Looking for recommendation for standard height Toto toilet

Discussion in 'Toilet Forum discussions' started by CorwinOfAmber, Aug 29, 2018.

  1. CorwinOfAmber

    CorwinOfAmber New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2018
    Location:
    Mississauga, Ontario
    As the subject says, I'm looking for recommendation for standard height Toto toilet.
    That is, an old-fashioned "lower" height toilet, as my wife prefers those over what the taller toilets I understand are now called ADA, comfort height or even universal height.
    I would like it also to be elongated and have the Sanagloss finish (or is it called CeFiONtect now?)

    I'm now also trying to decide between the G-Max and E-Max (and possibly Tornado flush)
    Based on reading the last few pages in this forum, I'm beginning to think that
    a) the Tornado flush is only available on the II models
    b) all of the II models are the taller comfort height (and the Tornado flush might require this for performance)
    Is that correct?
    If so, what are my options then?
    Is it basically an elongated Drake I with Sanagloss and standard height (with either G-Max or E-Max)?
    (I'm not sure if the UltraMax I is any different or better than the Drake I)

    Thanks in advance for any advice.
     
  2. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2004
    Occupation:
    Plumber
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    The Drake does have an elongated bowl with the better finish under the "G" in the model numbers.
    CST744EG is 1.28
    CST744SG is 1.60

    Standard height elongated that works very well. I have sold a ton of these, same as the Ultramax but in a two-piece.
    In the Ultramax it would be the MS854114EG in 1.28
     
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  4. wjcandee

    wjcandee Wise One

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2012
    Location:
    New York, NY
    We have two Original Drakes (GMax Flush) and one Toto with the Tornado flush and CeFionTect.

    The Drakes work great! The Tornado is cool, but what's important is that both flushes rarely result in clogs, and only when we pile waaaaay too much Charmin Ultra in the bowl. The GMax cleans the bowl acceptably, even well. If you get the CeFionTect versions, the will be even cleaner than ours, which are just the regular version, which works fine.

    After a few years, we still love them all!
     
  5. CorwinOfAmber

    CorwinOfAmber New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2018
    Location:
    Mississauga, Ontario
    A few more clarifications, if possible:
    Based on Terry's reply. the UltraMax is the same as the Drake except it comes in one piece vs two and only with E-Max.
    So, the obvious question would be why i would pick UltraMax over Drake.

    Is the only advantage of the one piece a cleaner look and easier to clean?
    A disadvantage would be that it is heavier to lug up the stairs, but that is a one-time expense.

    Also, what is the consensus of G-Max vs E-Max? Equivalent in performance and rim cleaning?

    Do both the UltraMax and Drake come with the soft-close seat automatically, or are they "bundled" together?

    Finally, is the price comparable, or is the UltraMax positioned at a slightly higher level due to it being one piece?
     
  6. Reach4

    Reach4 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2013
    Location:
    IL
    For Toto, 1 piece normally comes with a seat, and 2-piece does not.

    For 2-piece, consider a Bemis soft close "lift off" seat.

    One piece costs more, partly due to the seat, but mainly for the increased complexity.

    One piece does not have to be assembled by you. One piece is heavier up the stairs etc, as you point out.

    One piece is higher status.
     
  7. wjcandee

    wjcandee Wise One

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2012
    Location:
    New York, NY
    The consensus on GMax vs Emax is that EMax is almost-unnoticeable to most people. This is particularly so now, because the bowl used is always a 1.28 bowl, regardless of amount dispensed by the tank. So...in the old days, the 1.6 might have had just a smidge-larger water spot, but now they are the same, since they use the same bowl, and the water spot size is fixed, and is determined by the design of the bowl. Most people can't tell the difference, and they both work well. If you have a particularly-large amount of stuff in the bowl, you can always hold the handle down one time to make sure it all goes down on the first flush, but can rest assured that 1.28gpf is enough to take care of basically-everything.

    The major difference between the Original Ultramax (as opposed to the II) and the Drake is aesthetic. We have a Carlyle II, which is like a skirted Ultramax II, and it looks very nice. But it was only for aesthetic reasons that we chose it over just getting another Original Drake for that Master Bedroom.

    Just as an aside, while Toto seems to have conquered the difference between 1.6 and 1.28, the fact is that the 1.0G (or 1G) toilets are pushing the limits, at least as to the expectations of most people. The folks who buy 1Gs are doing so because environmental issues and conservation are top of their list, and they are willing to suffer some inconvenience to save water. Going into the transaction with that mindset, they are surprised and amazed at "how well" the 1G toilets work on so little water. And Toto has done a great job producing a toilet that works viably on 1G. But it ain't the same as a 1.28 or 1.6, where that extra quart makes a meaningful difference in bowl wash. In choosing between washing the bowl and making the stuff go down on the 1G, Toto chose to use enough water to make sure the stuff went down, so the bowl wash suffers a bit. However, it does a surprisingly-good job, just not as much as people have probably come to expect with a "regular" toilet. So the Eco-Warriors LOVE the 1G, but regular folks might not be as pleased (although many still really don't notice at all, interestingly-enough).
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2018
  8. CorwinOfAmber

    CorwinOfAmber New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2018
    Location:
    Mississauga, Ontario
    Thanks to all for the very good advice.
    The Bemis "lift-off" seat looks like a good idea for the Drake -it makes it easier to keep a 2 piece clean.
    I didn't know that the newer toilets use the same bowl, whether they are 1.6 or 1.28. That alleviates some doubt I might have had about going with the UltraMax's performance.
    In either case, I'll go with the CeFiONtect, as that seems to be a no-brainer.
    I'll let you all know how I make out.
     
  9. CorwinOfAmber

    CorwinOfAmber New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2018
    Location:
    Mississauga, Ontario
    Based on some recent searches, it appears that there is still a GMax version of the UltraMax for sale?
    Using Toto's naming convention - that would be MS854114SG
    So, I still think I have 4 choices between the Drake and the UltraMax; each version can have either GMax or EMax.
    Is MS854114SG still available in general?
     
  10. Reach4

    Reach4 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2013
    Location:
    IL
    CorwinOfAmber likes this.
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