Mysterious yellow tinted water??

[wsjp]

Hello all, I have a 10x54 Vortech midplate resin tank with a 760/268 autotrol controller on city water. The Mrs. said that the water has not been soft for awhile, and honestly by the time I got round to it, it had been several months. When the unit regenerated it started to overflow the brine tank. I figured this out by watching the mineral tank regeneration cycle flowing water into the brine tank, causing the leak! It turned out to be a bad flapper valve inside the autotrol. I went ahead and rebuilt the valve, replaced the black rubber check balls inside, the plugs and the flapper valves. I cycled the unit to check for proper operation and was excited to have soft water again! Went inside the house and ran some water to wash up and noticed after a bit that the water was turning a yellowish brown tint :-( Bypassed the unit and checked the water again - it returned to clear water. I figured I had kicked up a bunch of sediment in the mineral tank, so I cycled the valve again through an entire regeneration. I also emptied out as much water from the brine tank, taking with it as much of the brown water and dirt as possible. When the valve started to draw water from the brine tank, I ran a hose and washed down the sides and let it refill the brine to help draw clean water with the salt into the mineral tank. I did this 3 times today and I still have yellowish-brown discolored water. I left a glass of this to sit overnight and did not see anything solid settle to the bottom. I am thinking maybe the gold colored resin have started to breakdown? The unit is about 8 years old. I read about iron, but I doubt that is an issue on city water.

Does anyone know of a way to service the vortech tank? Is it the resin that has broken down? Should I just get a new regular tank and pass on solving the mystery of yellow water?
Thanks in advance!

 

[Reach4]

10x54 Vortech midplate resin tank

A midplate tank has two separated medias. I don't know how you service this. I am not a pro, and I have not seen a Vortech tank.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[wsjp]

I took a sample of the dirty water and let it sit since Sunday. It honestly looks like dirt. What's the best way of cleaning the system?
(I took some photos, but the website wouldn't allow flickr hosting?)

 

[Bannerman]

Although a 10' X 54" tank will be appropriate for 1.5 ft3 softening resin, you mention it is a midplate Vortech tank. This suggests a 2nd media in addition to the softening resin, each separated by a divider screen. The amount of media will typically include 1 ft3 resin in the bottom section and a filtration media such as 0.5 ft3 of activated carbon in the upper section. If your system does have carbon installed, 8 years is too long and it is likely the carbon has began to breakdown and is the cause of the discoloration.

 

[wsjp]

Very possible. I was thinking of getting some iron out to see if the sediment that settled is excess iron before having to replace the entire unit.

 

[Bannerman]

Why would you replace an 8 year old unit if only the carbon media (you haven't confirmed this actually exsists) only needs to be replaced?

 

[wsjp]

The unit does have carbon media in the top chamber I believe and resin in the bottom. To answer your question Bannerman, I haven't found any resources on how to replace the media and resin on a unit like this so I am thinking that 8 years on chlorinated city water maybe close to the lifespan of the unit. If you are aware of how to service this type of tank, please explain. Thank you.

 

[Bannerman]

With the carbon properly located in the top chamber, the carbon will have been removing chlorine from the incoming water before the water flowed into the lower chamber containing the softening resin.

Constant chlorine exposure will reduce the lifespan of softening resin. As you went to the additional expense of a premium Enpress Vortech tank, I anticipate the softening resin is likely also good quality so without the chlorine, the resin lifespan may exceed 20 years.

By removing the Autotrol control valve from the top of the tank (un-thread from tank), the chamber directly below should contain the carbon media. The old carbon maybe syphoned out using a garden hose, with a 2nd garden hose supplying water down the center riser tube to maintain syphon flow. Alternately, a wet/dry shop vac adapted with a length of smaller diameter hose could be used. A 24" length of 3/4" PVC or similar ridged pipe on the end of the syphon/vacuum hose will act as a wand through the tank opening.

I anticipate the carbon quantity will be 0.5 ft3. Granular Activated Carbon (GAC) will be sufficient for plain chlorine removal but premium Catalytic Carbon maybe utilized instead. Catalytic Carbon is required to remove chloramine (chlorine and ammonia) which many municipalities have been adopting, but as chloramine is more stubborn to remove, a larger quantity than 0.5 ft3 of CC is usually required.

