Need help with plan of attack on filtration/softening/smell eradication of well water

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schwim

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Hello there, everyone!

First, allow me to apologize for what will be a very long and drawn out first post. I have to summarize the last three years of effort in trying to tame the water we've got in a house we purchased. To keep interested parties reading, my goal is to learn what changes need to be made, what systems need to be added and what cartridges I need to be running to have water that we can drink.

This is a home on a two acre lot supplied by a private well in coastal Virginia(Gloucester) that we purchased in 2021. On the night of our arrival, this is what we brushed our teeth in:

Screenshot 2024-11-18 at 16-18-58 Imgur The magic of the Internet.png

The next morning, I went under the house to find a settling tank, a pressure tank with a failed bladder and a string wound filter. There was nothing else serving the house system. We immediately replaced the pressure tank and swapped out the filter then I began researching filtration solutions. After a ton of reading, I settled on an Aquasana system with two cartridge filters, two main tanks for smell and softening and a UV filter. This setup cost me $2,500. I built a filter house outside of the main structure and moved the waterheater from the laundry into it and plumbed in the filter system. From left to right(direction of flow), the system is:

Settling tank ~> 10 micron sediment ~> pressure tank ~> 5 micron filter ~> carbon smell ~> softener ~> 1 micron post filter ~> UV ~> powered anode rod in WH

Hk5SeSVuSiqRGLSOp539yQ.jpg

In less than one year, the two tanks were completely packed with mud in spite of 2(!) prefilters ahead of them running down to 5 micron filtration. To replace these tanks, the cost would exceed $2,000 after shipping is said and done. I decided to scrap the system and plumb in a row of 3 4.5x20 catridge filters.

ak9kMWNIQ46auZGn9PajGw.jpg

I have 5 micron carbon, 1 micron string wound and .5 micron carbon filters coming from Amazon. I was planning on continuing to run a 10 micron at the filter ahead of the pressure tank. While I'm waiting for them, we are dealing with atrocious water. This brings me up to current events. Over the last three years, we have called the well drillers out to see if we could drill a new well but was told this particular area provides this quality of well. He said they could put a sock of some sort at the end of the well pipe but that it often clogged which required them to remove it. I have done hours and hours of research and reading on many forums(often this one) and have spoken to quite a few local plumbers. The consensus is that the quality of water is trash and the filtration suggestions were whatever they happened to sell.

Which leaves me with the following questions that I've yet to answer for myself.

1) Regarding the 4 4.5x20 cartridge filters and my water issue(mud, smell, desire to have drinkable water), what 4 cartridges would you suggest and in what order?

2) I read on this site that the carbon cartridge filters were too small to effect smell because the water needed more contact with the carbon than a catridge would provide. Would multiple carbon filters suffice?

3) I never want to buy a filter or tank that I have to exchange so I've been looking at tanks that can backflush. For smell, I've found US water systems carbon/peroxide system but it's 3,500$. Is there something less expensive that can do the job and isn't a one-and-done type of system?

4) I'm also considering a salt-based softener for the hard water complaints from my long-haired family members. Is there a system better than the softeners than you buy at the big box stores?

I have a ton of questions but feel I've already made this a bit too rambly and don't want to make more issues than can be discussed so I'm going to leave it at this for now. Any suggestions or insight you can provide in improving my water would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for your time!
 

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Stephen Walker

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Mud in your filter? idk if I was told right. But I had a well service company come out and they treated my well and ran the well straight to the outside for over an hour. No more mud.

bad smelling water. Does it stink when you run water into a cup? Does the smell go away after sitting? My in-laws had that problem and some sort of cheap air injection fixed it.

Better than salt treatment? According to the dealer im talking to. The less you have to treat the water; the less sodium in your tap. So iron filter with birm or other media that also treat mag and sulfur.
 

Reach4

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You want to get a lab water test to test for levels of iron, manganese, hardness, pH

4) I'm also considering a salt-based softener for the hard water complaints from my long-haired family members. Is there a system better than the softeners than you buy at the big box stores?
Yes. Knowing your hardness, iron will help with this. But usually you would be better with a softener with a separate brine tank.

1) Regarding the 4 4.5x20 cartridge filters and my water issue(mud, smell, desire to have drinkable water), what 4 cartridges would you suggest and in what order?
Hmmm.
a. 4.5" x 20" Pleated Filter Cartridge 50 Micron washable. Get at least two, and alternate.
b. undecided.
c. DGD-5005-20 Pentek Whole PENTEK-DGD-5005-20
d. dunno

Have extra o-rings on hand, because if you cannot get the old o-ring back in, your water system is down.

