How to cost effectively control some pretty high Iron

Discussion in 'Water Softener Forum, Questions and Answers' started by Tim Plaster, Feb 4, 2020.

  1. Tim Plaster

    Tim Plaster New Member

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    Feb 4, 2020
    Location:
    CO
    Hello all. I've been scouring old posts from the site to get an idea of what I would be in for when my well test results came in. I just got them and while I knew the iron would be high I was hoping it wouldn't be this high...

    Total Alkalinity 230.0
    Bicarbonate 230.0
    Carbonate <0.1
    Hydroxide <0.1
    Chloride 0.6
    Iron 5.008
    Fluoride 0.51
    Potassium 1.5
    Nitrate Nitrogen <0.05
    pH 7.31
    Calcium 35.7
    Magnesium 14.67
    Sodium 40.0
    Sodium Adsorption 1.4
    Total Hardness 149.5
    Sulfate 4.4
    TDS 289

    Everything but the iron seems to look OK (or within limits?)
    There seems to be a lot of disagreements about how to treat iron. Clearly, this is too much to be treated by a softener alone. This is a 2nd home that I am planning on renting out on a short term basis. So, planning on it being occupied every weekend or so. It's <900 SF 2BR/ 2BA, both with showers, D/W, W/D. I'm guessing average occupancy would be 4-6 people.
    Whatever equipment I go with will have to go into the crawl space to which there is pretty limited access. Floor hatch is around 30" x 30" so I won't be able to get a large tank or anything down there. Also, I will only be there personally around 1x month, so won't be able to perform a lot of maintenance. Though, if it's something like dumping some Iron Out into a tank, I could likely arrange that with the prop. manager.
    I'm also a little hesitant to dump chemicals into our drinking water. My wife died of cancer 1.5 years ago and I have a 7 year old daughter that I'm probably a little overly-protective of. I lean a little toward the hippy-side of things these days.
    Finally, I'm a little tapped out of funds after finishing the house. So, while I will spend what is necessary to get the right system for the long haul, I'm going to have a difficult time dropping a large sum on this house.
    Any help and advice is greatly appreciated.
     
  2. Tim Plaster

    Tim Plaster New Member

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    Feb 4, 2020
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    ...I should mention that the crawlspace is tall. I can almost stand up in it and I'm over 6'. It's getting items in there that's the problem.
    After looking at more posts, maybe my iron isn't that awful. Maybe an AIO filter followed by a softener would do? If so, can someone recommend sizes as well as potential brands and reputable places to purchase? I installed a Fleck softener system into a previous house myself and it was great. This house is all PEX and I've got the tools to work with that.
    Also, is Katalox Light just the medium that goes into an AIO filter?
     
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  4. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

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    Water systems designer, R&D, Technical Director
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    Ontario California
    AIO should be good, I tend to recommend no more than 5 ppm with AIO, but your pH etc. all look acceptable. KL is the media inside the tank.
     
  5. Tim Plaster

    Tim Plaster New Member

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    Great, thank you.
    Are there different sizes (flows) of AIO? Looks like just a Fleck 5600 SXT, tank and some Katalox light would do it. Any backwash tank needed? Do you think a softener afterward is necessary? I'm wondering if maybe I can leave space for that when funds are better and just take care of the iron for now.
    Thank you again.
     
  6. Reach4

    Reach4 Well-Known Member

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    Location:
    IL
    Fleck 5600 SXT would not do it, because that maxes out at about a reliable 5 gpm backwash. That might be OK for an 8 inch tank, but you need more media than what those will hold.

    Another important question is what GPM can your pump deliver? If you want some testing tips, say so.

    What size of media tank would you plan to use?
     
  7. Tim Plaster

    Tim Plaster New Member

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    OK, so the 2510 would be the better bet.
    My well report says the pump installed produces 10 GPM. So, guessing a 10x54 tank with 1.5 CF Katalox?
     
  8. Tim Plaster

    Tim Plaster New Member

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    ...oops, actually the report says it tested at 14 GPM.
     
  9. Reach4

    Reach4 Well-Known Member

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    What the well can produce is not the thing. The gpm that the pump can bring up is what matters.
     
  10. Tim Plaster

    Tim Plaster New Member

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    Actually, that is what the pump tested. The well itself is off the charts. Like 80 gpm!
     
