Hot water isn't hot

[L. Brown667]

After being gone for 2 weeks, I came home to find that my hot water is lukewarm at best
I'm pretty sure it's the lower element because
the top of the tank is warm to the touch but the bottom isn't
I hadn't run any water for at least an hour when I checked
I know there is power going to both the top and bottom elements (used one of those cheapo pen shaped doohickeys) & had just started to lean in to check the voltage with a multimeter when I heard a "pop"
I don't think I'd actually touched the probes to anything but I'm not 100% sure
I do know that that "pop" is a LOT louder when your head is right by it
Scared the bejeezus right outa me!
So...
Should I bother checking the voltage and continuity or just go ahead and replace the element?
Also, is it possible that sediment in the tank can cause the element to be inefficient?
I'm asking because the water from the tub is rust colored for maybe 1 second after not being used for a day or two
I'm going to flush it no matter what so should I just kill two birds & replace the element right then?
Or should I see if flushing it helps?
Heck, I'm pretty sure I could've flushed it and replaced the element in the time it took me to type this out!
Thanks in advance

 

[WorthFlorida]

Change both elements while you are at it. You didn't mention the age of the water heater. If it is over 12 years old its border line and more than 15 years old, replace it. Electrics do last about twice as long as gas models and do not get a lot of sediment at the bottom of the tank as gas units do.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Jadnashua]

The thermostat turns the top element on until the top of the tank is hot, then it switches to the bottom element. Most do not have both on at the same time. With only the top element working, or a faulty thermostat, you'd not have a lot of hot water volume.

Your voltage sensing device can mislead you, as you can have voltage present, but there's not a complete path for the current to flow. Most water heaters use both L1 and L2, so both elements might have L1 or L2 attached, but only when the other lead is connected to the element, will there be a path for current to flow. That's done by the thermostat. You really need a current reading device (ammeter), not just a voltage sensing device to tell if current is flowing through one of the elements. While the voltage enables it to work, it doesn't until there is current flowing. You can sort of think of voltage as the pressure, and current as the volume. Pressure doesn't mean volume.

 

[L. Brown667]

Change both elements while you are at it. You didn't mention the age of the water heater. If it is over 12 years old its border line and more than 15 years old, replace it. Electrics do last about twice as long as gas models and do not get a lot of sediment at the bottom of the tank as gas units do.

I would bet th

Change both elements while you are at it. You didn't mention the age of the water heater. If it is over 12 years old its border line and more than 15 years old, replace it. Electrics do last about twice as long as gas models and do not get a lot of sediment at the bottom of the tank as gas units do.

I'm sure that it's at LEAST 12 years old
Are you saying the elements need to be replaced based on age?
Or the entire water heater?
If it's the latter, & it's probably on it's last leg, will changing the elements help for now?
At least until I can afford to replace the whole thing?

 

[L. Brown667]

The thermostat turns the top element on until the top of the tank is hot, then it switches to the bottom element. Most do not have both on at the same time. With only the top element working, or a faulty thermostat, you'd not have a lot of hot water volume.

Your voltage sensing device can mislead you, as you can have voltage present, but there's not a complete path for the current to flow. Most water heaters use both L1 and L2, so both elements might have L1 or L2 attached, but only when the other lead is connected to the element, will there be a path for current to flow. That's done by the thermostat. You really need a current reading device (ammeter), not just a voltage sensing device to tell if current is flowing through one of the elements. While the voltage enables it to work, it doesn't until there is current flowing. You can sort of think of voltage as the pressure, and current as the volume. Pressure doesn't mean volume.

I understand that having voltage doesn't mean it's working
But doesn't checking for continuity tell you if there's a path for the current to follow?
I'm not sure if I'm using the right terminology so I hope that question made sense

 

[L. Brown667]

Since I'm going to replace the elements anyway, I figure I might as well flush it while I'm at it
But the drain valve doesn't look like any other one I've seen
It almost looks like it's not drainable (is that even a word??)
Here is a picture of it w/ the hose attached
Do I just turn the piece behind the hose or ???

 

[Phog]

If you are sometimes seeing rusty brown water then you are on a countdown to tank leaking. You could have a good while or no time left at all, it's hard to say.

The short answer to your question is yes you should be able to get the unit back to making hot water with some combination of thermostats and elements and buy yourself some extra time. They sell kits with 2 elements and both thermostats that aren't very expensive at all. You could replace everything or just use the parts you need.

But it would be a good idea to make preparations for your next tank because with the age & symptoms you're describing it really sounds like you're on borrowed time. I'm not sure what size your tank is but 3500W / 40gal electric tanks are under $400 at the big box home center, if you're DIY minded and that size would suffice.

