I verified the heater was not recirculating when the schedule did not call for it. I haven't checked it since then but according to the app on my phone just now things look to be functioning correctly. I'm pleased with how the product is working so far. Even used it to turn off the heater when I was gone for a long weekend.

    I hate to hear that you are having connection issues. I was concerned about the lack of support issue you bring up. That is really unacceptable for a product that costs as much as this.

    I wonder if it is worth trying to delete/remove your account, uninstall the app, and start over as you are installing for the first time?
     
  11. Morgo

    Morgo New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2021
    Location:
    Georgia
    I suppose it’s worth a try. Will update this post if it works. I thought I read something somewhere to change zip code but I can’t find it again and unsure if it was regarding connectivity.
     
  12. Joe A

    Joe A New Member

    Joined:
    May 4, 2021
    Location:
    TN
    I purchased a NaviLink so I can control my 240A recirculation pump. However, I could not connect the NaviLink to my Wifi. Tech support was not helpful and could not understand why it would not connect, except to blame my wifi. My wifi is working just fine. Can anyone help with the set up to connect to home wifi? PS... the setup does not ask for my my wifi password.
     
  13. fitter30

    fitter30 Well-Known Member

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    Location:
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  14. Joe A

    Joe A New Member

    Joined:
    May 4, 2021
    Location:
    TN
    Fitter30,
    I'm thinking the NaviLink is defective and that's why it will not connect to my home wifi. Thoughts?
     
  15. Joe A

    Joe A New Member

    Joined:
    May 4, 2021
    Location:
    TN
    I received my replacement NavLink, but still cannot connect to my home WiFi. I have a Ubiquiti Router with dual band capability. Can anyone help me get connected to my router?
     
  16. Joe A

    Joe A New Member

    Joined:
    May 4, 2021
    Location:
    TN
    PS is their an NaviLink App I can download on my PC?
     
  17. Bannerman

    Bannerman Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2014
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Dual band signifies two frequencies, one operating at 2.4 Ghz and the other at 5 GHz. Because they are actually two separate systems operating within one router unit, each frequency utilizes its own unique SSID which are not necessarily the same name and one or both SSIDs may be programmed to be visible or invisible to anyone searching.

    Navilink will only operate on the 2.4 GHz band and will not work on a 5 GHz system. Perhaps the SSID you are attempting to connect the NaviLink to is actually your 5 GHz band. Perhaps the 2.4 GHz SSID is being broadcast invisibly so you are not able to see it from your devices. To determine the current settings will require accessing the router control panel through your web browser.

    The IP address for NaviLink must be dynamic so the 2.4 GHz router must have DHCP enabled.

    The NaviLink supports WEP, TKIP, and TKIP/AES authentication types. Other Wi-Fi authentication types or Wi-Fi connections compatible with non-standard Wi-Fi authentication types are not supported. If your Ubiquiti Router's authentication on the 2.4 GHz band is currently configured to a type not supported, the NaviLink will not connect.

    The NaviLink User Manual pgs 19 - 38 details how to connect WIFI using apps from Google Play or Apple App Store, but I didn't see a description for setup using a computer
     
  18. Jimbo Jones

    Jimbo Jones New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2021
    Location:
    Florida
    I have just recently installed a new unit. I had no idea had troublesome the app would be. Here is the issue. You must fist make sure that the NaviLink is enabled on your heating unit. How to access your specific unit varies. It’s hidden in the installer section. I have to enter a passcode to get into the setting on mine and activate the unit. As dumb as this sounds, after I did that, I reset the NaviLink controller by holding both buttons on the bottom right for 8 seconds. Then, pressed the one on the right to start pairing via WiFi. I have Google which works on both 5 and 2.4. It worked immediately. Prior to that, I was thinking I had a defective unit. Another simple solution is to initiate the activation by hardline then change the setting in the app. This is at the main screen, not the settings cog once you see your unit. Then the WiFi icon will be up and running. Disconnect the hardline.
     
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