  11. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

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    Ontario California
    So no real limitation so long as you don't try to use Filox. Anytime you use AIO I would recommend taking the valve off after about 6 months and check the condition inside the tank. It may look nasty, this is normal and it usually rinsed off fairly easily.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2020 at 3:07 PM
  12. Reach4

    Reach4 Well-Known Member

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    OK. So let's say you go with a 13 x54 inch tank with 2.5 cuft of media. Here is a backwash table:
    [​IMG]

    I think you would like to have something like 30% to 40% bed expansion, but I could be off on that. Maybe a 15 gpm DLFC?
     
  13. Tim Plaster

    Tim Plaster New Member

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    Ok, do I really need a tank that big for such small usage? Like I said, 2 baths not occupied full time. Would a 10x54 work?
    I have no clue on bed expansion, so I'll take your word there.
    Is the "backwash temp" the temp of the water? If so, I'm guessing the temp of my crawlspace since the backwash water will coming from the pressure tank?
     
  14. Reach4

    Reach4 Well-Known Member

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    I am not a pro. I think it comes down to the flwo rate of water in service.
    It means how much does the media fluff up during backwash. If you had 100 cm high of media, with 40% bed expansion, a backlighted unpainted tank would show the shadow had risen to 140 cm.
    Most of the water would usually be right from the well. I figure mine is a little less than 15 C =59F.
    https://www3.epa.gov/ceampubl/learn2model/part-two/onsite/ex/jne_henrys_map.html
     
  15. Tim Plaster

    Tim Plaster New Member

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    Ok, got it. Any idea if some gravel below the Katalox makes a difference on the expansion rate? Or would it make more sense to spring for a Vortech tank and skip the gravel?
    Also, mind if you tell me where you got the chart in case i want to change up the tank diam.?
    Thanks so much for all of both of your help.
     
  16. Reach4

    Reach4 Well-Known Member

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    I read a graph on the maker's site, and counted pixels on a graph that was at the URL I show. I have not checked to see if they took that down. It has been a while since I got that.

    If you want one for 10 inch, let me know. However the flow rates needed for a particular diameter vary with the diameter squared (or vary with the cross section area). Here is 10 inch:

    [​IMG]
     
  17. Bannerman

    Bannerman Well-Known Member

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    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    As an alternative to determine Service flow and Backwash requirements, the link directly below is to 2 charts within Ditttohead's catalogue. The lower chart indicates Service and Backwash recommendations for various media in terms of the cross-sectional area (ft2), while the upper chart relates those flow rates to tank diameter and gpm. At the bottom of the upper chart indicates the compensation factor for each 10-degree F variance in water temperature from 60F.
    https://view.publitas.com/impact-water-products/2018-catalog-final/page/154-155

    For additional info regarding KL, see below.
    https://view.publitas.com/impact-water-products/2018-catalog-final/page/168
     
  18. Tim Plaster

    Tim Plaster New Member

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    CO
    Thanks again to all who have helped.
    So for a 10" tank and I'm shooting for 35% expansion with about 50 deg. water temp. The chart from Dittohead's catalog suggests 10-15 gpm backwash rate so I'd set the BW setting of a 2510SXT to "7" according to Reach4's chart above as well as the chart from Dittohead's sight? Am I reading that correctly?
    And even if the place isn't used for a week or 2, I'd still leave the regen. setting at 3 days?
     
  19. Reach4

    Reach4 Well-Known Member

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    Location:
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    I think so.
    I don't know.

    If I were setting this up, I think I would inject bleach or H2O2 solution during backwash. Maybe if you did that before you shut down for a week or two, it would be safe to turn off the pump and leave. Get another opinion.
     
  20. Bannerman

    Bannerman Well-Known Member

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    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    The bottom chart specifies the appropriate BW rate for KL is between 10 to 15 gpm per square foot of tank cross-sectional area.

    Using the upper chart to establish the actual rate needed for a 10" tank (0.54 ft2 cross-section), for 10 gpm ft2 = 5.4 gpm, and 15 gpm ft2 = 8.1 gpm. As your water temperature is 50F, then only 90% of those rates will be needed to achieve the same amount of bed expansion as 60F temperature water. This will then reduce the BW rate needed to between 4.86 gpm (5.4 X 90%) and 7.29 gpm.

    The BW rate is not controlled by a setting but is governed by the flow rate permitted by the DLFC button (restrictor) installed within the control valve. The BW setting will control the amount of BW time (often 10 minutes) while the Rapid Rinse setting will control the amount of time (often 5 minutes) to repack the media after each backwash.

    The other info contained in the bottom chart is the recommended service flow rate which is the flow rate for water being utilized. As 12 gpm/ft2 is specified as the upper recommended service flow rate, this then will equate to 6.5 gpm or less flowing through a 10" tank.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2020 at 8:56 AM
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