Get Molykote 111 AKA Dow Corning 111 Valve Lubricant and Sealant to very lightly coat the o-rings-- new or re-used. I wear nitrile gloves to apply the 111.
Get a filter wrench, if you don't have one.
 

schwim

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bad smelling water. Does it stink when you run water into a cup? Does the smell go away after sitting? My in-laws had that problem and some sort of cheap air injection fixed it.
I would be interested in the details of the air injection you're thinking of. No solution like that I've found comes in at under a grand.
You want to get a lab water test to test for levels of iron, manganese, hardness, pH
I've ordered a lab test and will share the results when I get them.

Thanks very much for the help!
 

schwim

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I'm still waiting on the test kit to arrive but since I had to do something, my current filter setup is

1 micron stringwound
5 micron CTO carbon
1 micron CTO carbon
.5 micron Pentair FloPlus carbon

Although it seems counterintuitive to put the 1 micron up front, the stringwound filters are the cheapest of the bunch and I'm hoping to make the more expensive filters last a while. I can swap out the string filters as needed.

I flushed everything, settling tank, HWH, bladder, took all the aerators out and flushed every leg of the system and all tanks and fixtures. Tonight's shower was absolutely fantastic and the sinks and toilets are clean. Pressure is also great, which I was worried about. We'll see how it lasts.

Once I see what the water test results are, I think I'll have a good idea concerning my next step.
 

schwim

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As an update, I'm still waiting on results but the water situation seems to have settled into the mud being gone but the water goes from clear to orange when exposed to air. This seems to denote ferric iron in the water. I've been looking into air injection systems and have found quite a few, I'm just trying to sort out which are of better quality.

I'm waiting on the test results to see how many ppm I'm needing to filter but if anyone has any suggestions on iron/sulfer air injection filters that don't rival the cost of a used car, I'd be greatly appreciative.
 

MaxBlack

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As an update, I'm still waiting on results but the water situation seems to have settled into the mud being gone but the water goes from clear to orange when exposed to air. This seems to denote ferric iron in the water. I've been looking into air injection systems and have found quite a few, I'm just trying to sort out which are of better quality.

I'm waiting on the test results to see how many ppm I'm needing to filter but if anyone has any suggestions on iron/sulfer air injection filters that don't rival the cost of a used car, I'd be greatly appreciative.
Dunno your weather there but in Texas we had a 705ft deep well with stinky water and what worked was to use the submersible pump to spray water into a 1000gal polyurethane tank above ground, and then use a shallow well pump to draw from it and pressurize the house.

Possibly not an option for you but since I did all the plumbing/electrical myself the system was <$1000
 

Bannerman

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the water goes from clear to orange when exposed to air. This seems to denote ferric iron in the water.
While remaining clear, the iron will be in a ferrous state, which is the most common state of iron in well water. Because ferrous iron is fully dissolved in the water, it can't be simply filtered out using sediment filtration media.

When ferrous iron is exposed to air, the oxygen in the air will slowly oxidize the ferrous iron, converting it to a ferric state which will often cause the water to become orange, and the resulting larger solid particles to precipitate out from the water as rust. Ferric iron maybe easily removed.by filtration, but the filtration media often recommended will be Katalox Light as that media will oxidize ferrous iron, so the remaining K-L media can filter out the resulting ferric solids. To eliminate the rust debris from the KL media, will require regular ongoing periodic backwashing cycles.

Depending on the amount of iron and other water conditions, often, an additional oxidizer such as air, chlorine, hydrogen peroxide or ozone will be added before the KL media, to supplement oxidation to more effectively reduce the amount of ferrous iron and/or manganese prior to the KL media.

Spraying the inflow into the top of a cistern as MaxBlack suggested, will increase air exposure with the smaller water droplets which will assist with oxidation, but the cistern should then be equipped with a means to easily and regularly remove the resulting rust/manganese sediment that will accumulate at the bottom of the cistern.
 
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schwim

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Thank you all very much for your help, I greatly appreciate it!

Your system should come in well under $18000

I must shop at a different store. I bought my last daily driver for $2,500 :)

Depending on the amount of iron and other water conditions, often, an additional oxidizer such as air, chlorine, hydrogen peroxide or ozone will be added before the KL media, to supplement oxidation to more effectively reduce the amount of ferrous iron and/or manganese prior to the KL media.

