Installed 2 Toto Drakes - question about flushing...

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deebee

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On the advice and research from this forum (thanks Terry and others for advice in my other threads) I have a question about how this toilet should flush.

Install went perfect. I studied Terry's son's post about how to install the Toto Drake, and it was great. Thanks!

I am dumbfounded on how these toilets flush, though.

Do you just pull the flush lever down and let it go for the toilet to flush, or do you have to hold the thing down for a second or two for the tank to empty?

I tried it by just holding down the lever and letting it go right away, and it didn't seem like a full flush.

Then I tried by holding it down for a few seconds and it seemed like a much fuller flush.

These toilets are in a lounge, so I can just picture the patrons doing a "conventional" flush where you just hold the lever and let it go right away, and it should do a full flush. This is not the case with Toto's, it seems.

Pardon my newbieness, but up here in Canada there are still a ton of toilets that have a full flush where you just hit the lever and the flapper opens fully until the tank empties.

Thanks again guys, and I will definitely post updates. I know there are a lot of pro plumbers on here, but Google indexes this site like mad and I am sure there are a lot of newbs in my position that would like everyday insight into this toilet.

Other than that, it is a beautiful toilet, easy to install, and the parts and workmanship seem very high quality. :)
 

Redwood

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DeeBee
Wad up a huge amount of paper balls.
Enough that would have guaranteed that bling covered cadet would have puked across the floor.
Hit the lever and don't hold it.
Watch what happens!

Your question will be answered!

Wad up enough that would have clogged the best flushing toilet you can ever recall using and try it again.

That should make you smile!
 
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Gary Swart

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Deebee, the tank is not supposed to empty for a normal flush. The added water provides more pressure to the flush. The think you must come to grips with is that a Toto is not just a revamped old style toilet that uses less water. It is designed to operate with 1.6 gallons of water. Some now use even less. Many of the popular major brands tried to just reduce the amount of water used without changing the basic design of the toilet. These first generation low flows were, and some still are, a disaster! Just use this as it come. They work great in the US and I'm pretty sure they will be fine in Canada as well.
 

Loke

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Note from Installation instructions

In the TOTO installation booklet (for my recently installed Gwyneths) there's a note at the end - Operation (Note to Owner). Here's the relevant part:
"To ensure that your toilet is performing correctly, always flush the toilet with a full stroke of the trip lever to activate the flushing cycle. A full stroke will guarantee that you are flushing with the power of a TOTO."
I'd think that these instructions apply to most TOTO models, including yours.
 

Jadnashua

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Yes, that's good info...fully depress then release...do not hold it down. Note, the tension (i.e., slack) in the chain to the flapper valve must be right, too.

Build a little faith...Toto toilets work. They are not like your old water hog. They rely on engineering and quality control to get a reliable device. No need to re-engineer it.
 

deebee

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Folks, you are 110% correct about these toilets and your information and my actual experience with the toilet is bang on.

I am an oldster and am used to the full flush toilets...been using them all my life and the places up here (bars, restaurants etc.) don't seem to use low flush toilets.

But I did the ultimate test and instead of flushing down a wad of toilet paper I flushed down a wad of paper towel (4 squares worth) and I'll be damned if it didn't get flushed no problem. It was really odd to me as there was not much water at all going through the bowl during the flush, but the velocity was incredible. Paper towels were sitting there, and WHOOSH, just disappeared.

I am now a convert on Toto toilets. The previous toilets we had installed, Low Flush American Standard Renaissance are now in a dumpster in the alley behind our bar. Complete garbage and cost us a lot of money. Not buying them as they are cheap, but getting plumbers in to troubleshoot them as they simply did not flush.

Thanks again for the advice and reassurance. I have full confidence in these toilets, and they are very well built. Toto has obviously put a lot of time and effort into the development of their technology and it works great.

We have 3 25+ year old toilets to replace in our home soon, and Toto are the only ones we are putting in. It is worth the extra $$ for something that actually works. :)
 

Gary Swart

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I wouldn't even hazard a guess as to whether or not Canada will eventually follow the US and mandate new toilets be low flow. I can see why the might however. With the US requiring them now, the manufacturers may quit producing the old style and force the issue. Glad you have your toilets working and are satisfied with their performance.
 

