Need Help Programming Softener/Filter and Setup?

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TxHr

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Hello All,

We built our house recently and had a softener/whole home carbon filter installed. We initially tried using Potassium at the recommendation of the salesperson, but after consulting the forum we have switched to salt. I know all of my softener settings are wrong and I would prefer to start from scratch Please see specs for system, house and water quality below:


Water quality:

16 grains hardness

330 sodium

0 iron

7.9 ph

580 ppm TDS



House specs:

Current four people with the fifth on the way (softener was sized to accommodate). Currently we use around 60 gal/day per person.



Setup:

Fleck 7000SXT

48000 Grain Mid Plate Vortex Water Conditioner with13x65 Mid Plate Vortech Tank

1.5 Cu Ft High Capacity 10% Cross Linked Resin

1.5 Cu Ft High Activity Carbon

18x33 Polyethylene Brine Tank with Safety Cut-Off, Bypass, 1" Tail Pieces.

Trojan Max E4, 1" UV light


BFLC sticker shows: .5 GPM


I would also take any recommendations for salt brand/pellet size



Thanks in advance,

Brandon
 

Reach4

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System info (not programmed)
salt lb/cuft : 6 ; A choice ( efficiency vs capacity)
BLFC : 0.5 ; Brine Refill rate GPM
cubic ft resin : 1.5 ; Same as (nominal grains/32,000)
Raw hardness : 17.0 ; including iron etc
Estimated gal/day : 300.0 ; 60 gal per person typical calc
Estimated days each regen : 5.9 ; presuming days each use reserve capacity
Fleck 7000SXT Settings:
DF = Gal ; Units
VT = dF2b ; Downflw/Upflw, Double Backwash dFFF=brine first
CT = Fd ; Meter Delayed regen trigger
C = 30.0 ; capacity in 1000 grains
H = 17 ; Hardness grains after compensation
RS = cr ; Cr = base reserve on recent experience
CR = 0 ; 0 is default (leave it)
DO = 28 ; Day Override (typ 28 if no iron/Mn)
RT = 2:00 ; Regen time (default 2 AM)
B1 = 8 ; Backwash 1 (minutes)
Bd = 60 ; Brine draw minutes
B2 = 5 ; Backwash 2 (minutes)
RR = 10 ; Rapid Rinse minutes
BF = 6 ; Brine fill minutes
FM = [record what it says] ; t1.2 is default flow meter

Note: I wonder how they size the backwash, which is set by the DLFC. For a softener in a 13 inch diameter tank, the setting would usually be 4 GPM. For GAC, the flow rate would normally be considerably higher.

I like the Morton System Saver salt pellets. I like that it comes with a bit of additives. Diamond and others are similar. They are actually cheaper than solar salt here. In some places solar salt is cheaper. In that case I might switch, but I think the pellets have lower residual.

With RS = cr , the reserve is calculated based on experience. The reserve amount may start off pessimistic, but it will adjust. With this automatic setting, the Estimated gal/day is only used as a predictor of the estimated days between each regeneration.
 
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Joe777

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Hello All,

We built our house recently and had a softener/whole home carbon filter installed. We initially tried using Potassium at the recommendation of the salesperson, but after consulting the forum we have switched to salt. I know all of my softener settings are wrong and I would prefer to start from scratch Please see specs for system, house and water quality below:


Water quality:

16 grains hardness

330 sodium

0 iron

7.9 ph

580 ppm TDS



House specs:

Current four people with the fifth on the way (softener was sized to accommodate). Currently we use around 60 gal/day per person.



Setup:

Fleck 7000SXT

48000 Grain Mid Plate Vortex Water Conditioner with13x65 Mid Plate Vortech Tank

1.5 Cu Ft High Capacity 10% Cross Linked Resin

1.5 Cu Ft High Activity Carbon

18x33 Polyethylene Brine Tank with Safety Cut-Off, Bypass, 1" Tail Pieces.

