Is this ferrous iron or iron bacteria? Does it create wispies if allowed to settle?

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Dis360

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I posted a related topic here focused around large amounts of clay and cloudy water, this new post is focused around the cloudy water:
https://terrylove.com/forums/index....down-but-clogs-immediately.92497/#post-666920


I want to better understand what is in my water as I am stumped. For starters I purchased my home about a year ago and the well pump was replaced about a year before that, there has always been staining in toilets bowls and the washing machine agitator, not really anywhere else, I don't know if that's clay or iron or something else. I have sanitized my well twice over the past 12 months and do regular water tests with strips.

In addition to the staining another issue is occurring, and this is my primary concern. If I fill up a container with water, it's crystal clear nothing at all, when this water sits for 24 hours+ it will become hazy and develop this at the bottom. They clump together and are wispy and float around.

PXL_20210216_202953253.jpg


** same bottle on the left ( 24 hours old), middle is 12 hours old and right is sealed bottled water
PXL_20210216_202930706.jpg


To get a better idea of what is in my water here is a quick video:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1_CZIvAnRrPnd6X00jPFdLZl6tM9bHHcI/view?usp=sharing

What I'm confused by this the fact that all my water tests show no iron in the water, zero. Is that even what ferrous iron does? If not is that iron bacteria and if so, why does the test say there is none? Is it something else entirely? Are my test strips garbage?

** tested this morning
PXL_20210218_154157926.jpg



Any help would be apricated, is there anything other tests (besides a lab) I can do to narrow it down? On hand I have chlorine, bromine and 2 different metal chelating agents.

I am going to do a test, my refrigerator water filter seems to have some type of membrane or small micron filter, I am going to fill up a bottle and let it sit and see if it develops the same haziness and wispies at the bottom, I don't think it will, just from past experience, if it ends up staying clear then maybe this isn't dissolved iron in the water?


Daniel
 
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FruitfulPanda

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I'm just an amateur with iron and iron bacteria issues but everyone is going to tell you to get a lab test done. The test strips are too hard to read and can be inaccurate in general. For example your total chlorine and nitrate result doesn't even appear to be on the scale, also the scale says 0.3 ppm of iron is OK and although that's the EPA limit which is probably what this is based on, it's enough to cause staining.

I'll say from my past experience with iron bacteria if it is iron bacteria you may be able to get it taken care of by shocking or having a well company shock your well. I had a pump replacement in the fall and the old pump was absolutely covered in orange with iron bacteria so they shocked it. I don't appear to have iron bacteria anymore but I do have iron because my water softener is fouled inside from years of iron bacteria so my iron problem is currently worse than before as I'm bypassing the softener which had been removing the iron.

Also if it is iron bacteria the most noticeable place to see it is inside your toilet tank. Not sure setting in a glass is enough time for it to show. The bottom of mine were red and slimy. I believe the slime over time is a key indicator of iron bacteria.
 

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I'm just an amateur with iron and iron bacteria issues but everyone is going to tell you to get a lab test done. The test strips are too hard to read and can be inaccurate in general. For example your total chlorine and nitrate result doesn't even appear to be on the scale, also the scale says 0.3 ppm of iron is OK and although that's the EPA limit which is probably what this is based on, it's enough to cause staining.

I'll say from my past experience with iron bacteria if it is iron bacteria you may be able to get it taken care of by shocking or having a well company shock your well. I had a pump replacement in the fall and the old pump was absolutely covered in orange with iron bacteria so they shocked it. I don't appear to have iron bacteria anymore but I do have iron because my water softener is fouled inside from years of iron bacteria so my iron problem is currently worse than before as I'm bypassing the softener which had been removing the iron.

Also if it is iron bacteria the most noticeable place to see it is inside your toilet tank. Not sure setting in a glass is enough time for it to show. The bottom of mine were red and slimy. I believe the slime over time is a key indicator of iron bacteria.
if you let sit for 24 hours does it settle in the bottom. if not it may be tannins.
 

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if you let sit for 24 hours does it settle in the bottom. if not it may be tannins.

I never really considered tannins as I just immediately suspected iron from the red staining and the test showing iron, plus no real flavor issues with the raw water, which I hadn't tasted until recently, and it sounds like tannins make water noticeably horrible. A water softener guy tasted it so I did. Pretty much just tastes of iron and tested for 2 ppm, ferrous since it was clear. What iron is in the water definitely settles after that long. Since the replacement of the pump the water comes out clearer than ever.
 

Dis360

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When I moved into my house I did notice a lot of red/brown, slimy, wispy, stringy stuff floating in the back of the toilets, it was a lot. In addition I learned that the well pump was replaced about 1.5 years prior to moving in. After doing some research I determined this must be iron bacteria and shocked the well with well safe (chlorine tablets & powder). I also installed a UV filter thinking it would kill bacteria, including iron bacteria (don't know if that's true).

2021-02-19 11_16_07-Window.jpg

That seemed to get rid of any future production of red/brown slime in the back of the toilets and I have since shocked the well again, about 5 months later.

I also did a different, more expensive test strip test, one dedicated for iron and other containments before shocking the well a second time. So it's possible my tests aren't accurate enough, but I still don't know if ferrous iron even turns water hazy and leaves those white/brown clumps in the bottom of sitting water.