Carbon when new will contain many fines and fractured pieces that will need to be rinsed away prior to use. It is recommended to manually advance the unit to BackWash and also remove the power plug to allow an extended backwash rinse for at least 30 minutes. Because carbon is very porous, the air initially trapped in those pores will cause the carbon to float until fully saturated with water. Suggest after adding the new carbon and reinstalling the top screen and control valve, fill the tank with water and allow the carbon to soak for 2-days before rinsing the new media.

The link below provides details on carbon media start-up.

https://view.publitas.com/impact-water-products/2018-catalog-final/page/36

 

[wsjp]

Constant chlorine exposure will reduce the lifespan of softening resin. As you went to the additional expense of a premium Enpress Vortech tank, I anticipate the softening resin is likely also good quality so without the chlorine, the resin lifespan may exceed 20 years.

From the invoice I can tell you this: "1/2 Cu Ft High Activity Carbon, 1 Cu Ft 8% cross linked High Capacity Resin"
I doubt that it was catalytic carbon and we do switch to chloramines for half the year.

Do you think this is caused by the charcoal or should I still try the "iron out" cleaner? Is there any info on getting the resin out of the lower chamber that you can provide? The photos are linked below, couldn't inline them for some reason.

https://flic.kr/p/2m3r8ed
https://flic.kr/p/2m3pyGL
https://flic.kr/p/2m3gZ8y

 

[Bannerman]

To me, that appears to be carbon that is breaking down and discoloring the wster. As it has been inplace 8 years, suggest replacing every 4-5 years for improved effectiveness and to prevent breakdown.

The exsisting will be plain GAC. I mentioned CC anticipating you finding CC and asking if that maybe utilized. If your town is periodically utilizing chloramine, catalytic carbon would be more effective.

Perhaps your town may have been testing the effectiveness of chloramine, with plans to adopt its use full time. You may want to consider a seperate backwashing filter containg 1.5+ ft3 CC prior to the softener.

Water softening resin that becones chlorine damaged, often will swell and become mushy, which will usually cause a reduction of flow through the resin bed.

I'm not aware of the proceedure required to replace the resin in the section below the Vortech midplate. Perhaps Ditttohead maybe able to provide some insight.

 

[wsjp]

This muni has been using chloramines on a 6 month on/off cycle for years. Not sure why they switch, but they do every spring. I appreciate the info I will look into a source of CC. I dont think there has been much of a reduction in flow over the last 8 years. I am going to test the sludge to see if it is magnetic, if it is not I will vacuum out the old carbon, flush the system and see if that resolves the issue before buying more carbon.

Edit: Sludge is not magnetic

 

[Bannerman]

PM sent

 

[wsjp]

Got around to vacuuming out the carbon from the tank. Reassembly did not go so well. I am not sure if the phenolic valve split a seam when the system was repressurizing, but I used new washers for the autotrol bypass valve and for some reason one side kept leaking. I took it apart and reseated 5x without any luck - this included moving the tank around to get a good position. I removed the entire valve and took it outside in the bright sun for inspection, but did not see anything split. I have a fine mist squirting out of the top rear for the flange that seals towards the mineral tank. I did have some water hammer upon the first time refilling and that is when the leak started (forgot to open a tap in the house somewhere :-( SMH ).
I ordered a new valve and washers, when they come in, hopefully I can get this unit refilled and backwashed to see if the color issue resolves. The carbon that came out was, from my inspection ok - somewhat coarse, cubic granules.

 

[WorthFlorida]

A regen with Iron Out definitely needs to be performed. Since the softener wasn't being regen'ed, the media was all used up. The first regen after the fix and if you used a salt with Iron Out in it (System Saver, etc.), you maybe seeing some of it as iron oxide. After a regen with Iron Out, run the cold water at the bathtub, once it clears then run the hot water to flush out the water heater. It may take some time.

 

[wsjp]

Got new valve installed yesterday and did a backwash for about 20 minutes. Everything cleared up and soft water returned with no issue. I will order the gac and be done with it for now. Thanks all!