Trojan Max E4, 1" UV light


BFLC sticker shows: .5 GPM


I would also take any recommendations for salt brand/pellet size



Thanks in advance,

Brandon

Hello Brandon,

We bought the same unit from Aplus Water LLC at https://www.greatwatersofteners.com/ and they walked me through the programming over the phone.

So basically just set the current time of day to 12:01Pm by holding either the up or down button in to move the time of day and then tap regen button once 12:01Pm is displayed.

Then immediately hold down up and down button at the same time until screen displays DF Gal.

All you need to change is
1. the C-24 to C-48 (because you have a 48,000 grain capacity unit)

2. set the hardness H-20 to H-16.

p.s. use the regen button (shaped like a diamond to toggle to each step).

3. tap regen button until you are back to the time of day.

Thanks
Joe

Just realized that you said they put the carbon in the same tank. My Fleck 7000 system was softener only and carbon filter was separate unit. I'd double check with the company you bought it from to program correctly. We were going to buy a vortech tank from another company but we saw quite a few reviews where the riser tube was popping out months and sometimes years after installation and flooding homes with resin and or carbon.
 

Reach4

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All you need to change is
1. the C-24 to C-48 (because you have a 48,000 grain capacity unit)
You don't want to use the nominal 48 capacity number, because you will want to choose a more salt-efficient setting. Below are some choices. You normally want to choose one of the C and BF pairs that are in bold.
The less salt per cubic ft, the more salt efficient, but more hardness breakthrough. The sweet area is in bold.

BLFC = 0.5
cubic ft resin = 1.5
lb/cuft ; C= ; BF=
4 ; 22.8 ; 4
5 ; 27.3 ; 5
6 ; 30.0 ; 6
7 ; 33.1 ; 7
8 ; 36.0 ; 8
9 ; 38.5 ; 9
10 ; 40.5 ; 10
11 ; 42.0 ; 11
12 ; 43.1 ; 12
13 ; 43.9 ; 13
14 ; 44.6 ; 14
15 ; 45.0 ; 15
 

ditttohead

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Joe, thanks for the advertising, as to setting a 48,000 grain system, this is a rating based on the maximum salt use. Please be careful offering advice when you are not aware of how the systems actually work. There are several people on this forum who have exceptional knowledge on programming, system design, and years of field experience. All input is appreciated if it is helpful and accurate. Please feel free to ask questions and I am sure we will be able to help.

FYI, a 48,000 grain softener is typically a 1.5 cubic foot softener. The capacity setting would be based on the amount of salt the system is programmed to use per regeneration. Lower salt settings will give you higher salt efficiency, lower water efficiency and lower quality soft water (more hardness leakage). Higher salt settings will yield lower salt efficiency, higher water efficiency, and high quality soft water (less hardness leakage).


The hardness setting is set to "compensated" hardness. Typically below 20 grains you would add 10% to the actual hardness to compensate for competing ions for the softeners exchange capacity. Set the hardness to 18 GPG and test the raw water hardness regularly.
 

TxHr

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I programmed my system using the info above and at 500 gal remaining, my hard water has returned. I’m afraid my hardness is greater than the initial test. Would someone please recommend a test kit?


Thanks,

Brandon
 

Bannerman

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The recommended test for hardness is the Hach 5B Total Hardness Test Kit.

What capacity, brine fill setting did you program?

While the hardness could be higher than you first specified, the BLFC rate could also be not the same as stated on the label.
 

TxHr

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Thanks for the reply. I started with the 6/30 and migrated to the 8/36. The 6/30 didn’t feel right. It seemed as if we were getting too much hard water coming through, so I opted to go the 8/36. How can I check to see if the BLFC is correct?


Thanks again,

Brandon
 

Bannerman

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6/30 and migrated to the 8/36
It appears as you may have misunderstood as the settings specified, would be inadequate.

The '6' refers to pounds of salt PER CUFT of resin. As you operate a 1.5 cuft system, that will need a 9 lb salt setting to restore (regenerate) 30,000 grains of usable capacity. Your 8/36 setting should be 12 lbs to regenerate 36K grains of capacity.

If your BLFC is 0.5 gpm, then for a 9 lb setting, the BF time needs to be programmed as 6 minutes, and for 12 lbs, the BF time needs to be 8 minutes.
 

