Kitchen outlets allowed with top outlet on one 20-amp circuit, bottom outlet on other circuit?

[Robert Gift]

2000-built house has kitchen outlets on two seperate 20-amp breakers.
For her big party wife plugged two high-draw cooking appliances into one outlet.
Thinking it may be too much draw, I plugged one appliance into another outlet.
But it was not as convenient for her.

From the unfinshed basement I could easily make the top outlet on one circuit, bottom outlet on the other circuit.

Bad idea because I could create a 240-volt potential in the same outlet?

Thank you.

 

[Reach4]

Outlets on different legs together not a real problem from safety point of view IMO. They each are only 120 volt to ground, and shocks are normally going to be to ground. A child could theoretically stick in two metal things into the hots of two adjacent hot slots simultaneously, but that is very unlikely.

IMO, 4-inch boxes are better IMO. Very functional. Avoids splitter adapters. I have changed out some existing 2-inch boxes for 4-inch.

Two circuits can have separate neutrals, or can share a neutral. If shared, you need the breaker handles tied together so that somebody would turn off both together to do work. That would call for the breakers to be side-by-side. They would trip independently.

Breakers serving kitchen counter outlets should be AFCI+GFCI.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Robert Gift]

Outlets on different legs together not a real problem from safety point of view IMO. They each are only 120 volt to ground, and shocks are normally going to be to ground. A child could theoretically stick in two metal things into the hots of two adjacent hot slots simultaneously, but that is very unlikely.
IMO, 4-inch boxes are better IMO. Very functional. Avoids splitter adapters. I have changed out some existing 2-inch boxes for 4-inch.
Two circuits can have separate neutrals, or can share a neutral. If shared, you need the breaker handles tied together so that somebody would turn off both together to do work. That would call for the breakers to be side-by-side. They would trip independently.
Breakers serving kitchen counter outlets should be AFCI+GFCI.

Thank you.
Previous owners had a hotub on the back porch. I converted its 240V box to two 120V duplex outlets.
Wife would not like 4-outlet boxes. She prefers the typical separate duplex outlets.
Does electrical code allow 2 different 20-amp circuits connected to one duplex outlet?
Top outlet on one 20-amp circuit - bottom outlet on the other?
They are GFCI protected.
Thank you for advice tying the 20-amp circuit breaker handles together.

 

[Reach4]

Wife would not like 4 outlet boxes. She prefers the typical separate duplex outlets.

She would prefer not leaving counter top appliances plugged in, maybe. Electric can opener, for example. The Push and Pull of Aesthetics vs. Functionality https://www.archisoup.com/form-follows-function

Does electrical code allow 2 different 20-amp circuits connected to one outlet?
Top outlet on one 20-amp circuit - bottom outlet on the other?

Yes.

 

[wwhitney]

If multiple circuits serve a single device (e.g. a duplex receptacle), then those circuits must also be handle-tied, even if the neutral is not shared.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Reach4]

If multiple circuits serve a single device (e.g. a duplex receptacle), then those circuits must also be handle-tied, even if the neutral is not shared.

Dang. Sounds weird to me.

 

[wwhitney]

Sounds weird to me.

It's a similar safety concern: you want to work on the device, you think you've identified the circuit supplying it and shut it off, but it's still dangerous as there is actually a second circuit supplying it. Handle tying those two circuits together is to force the user to turn them both off at once.

But if the handle-tie requirement is complied with, what the OP proposes is fine.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Reach4]

If two duplex outlets in a 4-inch box, then you think no handle tie needed?

If adding new boxes, consider putting in a 4 inch box with a 1-gang mud ring.

That lets you easily switch to 2-gang in the future, but you have 1 gang-aesthetics until you make the change.

 

[wwhitney]

If two duplex outlets in a 4-inch box, then you think no handle tie needed?

If each duplex is supplied by only one circuit, correct.

2017 NEC 210.7 "Where two or more branch circuits supply devices or equipment on the same yoke or mounting strap, a means to simultaneously disconnect the ungrounded supply conductors shall be provided at the point at which the branch circuits originate."

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Robert Gift]

The top outlet would be powered from one 20-amp breaker. The bottom outlet powered through another 20-amp breaker.
The danger is that the potential from adjacent circuit breakers in the panel is 240 Volts.
Unless I separate the circuit breakers to be connected to the same "phase".
But how can separated circuit breakers be tied together and on the same phase?

Wife wants her Chinese cooking appliances plugged into the same [:] even though they can total well over 20 amps.

 

[wwhitney]

The top outlet would be powered from one 20-amp breaker. The bottom outlet powered through another 20-amp breaker.
The danger is that the potential from adjacent circuit breakers in the panel is 240 Volts.

That's not a significant danger for the user of the receptacle in the split wired receptacle.

Unless I separate the circuit breakers to be connected to the same "phase".
But how can separated circuit breakers be tied together and on the same phase?

If you really wanted to for some reason, there may be length 3 handle ties.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Reach4]

There is only one phase in a split phase 120/240 system, as we use. I suggest to use the "same leg" because they are both on the same single phase.

The top outlet would be powered from one 20-amp breaker. The bottom outlet powered through another 20-amp breaker.
The danger is that the potential from adjacent circuit breakers in the panel is 240 Volts.

And how will you tie the two handles together?

If you were to somehow screw two tools into two hot slots on opposite legs to grab, the GFCI would trip as long as you were not using a 2-pole breaker..

They are not required to be tied together.

Doesn't that contradict your statement in #5?

 

[wwhitney]

If you were to somehow screw two tools into two hot slots on opposite legs to grab, the GFCI would trip as long as you were not using a 2-pole breaker..

Only if you are sharing a neutral for the split-hot duplex. You could break both tabs on the duplex and have a split-hot and split neutral duplex and run two separate circuits to the receptacle. In that case each circuit could be GFCI protected individually via the breaker or an upstream receptacle.

Doesn't that contradict your statement in #5?

Yes, responded too quickly, thanks.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Robert Gift]

The circuit-breaker labels have faded over 25 years. Using the cordless telephone, Youqing and I wilhave to "ring out" what wire goes where and I label it outside at the service entrance.
(Manyears ago I did "ringing out" on an old pipe organ's cables. Each cable contained 52? cotton?-insulated conductors all the same color. Organ builders would find which conductors were which by touching a door bell wire to each conductor.) (Today such cables are being replaced due to their fire hazard, I believe.)

 

[bigb56]

In Canada split wired counter top receptacles on 15 amp circuits used to be required and are still allowed, although newer CEC allows dedicated 20 amp circuits just like NEC.