Redwood

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I believe that Canada is going along the lines of offering rebate incentives for the installation of approved low flow toilets rather than mandating them.

DeeBee, I would make sure that you apply for those if eligible.
 

abroadst

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Incomplete flush

I just installed a Drake and I'm not happy with the flush action. I've used plenty of low-flow (1.6gpf) toilets and that's not the problem. If I push the lever all the way down and let go right away it does not flush. Some water enters the bowl and then the flapper goes down prematurely and not enough water is released to actually flush it. Some bubbles come up and the flush process stops. I need to hold the lever down for about 1 full second to get a proper flush. I'm not talking about emptying the tank completely - just getting it to flush. Is this normal?
 
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Redwood

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You need to fully depress the handle and release it.
People That complain of the partial flush are just bumping the handle and the flapper does not open completely...
 

abroadst

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I don't think you're understanding what's going on. Perhaps I should post a video or something - I'll think about that.

I am fully depressing the lever - all the way down. If I do that and then release immediately the toilet does not flush, as I described. I have to hold it in the fully depressed position for 1-2 seconds to allow enough water to exit the tank to flush it.

I played with adjusting the length of the chain connecting the flush lever to the flapper, but that didn't help. The flush lever handle seems ever so slightly loose. I'll see about tightening the flush lever handle's connection.
 

TedL

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If you actually have the chain properly adjusted, the other possibility is a defective flapper that's closing too quickly.
 

Terry

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A 1.6 gallon toilet uses 1.6 gallons.
The only way to use the entire 3.0 gallons in a tank, is to hold the handle down and force more water out.
 

Jadnashua

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The toilets generally come pretty well adjusted from the factory, but the free length in the chain could be off. There needs to be a little slack in it, but not too much. It should start lifting the flapper with very little play. The nut holding the lever assembly could be loose.
 

Wfon55

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I don't think you're understanding what's going on. Perhaps I should post a video or something - I'll think about that.

I am fully depressing the lever - all the way down. If I do that and then release immediately the toilet does not flush, as I described. I have to hold it in the fully depressed position for 1-2 seconds to allow enough water to exit the tank to flush it.

I played with adjusting the length of the chain connecting the flush lever to the flapper, but that didn't help. The flush lever handle seems ever so slightly loose. I'll see about tightening the flush lever handle's connection.

I had this same problem with a two-piece insulated Toto Caruso. I installed two of these toilets in my house - one worked great - one push of the lever resulted in a complete flush. But the 2nd one had the same problem you describe. Looking in the tanks, I noticed that the refill tube of the problem toilet was very close to the back wall of the tank, which resulted in the hinges of the flapper binding ever so slightly because of the angle. The fill tube in the trouble-free toilet was positioned more towards the center of the tank and I could see that when the chain pulled up, the hinges would operate freely because it was more in line with the direction of the pull of the chain. So I pulled the tank off the problem toilet, loosened the fill tube assembly and rotated it to match the other toilet. And now it works fine. So it seems that when some of the fill tube assemblies are installed at the factory, there is some variation of the angle of some of the units.
 
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Terry

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So it seems that when some of the fill tube assemblies are installed at the factory, there is some variation of the angle of some of the units.

Of the thousands of Drake tanks I have sold, I've never had to adjust or swivel the flush valve.

I can guess that there aren't too many insulated tanks sold though.
The extra tank wall thickness could have played a part there.
If the flapper swings freely, then it should all be good.

The flapper will pull up and drop down.
The tank does not drain all the way.
If it did, it would be a 2.5 gallon toilet.
 

Ian Gills

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DeeBee
Wad up a huge amount of paper balls.
Enough that would have guaranteed that bling covered cadet would have puked across the floor.
Hit the lever and don't hold it.
Watch what happens!

Your question will be answered!

Wad up enough that would have clogged the best flushing toilet you can ever recall using and try it again.

That should make you smile!

Now try the same with Cottonelle. That'll wipe the smile off of your face!

Proper chain adjustment is the answer to most flushing problems. All except the comfy toilet paper that is!

Cadet 3 at your service SIR!
military-major-cartoon.gif
 
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