Iron filter system loosing air?

[Minkus]

Hi all,
New to the forum and did some searching/research on the subject but came up a little short. Long story short, I recently bought this house and have a single tank iron/sulfur filter that loses its air pocket within minutes of the air draw cycle during regen.

System specs:
-12 GPM well pump with pressure set to 50/70
-3/4inch lines
-100, and 50-micron spin downs between the pressure tank and iron filter
-salt-based water softener after iron filter

Iron filter system:
-ProSystems iron filter with aeration (Aquion?)
-Installed in November of 2018
-tank is 10 "x 48"
-paperwork says 1.5cuft of katalox but I measured depth at about 23.5 inches meaning only 1cuft in the tank.
-5gpm service and backwash rate, but removed the DLFC button to get a full flow rate of between 10-12gpm.
-1/2 discharge line to drain (about 6 feet away in the floor)

-BW=10 minutes (well runs dry after about 12 minutes at this flow rate but that is another story altogether)
--getting about 5-7 inches of media lift during backwash.
-Air draw=8 minutes
-rinse=3 minutes

I have shown light through the tank during regen and found that I am getting "ok" lift during backwash, air draw is functioning and I get an air pocket about 20 inches deep by the end of that part of the cycle. However during the rinse cycle, and continuing after the regen cycle completes, my tank continues to fill with water and lose the air pocket. Within about 5 minutes of the air draw cycle completing, the air pocket is gone and that tank is completely full of water (I can see the water splashing off the umbrella diffuser in the top of the tank and see the water level rising.).

I'm sure this is not normal. I don't hear any air leaking out of the tank during this time (though the sound of the water flowing and splashing inside makes it difficult to know for sure), but I do get a large amount of air in my water lines after every cycle (I know some air in the lines is normal but it sounds like my toilet is exploding when flushed after the cycle). Needless to say, my sulfur smell sucks and I'm sure I'm not getting much iron filtration with no air pocket

So my question is should my tank lose the pocket that fast? And if not what could be causing it to lose it so quickly?

Thanks

 

[Reach4]

That 10 "x 48" tank size is unusual. To measure the tank diameter, measure the circumference and divide by pi. Then round down.

Post on how you could remove air from pipes after AIO filter air release air https://terrylove.com/forums/index....system-after-air-injection-iron-filter.74384/

How often do you regen?

I don't know the answers for your questions, but I like your methodology.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Minkus]

That 10 "x 48" tank size is unusual. To measure the tank diameter, measure the circumference and divide by pi. Then round down.

Post on how you could remove air from pipes after AIO filter air release air https://terrylove.com/forums/index....system-after-air-injection-iron-filter.74384/

How often do you regen?

I don't know the answers for your questions, but I like your methodology.

Your right that is a weird size, that's what I get for using my phone app to measure instead of an actual measuring tape lol.
-Tank size is 10 x 54
which means katalox amount is actually closer to 1.25cuft.

The system is set to regen every day

 

[Minkus]

That 10 "x 48" tank size is unusual. To measure the tank diameter, measure the circumference and divide by pi. Then round down.

Post on how you could remove air from pipes after AIO filter air release air https://terrylove.com/forums/index....system-after-air-injection-iron-filter.74384/

How often do you regen?

I don't know the answers for your questions, but I like your methodology.

Also, I had reviewed that post about removing air from the system and may end up doing that. Before I do, however, I would like to make sure that the air I am getting in the lines isn't all the air that is supposed to be in the tank and leaking out through the valve or something.

 

[Reach4]

I think you have read various threads. Did they include these?

https://terrylove.com/forums/index.php?threads/katalox-light-fe-mn-removal-system-backsliding.85903/
https://terrylove.com/forums/index.php?threads/katalox-light-short-lived.89238/

 

[Bannerman]

Since the air is flowing out to the house fixtures, verify the inlet and outlet connections are not reversed.

 

[Minkus]

I think you have read various threads. Did they include these?

https://terrylove.com/forums/index.php?threads/katalox-light-fe-mn-removal-system-backsliding.85903/
https://terrylove.com/forums/index.php?threads/katalox-light-short-lived.89238/

I did look these over previously but they don't really clarify my issue.

I just got a little daring and spent a couple of hours pulling apart the control system. All of the internal components were caked in a slimy sludge. I'm not sure if that's due to iron and sulfur bacteria or what. I got the whole thing off and cleaned really well. I looked into the tank and the media looks very clean, with no red or brown in it at all. The umbrella diffuser at the top was in good shape, just had a little build-up on it that I was able to wipe off.

Anyway, I got it cleaned and put back together (and reset to the proper positioning since I moved it and was in a constant state of rinse even though the system was off). I ran a full regen and ensured the air draw ran until I started to get the air out of the drain line (about 12 minutes). The tank is now holding an air pocket from the top of the tank down to about 4-6 inches below the difuser.

hopefully, it will maintain this pocket and actually start working again lol. Will keep you posted.

 

[Minkus]

Since the air is flowing out to the house fixtures, verify the inlet and outlet connections are not reversed.

Haha, I did check into this, and thankfully whoever installed it did it properly. There is even a backflow preventer on the inlet pipe just before the iron filter. That means I have 1 at the pump, 1 just before the pressure tank, and 1 just before the iron filter, no worries about backflowing into the aquafer here haha.

 

[Bannerman]

Great that it was connected correctly. There have been numerous issue requests on this forum which sometimes turn out to be due to a simple cause such as a reversed connection.

With the check valve installed on the supply line to the iron filter, thermal expansion occurring when cold water is heated in the water heater, cannot push back through the water treatment equipment to the pressure tank. To absorb the expansion, if not already present, a thermal expansion tank will be needed on the supply line directly before the water heater.

That means I have 1 at the pump, 1 just before the pressure tank,

Assuming your well pump is submersible, there should not be a check valve located before the pressure tank. That additional check valve can cause water hammer, a hole in the well's drop pipe, or other component failures.

If further testing indicates the AIO continues to leak air, in order of easiest first:

• directly following the air fill cycle, check at the end of the drain line to sense if an air leak can be detected
• check the inlet port where air is drawn into the unit. That port will typically utilize a check valve to prevent air/water from flowing outward. If air is leaking from the port, that check valve will be stuck open, but the porting behind and the valve piston should also be checked & cleaned as the valve piston should have closed that port at the end of the air draw cycle.
• remove the control valve from the top of the tank and check/replace the O ring which seals the riser tube to the valve. If the O ring is leaking, the air bubble can leak out to the drain line during regeneration, or to the house faucets after the regeneration cycle has concluded.

 

[Minkus]

As a quick update. It has been nearly a month since I pulled my tank head apart and gave it a good cleaning to remove all the slimy buildup that was present. As state previously, this fixed my problem haveing had significant air in my plumbing lines after regeneration. It also allowed the tank to maintain its air pocket at about 10 inches in depth even at a 70psi pressure setting. The air pocket slowly depletes due to usage (as it should) but now lasts for a full 2+ days. I now only run my system once every other day, I still have no issue with excess air in the lines after regen, the filter is more efficient, and I no longer have any hydrogen sulphide smell (used to always have a slight smell that got worse as I approached 100 gals of useage). So I know some questions have been posted to this forum in the past about excessive air in lines after regen and the air relief valve being added was suggested. I would recommend a full service/cleaning of the iron system occur first in order to save money (I did mine in about 2 hours by myself with almost no plumbing knowledge).

Thanks for all the help from the members for helping me figure some of this out )