I think I understand what you mean for the most part. I found a page on the US Water Systems page that compares their oxygen and Hydrogen Peroxide systems and it seems that using hydrogen peroxide doubles the PPM that can be removed (20ppm vs. 10ppm). I think as soon as I have my test results, I'll have a better idea regarding which type of system I'm in need of.

Does anyone have any experience with US Water Systems? If so, what do you think of them?
 

schwim

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I've got my results and unfortunately, I'm more confused about my plan of attack than before I got them. I'll attach a PDF of the results but also a screenshot for quick viewing. The tester notes turbidity, orange color and egg smell but at the same time, the results seem to show little if any levels causing it, if I'm understanding the results correctly.

Can someone please help me figure out my next step in filtration? Should I be looking at an air injection for iron/sulfer or do I need to go in a different direction?

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Reach4

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The nose is the best test for H2S for most people.

The iron level is very high. When you treat for iron, and have a lot of iron as you have, that can take care of the arsenic. So a media like Katalox Light works that way.

Don't let your well water spray on the house or concreted if you want to avoid rust stains.

For lead, while zero is the target, the action level is 15 ppb which is 0.015 ppm. https://www.myutility.us/sunshinewa...ad-service-lines/about-lead-in-drinking-water

The peroxide injection followed by a contact/settling tank should also take care of the H2S. Ideally the contact tank would have a blow off port that lets you eject sediment.

H2S is often helped with a good sanitizing of the plumbing and well.... but for how long? Varies. I think it lasts longer if you kill off more SRB (sulfur reducing bacteria). The SRB can get some of their food from the anode in the water heater. Aluminum+zinc is less helpful to the SRB, but a powered anode is even better. I think a longer powered anode probe is better than a stubby anode. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sulfate-reducing_microorganism
https://terrylove.com/forums/index....izing-extra-attention-to-4-inch-casing.65845/

I don't have a firm prescription.
 

schwim

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The nose is the best test for H2S for most people.

The iron level is very high. When you treat for iron, and have a lot of iron as you have, that can take care of the arsenic. So a media like Katalox Light works that way.

Don't let your well water spray on the house or concreted if you want to avoid rust stains.

For lead, while zero is the target, the action level is 15 ppb which is 0.015 ppm. https://www.myutility.us/sunshinewa...ad-service-lines/about-lead-in-drinking-water

The peroxide injection followed by a contact/settling tank should also take care of the H2S. Ideally the contact tank would have a blow off port that lets you eject sediment.

H2S is often helped with a good sanitizing of the plumbing and well.... but for how long? Varies. I think it lasts longer if you kill off more SRB (sulfur reducing bacteria). The SRB can get some of their food from the anode in the water heater. Aluminum+zinc is less helpful to the SRB, but a powered anode is even better. I think a longer powered anode probe is better than a stubby anode. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sulfate-reducing_microorganism
https://terrylove.com/forums/index....izing-extra-attention-to-4-inch-casing.65845/

I don't have a firm prescription.
Thank you for taking the time to help. Would this system have what you would suggest in regards to media type, PPM it handles as well as the port you suggested?

 

Bannerman

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Carbon is not an iron reduction media.

Katalox Light is an effective and excellent iron, manganese and H2S reduction media.

Katalox Light will also indirectly reduce arsenic through adsorption to the ferric hydroxide particles created during iron removal (aka: co-precipitation).

With the substantial amount of iron and manganese in your water, supplementary oxidation will likely be required prior to the KL media filter. While hydrogen peroxide is an excellent oxidizer, when there is any type of bacteria present, chlorine is usually recommended for oxidization and to also ensure the bacteria will be rapidly neutralized. Since hydrogen peroxide rapidly breaks down into water and oxygen, the resulting oxygen can cause any remaining active bacteria to quickly multiply, potentially resulting in a larger bacteria issue.

To ensure effective bacteria control, the chlorine dose rate should result in some residual chlorine remaining when the water exits from the KL filter system. That residual chlorine can then be removed by a carbon media filtration system after the KL system.

When arsenic is a concern, often a secondary arsenic specific media will be utilized for redundancy and near complete removal, followed by a softener to improve the water quality.
 

Reach4

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Thank you for taking the time to help. Would this system have what you would suggest in regards to media type, PPM it handles as well as the port you suggested?
It might be OK, but I would be a bit uneasy with that Chinese valve. I am also uneasy that there is not contact/settling tank.

I guess the plan is that the tank contains GAC, and that both mechanically filters out the sediment, and also removes the residual H2O2.
 
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