How to fix water main supply line

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AdrianeS

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I have water that just barely starting to leak at my main drain line. The pipe gets a little wet but it's not even enough to start dripping on the floor yet. However, I'm guessing over time it will continue to get worse. I had a plumbing company take a look at it and they want $750 to repair it which seems way out of line to me.

I'm pretty handy around the house and would really like to fix this myself if possible, especially considering the cost to repair professionally.

I got some JB weld epoxy but then read that this is only a temporary repair. If it's a permanent epoxy, how is this temporary? Why would it only last a short while and not permanently?

How can I perform a permanent fix on this leak? It's coming from in between two fittings. Any advice is greatly appreciated!


Water main line.jpg

Water Main.jpg

Water Main 2.jpg
 
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Reach4

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I am not a plumber. I suspect 1/8 turn between the two hexes with two wrenches would help. So which way? And which one moves? And should you loosen something some, and apply a lubricant, before re-tightening? Let's see what others think.

Regarding JB weld, you normally cannot seal a pressure pipe with something you insert from the outside. And regarding permanent, how durable are your markings with a permanent marker?
 
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AdrianeS

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I am not a plumber. I suspect 1/8 turn between the two hexes with two wrenches would help. So which way? And which one moves? And should you loosen something some, and apply a lubricant, before re-tightening? Let's see what others think.

Regarding JB weld, you normally cannot seal a pressure pipe with something you insert from the outside. And regarding permanent, how durable are your markings with a permanent marker?
Thanks for your reply, I feel silly saying this but I'm not understanding the reference to the marker? I mean when my son drew with a Sharpie all over his bedroom walls nothing, and I mean nothing, was able to remove it!
 

Reach4

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Ever use a Sharpie for marking on clothing or water bottles, or a key? After some handling or washing, the words can become illegible. Skin would be a special case, and would be an unfair comparison.

But anyway, addressing your question directly, my experience is that JB Weld does not adhere strongly to metal. Plus it does not wick into spaces well.

I did patch a copper pipe feeding an outdoor spigot. That split after being frozen. I used 1-hour epoxy (more liquid than JB weld, and wrapped the area with a fiberous material, which I also saturated with epoxy. I may have then wrapped the outside with a lot of dental floss before the epoxy had set.

So something like that could potentially work, it would be inelegant and suspect. And if somebody tells us how to use the wrenches, that would be both effective and elegant.
 
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Sylvan

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For $750 the plumber is offering you a gift.

If the flare fitting gives up the ghost while the plumber is working on it they will have a heck of a time trying to stop the flood.

Ideally, the globe valve that is already there should be replaced as a washer-type valve has no valid reason to be on a water main.

Trying to tighten the nut is a crazy idea as it may split and then what do you propose to do?

Looking at the main valve you can see wrench marks which indicates someone at one time had to replace a washer.

I am sure the plumber can set up a payment schedule if your have a problem paying the $750 all at once

Just make sure they are licensed and insured and hope there is another shout off (CURB BOX) outside
 

John Gayewski

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$750 doesn't seem bad. You should have the city shut you off and just replace the valve with a ball valve (globe valve would be fine but I'm not sure how readily available they are). You would then get a compression ball valve and install it, then have the city turn you back on. Hooking the new valve back up to your plumbing is something I can't answer as your picture doesn't show anything above the nipple/ union.
 
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GrumpyPlumber

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As a licensed plumber, I'll reiterate what the two above state about the price, it's not that high relative to the time/material involved.

That aside, it's possible the wet is condensate, exposed water pipes have the "coke can" effect, when running cold water inside they collect condensate outside.

Reach has mentioned the only way you might fix it, and that comes with a caveat - the valve is very old, if you crack or strip the nut while tightening you'll quickly have a flooded basement.

If that doesn't work -
The plumber is going to have to schedule a shut-down with the local water dept, and as Sylvan points out, you need a full port ball valve - the current valve should never have been used. Also, there is no way to seal it externally, especially not while the main is pressurized.

I'd also mention that the copper water main should've been sleeved to protect it from direct contact with concrete, acid in the concrete can eat the copper, that copper inside the mortar could be in rough shape, be careful not to shake or vibrate the pipe if you attempt a fix.
 

