No pressure building in tank

[Kris Wiggins]

I have a jet pump in a shollow 30 ft well with a bladderless tank.

Two days ago I lost all water pressure. I went to prime the pump and all the water I put in just burped and went down. I googled and found it was likely a bad foot valve. I pulled up pipe from well and installed new brass foot valve. Old one was plastic. put pipe back down reconnected pump primed and all was good until about 1pm today (24 hrs later)

Went to wash hands after my g/f took a shower and noticed no pressure. Went outside and saw 0 pressure on gauge. Pulled priming plug and had water coming out. I removed and replaced the air volume control, diapragm was busted water was coming out hole that connects to pump.

New air vol control valve installed and pump was only getting to 38PSI and couldnt go any higher. I adjusted pump cut out to around 36 PSI. Ran water spigot and verified puimp cut on t 16 psi and cut off at 36. Went inside and cut on washing machine noticed low pressure went outside and once again gauge was at 0 pulled plug added some water pump was shooting water 4\5 feet in air. Put plug back in cut off tank outlet and still no pressure.



Anyone have any ideas? I was reading some about the possibility of a waterlogged tank is that possible?

I called a retired well guy out and he wants to pull the pipe up again. (why i have no idea since I put on a new foot valve) He also mentioned that the pump wasn't flowing much (I think pushing water 3-5 feet in air isn't bad)

I'd really appreciate some advice. Times are hard and money is tight and I'm not about to pay for someone to throw parts at the problem.

 

[Kris Wiggins]

just an update went outside and pulled new air volume control valve heard a large "whoosh of air on removal. ALso when i disconnected the line to it it sprayed water everyhwere. Fired up pump and can confirm some vacuum on that line. I dont have a vac gauge to hook ot it put its at least 2 or 3 inches as you can hear it and feel it with thumb over hole. Is it possible this new air volume control valve is bad?

 

[Sponsor]

 

[bcpumpguy]

the depth to water from suction to water level corelates to inches of vacuum, the more vacuum the deeper the water level is, i would pressure test the drop pipe sounds like you have a suction leak. The whoosh of air would be a good thing you want air in your pressure tank.

 

[LLigetfa]

I think there are two or more issues here. There could be a suction leak. That could explain the whoosh of air. Sometimes a suction leak will hold pressure, particularly with PVC pipe.

The AVC could be the wrong type letting in too much air.

You could have crud in the jet from having disturbed the piping.

 

[Kris Wiggins]

I sincerely appreciate the responses.

How would I check for a suction leak on the drop pipe? For what it's worth its not losing prime.

Also I messed with it a little more since I'm an inquisitive type;

I removed the AVC from the tank and allowed the pump to fill the tank with water until it came out of the hole midway the tank where the AVC valve was. While conducting this test I hooked the vac pipe to the avc and removed the prime plug from the top of my piping. With the vac line hooked to the AVC pump output increased. It took around 10-15 minutes for the tank to become half full. (I'm guessing its a 60 gallon tank so I'd say the pump is doing around 3 GPM)

I'm going to go to another hardware store tomorrow to pick up another AVC valve. Possibly a smaller one as well. I'm using a Brady AV100 same as been on pump before which is supposedly good for tanks from 12-120 gallon. The hardware store I purchased this valve from is notorious for old parts and non working parts. I have had brand new pressure switches from this place to be bad.

So I will rise early and swap out that AVC and post on what I find. If anyone has more thoughts or ideas please post.

Edit: also I applied compressed air to the vacuum line and it improved the vacuum with pump running. I also notice that when the pump is cut off water backfeeds out that vacuum line, is this normal?

 

[LLigetfa]

If you have plastic threaded into the pump intake, it's not unusual for it to develop a suction leak after the pump overheats. I've heard the shaving foam can help detect a suction leak but I have never tried it. A small leak won't cause a loss of prime.

I'm not following what you are doing with the vac line when it is not connected to the AVC.

 

[Kris Wiggins]

I've got twosections of pipe in the well a 90 degree fitting and a two inch piece of pipe goin into a coupler that then goes into the pump. From top of drop pipe to pump is all new there is a metal reducer from pump to pvc then drop pipe. I sanded all connections and used the wet dry pvc glue also used teflon tape where pvc fitting goes into reducer on pump. I will try shaving cream.

I removed the vacuum line to make sure there was vacuum and to blow compressed air in to unclog possible jet clog. I'm fairly sure jet is clear as I do have vacuum and with water in tank and pump off water sprays back out of vacuum line.

 

[bcpumpguy]

Have never heard of the shaving cream trick, however if you have a small compressor, put it on the system build up a good aircharge and let it sit for an hour. if the pressure goes down you have a leak. Best would to isolate the pump and suction line from everything else as that would be your primary concern. Suction leaks can be nasty sometimes they will not show up on a pressure test. I would reccomend going up to around 60~70 psi.

 

[LLigetfa]

I would start by taking the AVC out of the equation. Plug the vacuum line. If there is not a schrader valve on the tank, install one so that you can manually add or remove air.

If there is a large enough suction leak, you should hear the sound of cavitation in the pump. The air level in the tank would also increase.

If the pump moves water but cannot build enough pressure, it could be a clogged jet. I doubt you can take the easy route and just blast air into the vacuum line.

If the pressure drops to 0, it could be crud under the diaphragm of the pressure switch keeping it from closing intermittently.

 

[Masterpumpman]

The AVC's were great in their day. . . but most have been replace with the new technology bladder tanks which don't need an AVC. I'd plug the AVC line at the pump and see what happens? I suspect you also have a leak in the line between the pump and the check valve!