Boiler problems, system help..

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Siber303

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I just noticed the hot water is not getting as hot as it normally does.. I'm worried something is going on .. it is also our main heating source radiant baseboard heat. We live in Colorado so need to fix asap..
I took a look at the furnace, it is firing up and seems to be working fine.. besides clicking a lot before and after firing up. But I looked at guage and there is no p.s.i. Is the circulator pump bad or do I need to bleed the system? I'm not sure the guage is working. Getting good hot water just not a shot as it was upstairs.. the pump has been making some noise.. Any help appreciated!
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Dana

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A bit of terminology: "Furnace" for most of the US is reserved for ducted hot air systems. What you have is a hydronic boiler (as distinct from a steam boiler.)

If the pressure is as low as indicated on the gauge there is probably a bit of sizzle pop & bang "kettling" at the beginning of a burn cycle. Could that be what is meant by "...clicking a lot..."??

There may or may not be air in the system needing to be bled, but the solution to low pressure is adding more water to the system. Most are plumbed with an "auto fill" valve, sometimes called a "pressure reducing valve" between the potable plumbing and the system. Those types of valves automatically add water until the system pressure reaches their pre-set adjusted level. Usually in-line with the auto-fill is a valve for isolating it completely from the potable water plumbing (necessary for serviceing the heating system). If the isolating valve is closed, the auto-fill can't do it's job, and if there are any leaks in the system, even tiny leaks, the pressure will drop over time.

If it's a mulit-story house with the boiler in the basement, and the pressure drops too far, the top of the system could be at negative pressure relative to the room air pressure, which can introduce air into that zone, which would limit and eventually stop flow in that loop.

So, first order of business is to check the pressure at the boiler, and raise it if need be. There is usually a drain port valve with a regular garden hose type connection either on the boiler or on the near-boiler plumbing. A cheap $10 hose pressure gauge is good enough for sanity-checking the boiler's gauge. For the really cheap gauges the first unmarked tick is usually 10 psi, and the system pressure needs to be above that tick to limit the kettling, but unless it's a particularly tall house it doesn't usually need to be over 15psi to reliably get the water to the top of the system under positive pressure. So shoot for somewhere in the middle, between 10-20psi. Keep it well UNDER 20psi, or there's a chance of overpressure tripping the pressure relief valve at the middle or end of a burn cycle. (Most boilers are shipped with 30psi relief valves.)

Ideally the expansion tank will have been preset to something like 12-15 psi, but we'll address that later, after you've fixed any pressure or flow issues. If the pressure relief isn't opening up and dumping hot water out of the system, it's probably "close enough", but it's good to check the preset on bladder type expansion tanks at least once every handful of years.
 

Siber303

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A bit of terminology: "Furnace" for most of the US is reserved for ducted hot air systems. What you have is a hydronic boiler (as distinct from a steam boiler.)

If the pressure is as low as indicated on the gauge there is probably a bit of sizzle pop & bang "kettling" at the beginning of a burn cycle. Could that be what is meant by "...clicking a lot..."??

There may or may not be air in the system needing to be bled, but the solution to low pressure is adding more water to the system. Most are plumbed with an "auto fill" valve, sometimes called a "pressure reducing valve" between the potable plumbing and the system. Those types of valves automatically add water until the system pressure reaches their pre-set adjusted level. Usually in-line with the auto-fill is a valve for isolating it completely from the potable water plumbing (necessary for serviceing the heating system). If the isolating valve is closed, the auto-fill can't do it's job, and if there are any leaks in the system, even tiny leaks, the pressure will drop over time.

If it's a mulit-story house with the boiler in the basement, and the pressure drops too far, the top of the system could be at negative pressure relative to the room air pressure, which can introduce air into that zone, which would limit and eventually stop flow in that loop.

So, first order of business is to check the pressure at the boiler, and raise it if need be. There is usually a drain port valve with a regular garden hose type connection either on the boiler or on the near-boiler plumbing. A cheap $10 hose pressure gauge is good enough for sanity-checking the boiler's gauge. For the really cheap gauges the first unmarked tick is usually 10 psi, and the system pressure needs to be above that tick to limit the kettling, but unless it's a particularly tall house it doesn't usually need to be over 15psi to reliably get the water to the top of the system under positive pressure. So shoot for somewhere in the middle, between 10-20psi. Keep it well UNDER 20psi, or there's a chance of overpressure tripping the pressure relief valve at the middle or end of a burn cycle. (Most boilers are shipped with 30psi relief valves.)

Ideally the expansion tank will have been preset to something like 12-15 psi, but we'll address that later, after you've fixed any pressure or flow issues. If the pressure relief isn't opening up and dumping hot water out of the system, it's probably "close enough", but it's good to check the preset on bladder type expansion tanks at least once every handful of years.

Thanks Dana.. new to boiler system..
So here is the update I woke up to no heat or hot water.. looks like the burners are not lighting now.. I added a little water to boiler and got the psi back up to 15.. bleed the systems for air.. still won't fire up.. thought maybe a sensor or something? The igniter lights the pilot..then the burner lights up then shuts off right away.. continues to try to light .. then just runs with no burners going.. any ideas to check?
 

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Siber303

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Well I think I fixed it.. cleaned the flame sensor and boiler fired up.. now I'm just waiting for water to get hot.. I have a boiler mate.. is this like a holding tank? Also have a pressure tank? Can anyone explain how these work with the boiler system. Does it take a while for faucet water to get hot.. the baseboards got warm pretty quick..
 

Jadnashua

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Most all boilers have a safety interlock that will not allow it to operate if the pressure is too low - on this type of boiler, that could allow it to turn to steam. Boilermate makes a bunch of what is called an indirect water heater...essentially, hot water from the boiler goes into the boilermate's heat exchanger, and that heats the potable water that then goes to your hot water distribution for sinks, shower, etc. That tank will take awhile to heat up from cold. Depending on how your boiler is setup, the indirect may get priority, and if it does, it would get heated before the rooms would, so it sounds like that's not the case on your setup. It could be configured to do that, though.
 

Dana

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Well I think I fixed it.. cleaned the flame sensor and boiler fired up.. now I'm just waiting for water to get hot.. I have a boiler mate.. is this like a holding tank? Also have a pressure tank? Can anyone explain how these work with the boiler system. Does it take a while for faucet water to get hot.. the baseboards got warm pretty quick..

"Boilermate" is the trademark for one manufacturer's line of indirect fired water heaters, which is where your potable hot water is stored. It is usually but not always operated as a "priority zone", so that when the indirect is calling for heat the zone controller suppresses calls for heat from the space heating zones, and will only start heat the house after the stored potable hot water reaches temp. If after the boiler was out of commission for many hours or a few days, your baseboards are getting warm quickly and the potable hot water is still on the tepid side, it's not zoned for priority.
 
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