AdrianeS

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Ever use a Sharpie for marking on clothing or water bottles, or a key? After some handling or washing, the words can become illegible. Skin would be a special case, and would be an unfair comparison.

But anyway, addressing your question directly, my experience is that JB Weld does not adhere strongly to metal. Plus it does not wick into spaces well.

I did patch a copper pipe feeding an outdoor spigot. That split after being frozen. I used 1-hour epoxy (more liquid than JB weld, and wrapped the area with a fiberous material, which I also saturated with epoxy. I may have then wrapped the outside with a lot of dental floss before the epoxy had set.

So something like that could potentially work, it would be inelegant and suspect. And if somebody tells us how to use the wrenches, that would be both effective and elegant.
Agreed. I suspect just tightening it could be the fix, unless there are seals inside that are causing the leak.
 

AdrianeS

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For $750 the plumber is offering you a gift.

If the flare fitting gives up the ghost while the plumber is working on it they will have a heck of a time trying to stop the flood.

Ideally, the globe valve that is already there should be replaced as a washer-type valve has no valid reason to be on a water main.

Trying to tighten the nut is a crazy idea as it may split and then what do you propose to do?

Looking at the main valve you can see wrench marks which indicates someone at one time had to replace a washer.

I am sure the plumber can set up a payment schedule if your have a problem paying the $750 all at once

Just make sure they are licensed and insured and hope there is another shout off (CURB BOX) outside
The plumber told me I'd need to call the water company and have the water shut off completely before the repair, so there should be no worry of flooding water.

Unfortunately, I don't qualify for a payment plan.

What is the part that's leaking called? You mentioned a flare fitting. I'd just like to know so I can do more research about the problem. All the videos I've found only address leaking at the shutoff valve itself.

How difficult is the repair? If it's simply unscrewing the pipes and adding a fitting (as long as there's no welding required) I don't see why I couldn't do it myself if given the proper directions. It doesn't appear to be a complicated repair at all unless I'm overlooking something.
 

John Gayewski

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Determine what size copper line you have coming into the house. Shut service off. Drain as much piping as possible. Have one of thesehttps://www.supplyhouse.com/Webstone-40633W-3-4-Compression-Full-Port-Brass-Ball-Valve-Lead-Free?utm_source=google_ad&utm_medium=Shopping_tm&utm_campaign=Shopping_TM_New_users&gclid=CjwKCAiA9NGfBhBvEiwAq5vSy6APgI_O73FUMPLtcKDfySHpMOwl4l200jka4sSAleRRexb-c6T6qxoCunwQAvD_BwE

Tighten it onto the piping.

First take a picture of the situation farther up the pipe so you can be directed how to connect from the new valve to your existing. I'm thinking you should just cut out more piping.

Very detailed and proper instructions can be very difficult to write out or convey even with words only. If you need an example of this you can write the instructions for making a peanut butter and jelly sandwich down and then watch someone neglect to open the drawer where the butter knife lives, becuse you didn't write that part, so they can't even start on your instructions.
 

Reach4

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A lot of people buy a "curb key" and do that themselves. Probably not officially allowed. I am not a plumber.
 

AdrianeS

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Determine what size copper line you have coming into the house. Shut service off. Drain as much piping as possible. Have one of thesehttps://www.supplyhouse.com/Webstone-40633W-3-4-Compression-Full-Port-Brass-Ball-Valve-Lead-Free?utm_source=google_ad&utm_medium=Shopping_tm&utm_campaign=Shopping_TM_New_users&gclid=CjwKCAiA9NGfBhBvEiwAq5vSy6APgI_O73FUMPLtcKDfySHpMOwl4l200jka4sSAleRRexb-c6T6qxoCunwQAvD_BwE

Tighten it onto the piping.

First take a picture of the situation farther up the pipe so you can be directed how to connect from the new valve to your existing. I'm thinking you should just cut out more piping.

Very detailed and proper instructions can be very difficult to write out or convey even with words only. If you need an example of this you can write the instructions for making a peanut butter and jelly sandwich down and then watch someone neglect to open the drawer where the butter knife lives, becuse you didn't write that part, so they can't even start on your instructions.
Thanks for your reply! I had a situation arise and forgot about this post. Tomorrow morning, I'll take a picture of the rest of the pipe and go from there.

