Help with CSV setup

Discussion in 'Pumps and Tanks Well Forum & Blog. Water is life.' started by s10010001, Jul 17, 2019.

  1. s10010001

    s10010001 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2019
    Location:
    Texas
    Hello,

    Im doing a ton of learning on well wanter since our new house has it. We move in on Friday!

    The current setup is as follows, in order:
    -500' well, pump down there
    -2500 gal tank above ground, with float switch for well pump
    -Grundfos SCALA2 booster pump (leaking a little)
    -30/50 pressure switch
    -86 gallon pressure tank
    -Basic GE 10x4.5" all-in-one house filter
    -Water softener I know little about still

    Problem:
    PSI dips pretty low once that tank drains, it sits at 35 while not in use.

    Wants:
    I would like it to be +40 PSI all the time for showers and my RO.
    no hammering
    RELIABLE

    Question:
    So im reading in to the CSV setups and they make sense to me why their so reliable. If I were to change my setup in advance (vs fixing the leaking pump) what kind of jet pump should I be looking at? anyone have a specific pump for a single family 1 story home.

    New pump + CSV + 40/60 switch + smaller pressure tank... sound about right? (and a better filter setup once I test the water and confirm what it needs)
     
  2. valveman

    valveman Cary Austin Staff Member

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2006
    Occupation:
    Pump Controls Technician
    Location:
    Lubbock, Texas
    You are on the right track. You need a good pump like a Goulds J10S. Then the CSV, switch, tank, etc., are all in the PK1A kit.
     
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  4. s10010001

    s10010001 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2019
    Location:
    Texas
    Excellent! I talked with my wife and I think were gonna buy that PK1A kit from cyclestopvalves.com.

    more questions now lol, that's how its works right.

    1. Would it be worth using my 86 gallon pressure tank with a the CSV, sounds like over kill but I will already have it and I guess its pretty new. Or the 10 gallon upgrade will be more than enough? I do like that its much much smaller!


    2. How does the pumps internal pressure switch come into play? I see the Goulds J10S has an adjustment for it. Just adjust it to max and let the 40/60 pressure switch do the work?
     
  5. valveman

    valveman Cary Austin Staff Member

    Joined:
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    Occupation:
    Pump Controls Technician
    Location:
    Lubbock, Texas
    You can use any size tank with the CSV. An 86 gallon size tank holds 20 gallons of water. You will not see the strong 50 PSI constant pressure from the CSV until the pressure drops from 60 all the way to 40 and the pump starts. With a 3 GPM shower the pressure will be decreasing for the first 7 minutes. With a small tank the pump is on and the pressure is strong and constant before you get the temp adjusted in the shower. The CSV will still give constant pressure when using water for longer than 7 minutes. Just order the PK1A less tank, and plumb over to the large tank. You can always screw a small tank onto the CSV1A after the 86 gallon tank fails, or if you get tired of waiting for the good pressure.
     
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  6. s10010001

    s10010001 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2019
    Location:
    Texas
    Ok, I got a Goulds J10S ordered and it will show up on Friday and th4 PK1A kit has been delivered. I was going to just grab a tractor supply 1hp jet pump, but I ran across the J10S with prime so I grabbed it. I also ordered a iSpring WGB21B 2-Stage filter setup to replace the crusty old GE Smart water single 10x4.5 in the well house now.

    My Plan:
    -Tear down the nasty well house (with no removable roof)
    -Remove all the old crap (86gal tank, leaking booster, mess of plumbing and glue)
    -Install the PK1a and J10S with new clean plumbing, closer to the well head
    -Fix all the insulation
    -Use a cover of some kind, like a big fake rock or green poly dome thing instead of a little "house"
    -Install the iSpring filters in the garage, in front of the softener to clean things up

    Questions:
    1. Any issues moving the filters from the well house to the garage? My logic can't come up with a reason not to.. its in the same position on the line, between PK1A and Softener.

    2. Anything special to wiring up the J10S? its just a 110 pump right? Im not sure if it comes with a power cord or I just romex to it.

    3. Any suggestions for heating it in the winter? There is a little space heater in there now, but I figured I would see what's "optimal"
     
  7. Reach4

    Reach4 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2013
    Location:
    IL
    Acording to https://terrylove.com/forums/index.php?threads/help-gould-j10s.7353/ it comes set for 230, but can be set for 115.

    If the run is long, there is an advantage to 23o. If you have a space in your breaker panel, it is possible to use your black and white NM (e.g., Romex) to feed 240 if you mark the white.
     
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  8. valveman

    valveman Cary Austin Staff Member

    Joined:
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    Occupation:
    Pump Controls Technician
    Location:
    Lubbock, Texas
    Filters in the house are fine. Use the pressure switch that comes with the PK1A and wire around the switch that comes on the side of the J10S as per instructions. I prefer 230V but 115V will work. I like the pump house heaters or the oil filled radiator looking type that don't get hot enough to burn and have a thermostat.

    I did't hear you mention a check valve? Metal, spring loaded, poppet style on the suction line is best.
     
  9. s10010001

    s10010001 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2019
    Location:
    Texas
    thanks again for the info

    I’ll need to confirm there’s no 230 in the house, there might be actually. It’s only 20 yards or so from the power pole and breaker. There is room on my breaker, I could swap it to 230 if that’s ideal.

