Help me understand my kindof complex well water system

[Rx1559]

Geez, there's always something breaking or not working right with our water system! I am eager to learn how I can do my own repairs and how I can increase the reliability of this system!

But our water system components never seem to quite match up to what's on the various YouTube videos and diagrams I see on the web, and I while I have learned a lot just reading through these forums, I am struggling to understand what a few of the components do!

Most recent issue: storage tank is almost empty. So I have to push the 'reset' button on the bottom of my pump control box. After about 20 seconds, water will come out of the wellhead spigot, and shortly after, it will then make it to the storage tank and fill for about 10 minutes, then the fill rate will start to fluctuate a bit and slowly diminsh, until it just stops entirely. Then I have to repeat the process. One smoking gun is a VERY LOUD humming coming from the solenoid valve on the storage tank input. Didn't use to hum like that. Another smoking gun is that, over the past 4 months, I would have to push the pump control box reset button after a power outage -- never had to do that in the past.

So anyway, maybe someone can help me understand a few things:

• Why is there a little 2g pressure tank at the wellhead? Why doesn't the well simply pump directly into the 5000g storage tank when the lower float switch kicks it on, and shuts off when the upper float switch tells it to stop? (Note that the gauage upstream of this tank indicates 0 PSI when the well pump is off, and jumps to about 50 PSI about 20 seconds after the pump kicks on)
  
• Why is there a solenoid valve on the storage tank's water input? Note that there are 3-4 old solenoid valves and PVC parts that have been cut out and littered around, so I suspect this thing fails all the time. To prevent backflow, I would expect one or two check valves on the downtube. But I am at a loss to understand why there needs to be electronic flow control here.

What follows are some pictures and descriptions. Hopefully someone can educate me a little better on how this thing works!

Overview:
4BD 5BA house; the well drilling guru said he's never seen a well run dry in this area in the 50 years he's been in business; our water conditioner guy said our water's iron, hardness, etc is "perfect" and doesn't need any conditioning other the perhaps a big green silt filter.

At the well head:

• 1.5hp pump and new wiring, that is about 3 years old
• 300' deep well with a ~6" bore
• CentriPro Pump Control Box model CB15412CR, for a 1.5hp 230v 10A 3450RPM pump
• Pressure Switch: SquareD 40/60 PSI
• PumpSaver Plus that always has its green "run" lite on
• Goulds HydroPro Water Systems inline tank V6P100 (2 gallon)

This then goes into the ground, and runs about 1000 feet to the storage tank location.

At the storage tank:

• 5000 gallon poly cal plastics tank
• (2) Goulds booster pump model 25GBC10 (25 GPM, 1HP)
  
• (1) Westank Hydropneumatic bladder tank
• (1) Goulds Hydropro V250D pressure booster tank (83.5 gallons)

 

[LLigetfa]

Why is there a little 2g pressure tank at the wellhead?

Because the well pump is (or was) controlled by a pressure switch. That also explains why there is a solenoid valve at the storage tank inlet. The float switch opens the solenoid valve which causes the pressure to drop and the switch to call for water. If the gauge reads 0 when the pump is not running, either the gauge is bad or the system wiring was changed. At least that was the intent of those components at some time in the well's history. You need to follow the wiring to figure out the configured logic now.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Valveman]

Having to push the reset button on the control box means the motor is drawing too many amps. Waiting 20 seconds for water and pressure means your solenoid may not be being used anymore, and the float switch could be wired to turn on the well pump directly. If there are wires from the float switch to the well pump, you don't need the pressure tank, pressure switch, or solenoid valve.

 

[Reach4]

ost recent issue: storage tank is almost empty. So I have to push the 'reset' button on the bottom of my pump control box. After about 20 seconds, water will come out of the wellhead spigot, and shortly after, it will then make it to the storage tank and fill for about 10 minutes, then the fill rate will start to fluctuate a bit and slowly diminsh, until it just stops entirely.

Measure and note the current through the common wire when you push the reset button. Continue to monitor until the pump starts pumping, and as the pump is delivering water until the fluctuations start. Normally the current will decrease slowly as the well is drawn down, and if the fluctuations are due to running out of water, the current would decrease more then. But if the current decreases, the topside overload should not trip. A clamp-around ammeter is how well wire current is measured these days.

Another test would be to measure the current through the start winding (red wire) during the 20 second delay. If that is low, that could indicate a weak start capacitor. However that start capacitor should not contribute to the cutout after 10 minutes.

Another test would be to measure the voltage from the breaker panel. The voltage is unusually across the outer two terminals on the pressure switch. I am not a pro.

Also, what is your static water level (the depth to the water surface when no water is being drawn for a while)?

 

[Rx1559]

Wow, thank you for your prompt responses! So my well pump is, or at one point was intended to be, switched on/off by a pressure controlled turn-on switch. That totally makes sense looking at the well head components! Exactly where are the two end-points of the pressurized system? One would be at the water tank, on that solenoid valve... but at the well head, where would the other end be? I don't see any valves above-ground at the well head: There is a pressure gauge, the pressure tank, and the square-D pressure switch, but I don't believe any of those actually have a valve to open/close the water pipe. Perhaps there is a check-valve somewhere on the drop pipe, are those often used to close off a pressurized system? I don't know what those look like.

In the meantime I'm going to shut off the breakers and clean up the leaves and try to follow the wires around to see what I find. I guess I'm also going to call my well guy, because the tank is almost empty and I don't think my sleuth work will yield any fruit until well after we have run out of water, but maybe I'll learn enough to ask some compelling questions.

As for the static water level -- I would assume to find this out would require pulling the well head and visually inspecting how far down the drop pipe is dry? It would be interesting to know for sure, next time I have to have this done.

 

[Reach4]

I don't see any valves above-ground at the well head: There is a pressure gauge, the pressure tank, and the square-D pressure switch, but I don't believe any of those actually have a valve to open/close the water pipe. Perhaps there is a check-valve somewhere on the drop pipe, are those often used to close off a pressurized system?

There is a check valve in, and/or just above, the submersible pump. There should not normally be a higher check valve.

If you run wires between the well head and the tank, you could totally control the fill with just the float switch. The wires could carry well power, or could just carry a control signal. A "deluxe" control box has a relay to let a lower current control the big power to the well pump.

 

[Rx1559]

So the well guys came. It is indeed a pressurized system, and there is an above-ground failed check valve (debris was blocking the seal) that was replaced, and also a failed check valve (or a hole) somewhere in the drop pipe that we'll address next time I need to pull the pump. The PumpSaver was not working correctly and was replaced, and the pump control box needed replacing. Additionally, the seal on the well casing that I just had replaced is slightly too small, and needs replaced again. Furthermore, there is a leak somewhere between the new check valve on the wellhead, and the solenoid at the storage tank. With the way things are going, I would be willing to bet it's a pipe leak that is under concrete.