IMG_20200811_222342.jpg


At this point I'm left with some staining on white surfaces, like toilet bowls, washer agitator and this issue with hazy water with weird white/light brown clumps in the bottom only if the water is allowed to sit for 24+ hours.

This is the inside of the first filter pod and that stuff doesn't wash off.
PXL_20210217_051819968.jpg
 

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What size is your casing? https://terrylove.com/forums/index....izing-extra-attention-to-4-inch-casing.65845/ is my sanitizing writeup for bottom-feeding wells. Pellets have the advantage that they can fall to the bottom if there is enough space between the well casing/sides and the pump.

Still, I think the lowering of pH and the flooding volume have a lot of effect on sanitizing effectiveness. Click Inbox, above.
 

ditttohead

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You are your own municipality, you need to get a real water test done by a lab. It is definitely worth doing this every few years and especially when you first move in. A real water test will give the proper information we need to design a proper system. Without it we are simply guessing and throwing equipment at it.

NTLWATERTEST

Use this link and look for well standard.
 

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I'm confused. you said no iron in the water..zero, then changed to 2 ppm. if it swirls around in the bottle it's collodial clay.
 

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I'm confused. you said no iron in the water..zero, then changed to 2 ppm. if it swirls around in the bottle it's collodial clay.

I don't want to hijack the thread but I should have been more clear, sorry about that. I haven't observed settling in the water since I've had the softener bypassed in the past month or so, although I haven't really looked either. At least a glass sitting overnight looks the same. Some glasses are stained red at the bottom slightly and that seems to be from when I was still using the water passing through the iron/iron bacteria fouled softener. The untreated water did most recently test at 2ppm but it was not visible in the water at all.
 

Dis360

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What size is your casing? https://terrylove.com/forums/index....izing-extra-attention-to-4-inch-casing.65845/ is my sanitizing writeup for bottom-feeding wells. Pellets have the advantage that they can fall to the bottom if there is enough space between the well casing/sides and the pump.

Still, I think the lowering of pH and the flooding volume have a lot of effect on sanitizing effectiveness. Click Inbox, above.

The well is 6 inches, the sanitizer I use contains pellets and powder
 

FruitfulPanda

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You are your own municipality, you need to get a real water test done by a lab. It is definitely worth doing this every few years and especially when you first move in. A real water test will give the proper information we need to design a proper system. Without it we are simply guessing and throwing equipment at it.

NTLWATERTEST

Use this link and look for well standard.

This for sure. There was just recently a story I saw on a Maine news site where a guy on well water was developing kidney failure and it turns out it was a specific strain of e coli that explained it. Even worse, it had been tested a few months before and that was in the results and he continued drinking it. Goes to show you can't trust it's safe until you know.
 

Dis360

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I'm confused. you said no iron in the water..zero, then changed to 2 ppm. if it swirls around in the bottle it's collodial clay.

I believe your reading another posters response about his water being 2 ppm. My water shows zero iron on all tests done in the past few months, a different test was done in August that did show right on the boarder of 0.3 ppm but subsequent tests show zero. The crap in the bottom of the bottle swirls around, it starts out as small particles then clumps together over time.
 

Dis360

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If it settles, it is not colloidal.

If it settles, like the picture I show it's not colloidal clay? It takes 24 hours+ to settle and clump together. Right out of the tap, its crystal clear, a few hours later it will start to develop a haziness (maybe the introduction of oxygen).
 

Dis360

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You are your own municipality, you need to get a real water test done by a lab. It is definitely worth doing this every few years and especially when you first move in. A real water test will give the proper information we need to design a proper system. Without it we are simply guessing and throwing equipment at it.

NTLWATERTEST

Use this link and look for well standard.
When I moved in a got a $300 water test but they only included bacteria, lead and nitrates, apparently it was not everything.

2021-02-19 14_18_56-Window.png
 

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If it settles, like the picture I show it's not colloidal clay? It takes 24 hours+ to settle and clump together. Right out of the tap, its crystal clear, a few hours later it will start to develop a haziness (maybe the introduction of oxygen).
oh ok. wasn't paying attention to the thread jack. sounds like ferrous (dissolved) iron. it presents itself over time when oxidized by air
 

Dis360

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oh ok. wasn't paying attention to the thread jack. sounds like ferrous (dissolved) iron. it presents itself over time when oxidized by air

Right, my guess is the water is never in contact with air until it comes out of the tap. Cant figure out why the test says no iron. Can I test for that another way? What will precipitate it into iron particles? Chlorine? Or has it already precipitated into ferric as these blobs?
 

Reach4

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If it settles, like the picture I show it's not colloidal clay?
Correct. Colloidal clay will not settle, unless you add a flocculant. Plus, it would start out cloudy, rather than clear. 2:Click inbox, above.
 

Dis360

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Correct. Colloidal clay will not settle, unless you add a flocculant. Plus, it would start out cloudy, rather than clear. 2:Click inbox, above.

Thanks for the info in the inbox, its' fraction of the cost of the $300 test I did and that only tested for bacteria, nitrates and lead. So if I understand correctly, a few drops of bleach should precipitate out some iron?
 
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