Reach4

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It appears as you may have misunderstood as the settings specified, would be inadequate.

The '6' refers to pounds of salt PER CUFT of resin. As you operate a 1.5 cuft system, that will need a 9 lb salt setting to restore (regenerate) 30,000 grains of usable capacity. Your 8/36 setting should be 12 lbs to regenerate 36K grains of capacity.

If your BLFC is 0.5 gpm, then for a 9 lb setting, the BF time needs to be programmed as 6 minutes, and for 12 lbs, the BF time needs to be 8 minutes.
The '6' refers to pounds of salt PER CUFT of resin.
Yes, but in this case, 6 can also refer to BF=6.
 

Bannerman

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Yes, but in this case, 6 can also refer to BF=6.
True, as in this case, the salt lbs/cuft and fill time numbers are interchangeable, unlike that which would occur with an alternate BLFC rate.

Since your chart was written in the manner it was, he may not have appreciated the salt dose rate specified is lbs per cuft whereas the capacity specified is the total for all 1.5 cuft. As I can't know for certain which numbers he is referring to, I anticipated TxHr specified your chart's initial numbers when I replied to offer clarification.
 

TxHr

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Good Evening Guys,

Thanks for all of your help. You are correct, I did misunderstand the numbers. I was thinking those were the numbers I needed to program into my system. Currently, this is how my system is programmed:

Fleck 7000SXT Settings:
DF = Gal ; Units
VT = dF2b ; Downflw/Upflw, Double Backwash dFFF=brine first
CT = Fd ; Meter Delayed regen trigger
C = 36.0 ; capacity in 1000 grains
H = 18 ; Hardness grains after compensation
RS = cr ; Cr = base reserve on recent experience
CR = 0 ; 0 is default (leave it)
DO = 28 ; Day Override (typ 28 if no iron/Mn)
RT = 2:00 ; Regen time (default 2 AM)
B1 = 8 ; Backwash 1 (minutes)
Bd = 60 ; Brine draw minutes
B2 = 5 ; Backwash 2 (minutes)
RR = 10 ; Rapid Rinse minutes
BF = 8 ; Brine fill minutes
FM = t1.2

Please keep in mind there is a 1.5 cu ft carbon filter in the top portion of the tank. I wasn’t sure if the settings need to be programmed to accommodate.

Would you please tell me what I should program into each field as to not mess anything up??


Thanks again,

Brandon
 
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Reach4

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I was thinking those were the numbers I needed to program into my system.
They were, but making assumptions about H, and presuming the BLFC is actually 0.5 gpm. See #2 on https://terrylove.com/forums/index.php?threads/programming-a-fleck-7000-and-sanitizing.47960/ but in your case expect a 50 if you decide to look.

I suspect your initial display number was 1700, and by 500, you were already out of softening. I am thinking your initial display number maybe should be about 1000. That would imply H= 28 or 29. I would go with 29 for now. I would leave the other settings as is. When you get your Hach 5-b kit, there does need to be some compensation added to the H that you enter above the tested hardness; multiply the measured hardness by 1.2 to get the H value for your hardness range.
 
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TxHr

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Hello Again,

Thanks again for all of your help. I read the link you provided and I went out to my softener and verified the BLFC, it is .5. I have attached a pic of the BLFC, injector, spec sticker that is on the valve along with the spec sheet from my initial order, outlining the setup.



Thanks again,

Brandon


7E9E7BB3-DF97-4284-B74F-D8EA02E5345F.jpeg
8A39C06D-E9F7-48E8-BEBA-AC57A2A0B69D.jpeg
6FB7D01F-65F8-40C3-8DAC-BA1B985A61E0.jpeg
A029C51D-D718-44C3-8BE8-04259CC0FD07.jpeg
 

Reach4

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The injector is indeed a #2.

For a 13 inch tank, a softener would usually use a 4 gpm DLFC rather than a 3.5. Its close. For backwash, it is the cross sectional area that matters, and not the amount of media.

