How to insulate exterior sump drain?

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Tfield98

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Thirty-five years ago the previous owner added a basement bathroom, installed a sump ejector pump, and ran its drain above ground to the house's main sewer line. It's probably totally not to code, but this has worked.

All was well until last year an installer put a heat pump next to the drain line.

Last winter, the metal pipe from the ejector to the sewer line froze in 30° weather here in Seattle. We think this is because of the wind chill from the heat-pump fan blowing cold air over the pipe.

A plumber we hired at the time repaired the split ~2" metal pipe by inserting a length of plastic pipe and compression clamps, as seen in the attached images. We probably should have insisted on metal pipe, but cutting new threads on the remaining metal pipe wasn't possible because it's too close to the house.

The sump pump in the well has a check valve, so this length of pipe probably has liquid in it all the time?

We don't get a lot of freezing weather, but we do need to avoid this happening again. How do we avoid this line freezing again this winter? This spot gets a lot of precipitation. Is there low-voltage, rain-safe, heat tape for plastic pipe that we can use on the ten-foot metal-plastic-metal run with compression clamps as seen in the attached?

We want to avoid ripping the metal pipe back to the sump at one end and back to the sewage line at the other.
 

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Reach4

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It is possible to have the water outside to not be standing. To do that, have the high part of the path indoors. At the peak, put a vacuum breaker to admit air when there is a vacuum. Then make sure the rest of the path is all down hill with no significant bellies or dips.
 

Tfield98

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Hi, Reach4. Thanks for the suggestion.

There's no way we can put the high part of this run indoors because that would require opening the side of the house, dealing with insulation, studs, etc. But, I didn't know about vacuum breakers. Thanks!!

Do plumbers use something like this? https://heatline.com/product/kompensator/ It looks safe. And, if we can avoid having a plumber touch the pipe, we can use that money on what is likely to be an expensive solution like this.
 

Reach4

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I am not a pro. Your idea of a heat tape seems reasonable. I did not read thru your link. I would not limit myself to low voltage if I did use heat.

But I have another idea. Your ground water sump pump does not run much, if at all, during freezing weather. Suppose you blew out the water from the basement. Is a shop vac, in reverse, going to have enough pressure to do that? If not, you could use a compressor. Any compressor that you buy should have a cfm or scfm rating. If it only says "250 psi", or some such, do not consider it.
 

Tfield98

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I am not a pro. Your idea of a heat tape seems reasonable. I did not read thru your link. I would not limit myself to low voltage if I did use heat.

But I have another idea. Your ground water sump pump does not run much, if at all, during freezing weather. Suppose you blew out the water from the basement. Is a shop vac, in reverse, going to have enough pressure to do that? If not, you could use a compressor. Any compressor that you buy should have a cfm or scfm rating. If it only says "250 psi", or some such, do not consider it.

This is not a groundwater sump pump. The pump is fed by a bathroom that is used year-round. Thanks, though, for taking time to respond.
 

Reach4

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You would usually call that a sewage pump or ejector pump, rather than a sump pump. I understand that both are usually submersible pump.

The sewage pit is normally sealed and vented.

So electric sound like a good way to go. I would probably cheap out and use an electric heater made for gutters.
 

Tfield98

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You would usually call that a sewage pump or ejector pump, rather than a sump pump. I understand that both are usually submersible pump.

The sewage pit is normally sealed and vented.

So electric sound like a good way to go. I would probably cheap out and use an electric heater made for gutters.
Thanks, Reach4. I didn't know the proper terminology.

Yeah, a gutter heater might work. But, my concern is that I'll be warming steel, plastic, as the rubber gasket on the compression connectors. I don't know much about the temperatures involved and how to keep it safe.
 

Reach4

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The rubber on the coupling would not be a problem IMO, because the metal shield spreads the heat out. Your other plastic pipe would not have that shield.
 

WorthFlorida

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Heat tapes have built in thermostats. they turn off and on according the preset temperatures.

Solids of any kind are not affected by wind chill, only people and warm blooded animals. If the wind is blowing at 30º, the pipe will read 30º. What might have caused it with air flowing around the pipe heat from the ground was not sufficient to keep it above freezing. Since WA doesn't get that cold very often, the ground probably never freezes.
 

Tuttles Revenge

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Funny.. I was thinking I never purchase these due to liability issues. But I installed one at my EX's Tiny house and she moved from seattle to AZ recently and gave me back the one we had installed.. Pretty sure I got it from Grainger so its likely Raychem brand. But it just needs to be waterproof connections to be safe.. made for plastic or metal..

PSR brand listed as waterproof.

the ground probably never freezes.
OH.. it freezes here on occasion. We had a week in the 20's last year that caused a lot of havoc. We lost a couple exterior mounted Tankless water heaters (bad idea)
 

Tfield98

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Heat tapes have built in thermostats. they turn off and on according the preset temperatures.
Solids of any kind are not affected by wind chill, only people and warm blooded animals. If the wind is blowing at 30º, the pipe will read 30º. What might have caused it with air flowing around the pipe heat from the ground was not sufficient to keep it above freezing. Since WA doesn't get that cold very often, the ground probably never freezes.

Heat tapes have built in thermostats. they turn off and on according the preset temperatures.

Solids of any kind are not affected by wind chill, only people and warm blooded animals. If the wind is blowing at 30º, the pipe will read 30º. What might have caused it with air flowing around the pipe heat from the ground was not sufficient to keep it above freezing. Since WA doesn't get that cold very often, the ground probably never freezes.
 
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