I totally understand it's difficult to write instructions step by step but I'm pretty handy and as long as I know the correct parts to buy and a general sense of how they go to together I'm sure I can do it!
 

Jeff H Young

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looks like at the top of picture is a meter tailpiece and possibly a meter out of view and down at the bottom where leak is a similar type union with a flat washer inside Dont know the names , our watermains are done a bit differant. It could be real easy or not to fix.
 

Sylvan

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Be extremely careful when using a curb key so as not to break the valve underground in the closed position or worse cause it to start leaking
 

Jeff H Young

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Much of a repair like this is self explanatory to people that do mechanical stuff. it truly is a very simple fix but things can go wrong We can guess about the 750 charge with parts on hand 100 bucks and an hour on the job should be ample. for me Id come look get parts and comeback to do the work . There are concerns with the copper against mortar etc. which I wasent thinking of addressing
 

Reach4

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I totally understand it's difficult to write instructions step by step but I'm pretty handy and as long as I know the correct parts to buy and a general sense of how they go to together I'm sure I can do it!
I would want to more about that fitting, or pair of fittings, that your green arrow points to.

Once I knew that, I would look above what you show in your photo, and be looking to replace galvanized where practical.
 

AdrianeS

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Determine what size copper line you have coming into the house. Shut service off. Drain as much piping as possible. Have one of thesehttps://www.supplyhouse.com/Webstone-40633W-3-4-Compression-Full-Port-Brass-Ball-Valve-Lead-Free?utm_source=google_ad&utm_medium=Shopping_tm&utm_campaign=Shopping_TM_New_users&gclid=CjwKCAiA9NGfBhBvEiwAq5vSy6APgI_O73FUMPLtcKDfySHpMOwl4l200jka4sSAleRRexb-c6T6qxoCunwQAvD_BwE

Tighten it onto the piping.

First take a picture of the situation farther up the pipe so you can be directed how to connect from the new valve to your existing. I'm thinking you should just cut out more piping.

Very detailed and proper instructions can be very difficult to write out or convey even with words only. If you need an example of this you can write the instructions for making a peanut butter and jelly sandwich down and then watch someone neglect to open the drawer where the butter knife lives, becuse you didn't write that part, so they can't even start on your instructions.
I edited the original post to include more pictures. What about using a Sharkbite shutoff valve? I also need to replace a couple of leaking shutoffs under my kitchen sink and was planning to use Sharkbites for those.

I'm assuming I'll have the city shut off the water, use an autocutter to cut out the section of pipe that's leaking and then just install a new Sharkbite ball valve. Is there any more to it? Honestly, it doesn't seem terribly difficult and I definitely don't want to pay someone else to do it if that's all there is to do.

Thanks again for your help!
 
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AdrianeS

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Much of a repair like this is self explanatory to people that do mechanical stuff. it truly is a very simple fix but things can go wrong We can guess about the 750 charge with parts on hand 100 bucks and an hour on the job should be ample. for me Id come look get parts and comeback to do the work . There are concerns with the copper against mortar etc. which I wasent thinking of addressing
It looks like a very simple fix to me too, but I wanted to post here just to double check I'm not overlooking something.

My proposed fix would be to have the city shut off the water, use an autocutter to cutout the leaking coupling, install a Sharkbite ball valve, and I think that's all there is to it?

You mentioned concerns about the copper and mortar. Is there anything I can do at this point to protect the pipe with it already being inside the wall?
 
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AdrianeS

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$750 doesn't seem bad. You should have the city shut you off and just replace the valve with a ball valve (globe valve would be fine but I'm not sure how readily available they are). You would then get a compression ball valve and install it, then have the city turn you back on. Hooking the new valve back up to your plumbing is something I can't answer as your picture doesn't show anything above the nipple/ union.
I edited my original post to include more pictures.

Maybe $750 is a fair price but it's still far more than I can afford to pay right now, especially if I can do it myself.

My proposed fix would be to have the city shut off the water, use an autocutter to cutout the leaking coupling, install a Sharkbite ball valve, and I think that's all there is to it?
 
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