    I’ll look into to heater options. Is there a reason people build theses little houses over the wells vs just the smaller poly covers? I don’t like the house, kinda distracting from the house IMO.
     
  10. valveman

    valveman Cary Austin Staff Member

    Joined:
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    Occupation:
    Pump Controls Technician
    Location:
    Lubbock, Texas
    115V will work. And you just got to keep it from freezing whatever that takes.
     
  11. Reach4

    Reach4 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2013
    Location:
    IL
    How will you power the heater?

    I think if you are planning to use the same buried 15 or 20 AWG wires to power the pump and the heater, you are supposed to put a subpanel under that mock rock. And I expect you would need to go to 240 to have enough power for the subpanel to power the pump and the heater.

    If you are putting in new wires, then they will be separate pairs from the breaker box.
     
  12. s10010001

    s10010001 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2019
    Location:
    Texas


    There is a sub panel in the well house, with some real heavy wires feeding it from the main breaker on the pole.

    Also there is 230v in there, 2x 60a (30x2) breakers and a separate 115 20a. So plenty of power.

    One of the 60a breakers is feeding the in ground well pump that keeps the storage tank topped off and The other is run to the current booster pump. The 20a 115v is going to two lights and a little space heater that not currently plugged in.

    what the deal with the check valve? Where do I need that installed? What’s it for?
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2019
  13. valveman

    valveman Cary Austin Staff Member

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    Occupation:
    Pump Controls Technician
    Location:
    Lubbock, Texas
    A check valve is a one way valve that keeps water from going back through the pump and emptying back into the storage tank. It is usually best to have one on the suction side of the pump, but it can also be placed on the discharge side before the CSV.
     
  14. s10010001

    s10010001 Member

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    Jul 17, 2019
    Location:
    Texas
    Makes sense, Looking around I see there is currently one in the loop before the leaky variable booster pump. Pickup a new one to install inline before the pump just top have all new parts.

    I think I have just about all the info I need, and the parts will be here Friday. So with any luck I will post back some pictures when I'm done! I still haven't decided if I want to tear down my well house or not, its awful big in my front yard for no reason.

    Thank you!
     
  15. s10010001

    s10010001 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2019
    Location:
    Texas
    I got it all installed! So exciting! I missed installing the check valve before the jet pump and was loosing my pressure back into the holding tank causing the pump to cycle on and off. It was getting late and dark, time got away from me. once I installed the heck valve between the holding tank and pump the system is working perfectly. It took a while to purge the air out of the how water but its all good now.

    So I just have some cleanup to do, I have a leak (2-3 drips per min) on the check valve fitting I put on in haste (9pm) So I will go buy some new fittings and that peace. Then insulate the pipes, mount the power box to a little frame and take some pictures! I will need to come up with a cover before the rainy cold season but im not sure what I want to do for that so thats on hold
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2019
    valveman and Reach4 like this.
  16. s10010001

    s10010001 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2019
    Location:
    Texas
    OK, here is my setup so far. Im trying to figure out a simple cover solution for it. I am kinda wanting to route the pipes under the concrete up so I can cover it all without holes. IDK. Its working REALLY REALLY well (hehe) so im gonna take a break for a little bit and work on other stuff. I have time before its rain season again.

    Question: There was two pipes hooked up to the output before. one was clearly going to the house, the other I have no idea, so I did not hook it up. I plumbed in a little bit so I can easily hook it up if needed. All of my water valves in the house work so I really dont know. I don't have any sprinklers (that I know 0f).

    The septic systems doesn't need a water hookup does it? I don't see one going there and the inspector that gave me an overview of the system didn't mention it.
     

    Attached Files:

  17. valveman

    valveman Cary Austin Staff Member

    Joined:
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    Occupation:
    Pump Controls Technician
    Location:
    Lubbock, Texas
    Looks really good! No the septic doesn't need a fresh water line. You might connect the hose to the extra pipe and see where the water comes out.
     
  18. Reach4

    Reach4 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2013
    Location:
    IL
    PVC should be protected from long term UV exposure. Paint would be one way to to protect the pipe from the sun.
     
  19. s10010001

    s10010001 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2019
    Location:
    Texas
    Thanks! The line was hooked up to the old pressure booster pump. I thought it was weird, so I only left on plugged in. I picked the one that obviously went to the house. The other one shoots off towards the back yard it looks like. I guessed right, because everything in the house works... maybe I will find a random hose faucet in my back acre at some point haha. We just moved here so some clean up is needed.

    Sounds good. I do plan on getting a cover, and insulating any hose outside of the cover and above ground. Paint, thats a good idea! good to know.
     
  20. valveman

    valveman Cary Austin Staff Member

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2006
    Occupation:
    Pump Controls Technician
    Location:
    Lubbock, Texas
    That extra pipe could have been for a two pipe jet pump. Glad you picked the right one. :)
     
  21. s10010001

    s10010001 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2019
    Location:
    Texas
    Yea IDK, there is only one pipe coming into my house. I dug up a little more of the secon line, it looks like it followings the two lines going to the tank (Well to Tank, Tank to well house). Im gonna go look around in on the tank and that side of my back yard. Im willing to bet someone just added a water spigot back there. It might work out, my wife wants me to build her a green house. So if the pipe is going back there that would really help me out :)
     
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