PS- Regarding the drain, you just turn the big white ring the same as if you're turning on a garden faucet. Sometimes on older tanks no flow comes out due to the sediment build up

 

[L. Brown667]

Also, I live in a pretty small town
If I can find them locally, they'll likely be way more expensive than usual
I ordered an element for

If you are sometimes seeing rusty brown water then you are on a countdown to tank leaking. You could have a good while or no time left at all, it's hard to say.

The short answer to your question is yes you should be able to get the unit back to making hot water with some combination of thermostats and elements and buy yourself some extra time. They sell kits with 2 elements and both thermostats that aren't very expensive at all. You could replace everything or just use the parts you need.

But it would be a good idea to make preparations for your next tank because with the age & symptoms you're describing it really sounds like you're on borrowed time. I'm not sure what size your tank is but 3500W / 40gal electric tanks are under $400 at the big box home center, if you're DIY minded and that size would suffice.

PS- Regarding the drain, you just turn the big white ring the same as if you're turning on a garden faucet. Sometimes on older tanks no flow comes out due to the sediment build up

I'm not 100% sure my description of "rust colored" is accurate
I might describe it more like dirty looking
Either way tho, if there's sediment in the tank, will the water look different when the water 1st comes on?
Either way, I'm sure you're right and it's on its last leg
I'm willing to try to diy a lot of things but I think replacing the whole thing is above my skill level
I kinda figured turning that ring would flush it but wanted to be sure
Thanks for your info

If you are sometimes seeing rusty brown water then you are on a countdown to tank leaking. You could have a good while or no time left at all, it's hard to say.

The short answer to your question is yes you should be able to get the unit back to making hot water with some combination of thermostats and elements and buy yourself some extra time. They sell kits with 2 elements and both thermostats that aren't very expensive at all. You could replace everything or just use the parts you need.

But it would be a good idea to make preparations for your next tank because with the age & symptoms you're describing it really sounds like you're on borrowed time. I'm not sure what size your tank is but 3500W / 40gal electric tanks are under $400 at the big box home center, if you're DIY minded and that size would suffice.

PS- Regarding the drain, you just turn the big white ring the same as if you're turning on a garden faucet. Sometimes on older tanks no flow comes out due to the sediment build up

I'm not 100% sure my description of "rust colored" is accurate
I might describe it more like dirty looking
Either way tho, if there's sediment in the tank, will the water look different when the water 1st comes on?
Either way, I'm sure you're right and it's on its last leg
I'm willing to try to diy a lot of things but I think replacing the whole thing is above my skill level
I kinda figured turning that ring would flush it but wanted to be sure
Thanks for your info

 

[Phog]

You shouldn't typically see sediment or anything else coming out of the tank top hot water port, just clear water. It's possible that you have some galvanized pipe in the hot water line that could be adding color to the water too & it's not coming from the tank. It could also be black rubber from inside a deteriorating flex line or something else like that. If it is coming from the tank that's a bad sign.

When you flush the tank bottom spray the hose out into a 5 gallon pail to collect the sediment and see what you get. If it's a bunch of rust particles then you'll have your answer. You can also look in through the hole with a flashlight when you're changing the element and see what you can see, if the tank inside walls look like pictures of the Titanic on the ocean bottom that's another bad sign.

12+yrs is a pretty good lifespan for an electric water tank. Some people get 20+yrs and will be glad to brag about it, most get significantly less than that though and 10-15yrs is probably most common replacement interval. Not saying yours is about to go, just giving you the lay of the land.

 

[Jadnashua]

Make sure you have refilled and purged all air out of the tank before you turn it back on or your elements will probably be toast, at least the top one.

Continuity of the element does not mean the thermostat is applying power. Typically, only one side is switched, so you could sense the voltage but there's no complete path for current.

 

[L. Brown667]

You shouldn't typically see sediment or anything else coming out of the tank top hot water port, just clear water. It's possible that you have some galvanized pipe in the hot water line that could be adding color to the water too & it's not coming from the tank. It could also be black rubber from inside a deteriorating flex line or something else like that. If it is coming from the tank that's a bad sign.

When you flush the tank bottom spray the hose out into a 5 gallon pail to collect the sediment and see what you get. If it's a bunch of rust particles then you'll have your answer. You can also look in through the hole with a flashlight when you're changing the element and see what you can see, if the tank inside walls look like pictures of the Titanic on the ocean bottom that's another bad sign.

12+yrs is a pretty good lifespan for an electric water tank. Some people get 20+yrs and will be glad to brag about it, most get significantly less than that though and 10-15yrs is probably most common replacement interval. Not saying yours is about to go, just giving you the lay of the land.