A 13 inch carbon tank would usually use a higher DLFC than 4.

Would going to a 4 gpm DLFC be worthwhile? Higher? I don't know. If your well water is cold, you might be fine as is.
 

TxHr

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So it appears the red #0 is recommended for 12”-13” diameter tanks. The blue is recommended for 18” diameter tanks. Is there any reason to make a switch? Also, do I need to change for DLFC?

I should have my Hatch kit by Wednesday. I’ll give an update to hardness once I receive it.


Thanks again,

Brandon
 

Reach4

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So it appears the red #0 is recommended for 12”-13” diameter tanks. The blue is recommended for 18” diameter tanks.
I think the injector is chosen to have the brine deposited in about 20 minutes, to match up with a 60 minute BD setting. If the injector takes much more, the BD is expanded to about 4x the time to actually draw the brine. I tend to overthink this, and I may be missing some factors. I am not a pro. With 8 pounds per cubic ft of salt (12 pounds) I would opt for a red #0, drawing about 0.23 gpm, and set BD=80. A #1 white would be a good choice too, and would not call for an expanded BD time. #2 is probably a pretty typical choice, because it would also be suitable for the less efficient salt doses. #2 blue draws about 0.5gpm. Worth changing at this point? I don't know.

DLFC-wise, I don't know either. Any idea how cold your water coming in is? A shallow well in Houston is going to have warmer water than a deep well in Amarillo. Yet if you said your incoming water is 60F, I don't know whether I would seek out a 4 gpm or 5 gpm DLFC. I tend to think 5 due to the GAC, but I would research further. Maybe I would stick with the 3.5 that came with the unit.
 

TxHr

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Well it appears I have found one of the issues, my hardness is 40 GPG.

My setup is as follows:
Fleck 7000SXT
BLFC - .5 GPM
DLFC - 3.5 GPM
Injector - 2 (light blue)

13x65 mid plate Vortex tank
48,000 grain mid plate tank
1.5 cu ft high cap 10% cross linked resin
1.5 cu ft active carbon

18x33 brine tank

I live in Cenral Texas so more often than not my water is on the warmer side.

Would like recommendations on programming based on the above info:

Fleck 7000SXT Settings:
DF =
VT =
CT =
C =
H =
RS =
CR =
DO =
RT =
B1 =
Bd =
B2 =
RR =
BF =
FM =

Please keep in mind, the single tank is housing the softener and carbon filter, so settings will need to accommodate both. Thanks in advance for your help.


Brandon
 

Reach4

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That hardness test result explains it.

System info (not programmed)
salt lb/cuft : 8 ; A choice ( efficiency vs capacity)
BLFC : 0.5 ; Brine Refill rate GPM
cubic ft resin : 1.5 ; Same as (nominal grains/32,000)
Raw hardness : 40.0 ; including iron etc
Estimated gal/day : 300.0 ; 60 gal per person typical calc
Estimated days each regen : 2.5 ; presuming days each use reserve capacity
Fleck 7000SXT Settings:
DF = Gal ; Units
VT = dF2b ; Downflw/Upflw, Double Backwash
CT = Fd ; Meter Delayed regen trigger
C = 36.0 ; capacity in 1000 grains
H = 48 ; Hardness grains after compensation
RS = cr ; Cr = base reserve on recent experience
CR = 0 ; 0 is default (leave it)
DO = 28 ; Day Override (typ 28 if no iron/Mn)
RT = 2:00 ; Regen time (default 2 AM)
B1 = 8 ; Backwash 1 (minutes)
Bd = 60 ; Brine draw minutes
B2 = 5 ; Backwash 2 (minutes)
RR = 10 ; Rapid Rinse minutes
BF = 8 ; Brine fill minutes
FM = t1.2 (usual) ; t1.2 is default flow meter

Note: Hardness compensated up by 1.2 factor and what I called pessimist factor discussed on
https://terrylove.com/forums/index....0-sxt-programming-settings.60651/#post-450189
 

TxHr

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Thanks for the info. I’m confused why a capacity of 36 would be selected when the system is 48?
 
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