I'm pretty sure it's getting ready to go
At least it won't be a surprise so I can nip it in the bud instead of coming home to a flood!

 

[L. Brown667]

A friend that lives in the same town told me that when they drained their water heater, they had chunks of crud that looked like rock salt come out
So I decided to go ahead and drain mine even tho it's probably on it's last leg...kinda like giving it it's last wish
So I hooked up the hose, turned on the kitchen faucet, turned the water off at the tank, cut the power and started turning the big ring and.....nothin!
I had to use pliers to get it to turn at 1st then was able to do it by hand
At one point, I had to use the pliers again for about a 1/2 turn, then could keep doing it by hand
I don't know how many times I turned it but it was enough that I'd think I should have seen at least a trickle
I finally started to slowly disconnect the hose and water did start barely dripping out
It looked really dirty
I thought maybe the hose had some dirt in it but the water was definitely coming out of the heater
Here's a couple (hopefully) better pics of the drain valve...
I designated with arrows because I'm not sure my terminology is right

So should I keep turning that big ring? (Red arrow)
Is it possible the nut behind it (blue arrow) needs to be opened a little bit?
Or will that not disconnect everything and leave me with a mess?

 

[Jadnashua]

Is this where the water will make a major mess? If so, probably not much you can do. Otherwise, if a little water isn't going to be a huge deal, with the valve open, take something like a wire coat hanger and poke it in there to break up the minerals that have accumulated. If you get it to flow, shut the valve, put your hose back on, and open it again to see what you get.

 

[HudsonDIY]

+1 for what jadnashua said. I recently changed out my old unit which had been in service since 2004. The amount of crud in the bottom of the WH was shocking. I obviously had to drain it to replace and the coat hanger trick worked for me. I had to work at it and luckily, or unluckily, the WH is on a shelf in the garage so I could set a bucket underneath and work at it until I got a good flow. I got a full two inches of crud in the bucket before it started flowing enough to put the hose back on.

 

[Dj2]

+2 what jadnashua said.
But frankly, you are messing with the wrong WH and wasting time, energy and money.
At this point, I'd go out and bring home a new WH.
This kind of drain bibb was used many, many years ago.
Just for kicks can you take a pic of the label on the WH and post it?

 

[Reach4]

his kind of drain bibb was used many, many years ago.

If you will keep that WH and try to clean it, you can unscrew that old plastic drain, and put in a Rheem SP12231B or AP12231C-1 (the longer one). Those have a big bore, and a straight shot. You could stick a wand in there. I have wondered if there was a small-tip electric pressure washer that would fit.

For less money, there are others decent brass drain valves.

This is not to say that a new WH would not be your best option.

 

[L. Brown667]

When you flush the tank bottom spray the hose out into a 5

Is this where the water will make a major mess? If so, probably not much you can do. Otherwise, if a little water isn't going to be a huge deal, with the valve open, take something like a wire coat hanger and poke it in there to break up the minerals that have accumulated. If you get it to flow, shut the valve, put your hose back on, and open it again to see what you get.

It could be a little messy
But I've got plenty of towels and a shop vac
Plus, it's right by the back door so it's not like it would flood the whole house

 

[L. Brown667]

+2 what jadnashua said.
But frankly, you are messing with the wrong WH and wasting time, energy and money.
At this point, I'd go out and bring home a new WH.
This kind of drain bibb was used many, many years ago.
Just for kicks can you take a pic of the label on the WH and post it?

I know it's probably a waste of time to drain it since it's probably thisdamnclose to going out completely
But....A. I'm really curious to know what kind of nasty crud is in there and
B. I can't afford a new WH right now
So if I can baby it a little and get another month out of it, I figure, "Why not?!?"

 

[Reach4]

I know it's probably a waste of time to drain it since it's probably thisdamnclose to going out completely
But....A. I'm really curious to know what kind of nasty crud is in there and
B. I can't afford a new WH right now
So if I can baby it a little and get another month out of it, I figure, "Why not?!?"

See https://terrylove.com/forums/index....o-flush-a-hot-water-heater.79444/#post-576623

 

[L. Brown667]

See https://terrylove.com/forums/index....o-flush-a-hot-water-heater.79444/#post-576623

Ya know, I was thinking it would make more sense to have pressure to push all the gunk out
But every single thing I've read and every video I've watched said to cut the power and water off
I thought maybe it had something to do with the thermostat trying to keep up with the water going thru it so fast
I'm gonna try it with the power and water on... unless I chicken out and decide to go with(out) the flow haha