Help drain line question for Water Softener

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Rich617

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I currently don't have a drain line near where I'm planning on installing my water softener. I'll be installing my water softener inside my garage directly on the opposite end of where the main water line is coming from outside.

I'm planning on drilling a hole through the sheet rock and stone siding and routing my drain line from inside the garage outside to the cleanout at the flower bed. Researching through this forum I found that it should be ok as long as I have a stand pipe, p-trap and an air gap then I can connect to my cleanout line. The stand pipe, p-trap and air gap will be inside the garage next to my water softener.

I'll be getting a wye or tee and connecting it directly to where the clean out is at. One end will be connected to the new drainage line. The other end will have a cleanout cap on it.

Just wanting confirmation that this plan should be ok.

My next question is that I'll be drilling a hole through my stone siding and would like to minimize the hole size as much as possible. What is the smallest pipe diameter I should use for a drain line will it be 1 1/2"? Also, any of you have tips on drilling a hole through stone siding? I'll probably use a diamon/carbide hole saw and add water to it while drilling it.

https://imgur.com/a/FdhlGn2
 

Reach4

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My next question is that I'll be drilling a hole through my stone siding and would like to minimize the hole size as much as possible. What is the smallest pipe diameter I should use for a drain line will it be 1 1/2"?
5/8 OD 1/2 ID would be good. That would correspond to 1/2 inch CPVC or 1/2 inch copper or 1/2 inch PEX. For flex tubing, I guess that could be 1/2 inch ID but don't use the thinnest stuff that will collapse easily.

For a 10 inch softener, the drain will pass about 2.4 gpm, and for a 12 inch that would be 3.5 gpm.

A backwashing filter would have higher flows in the drain line.
 

Reach4

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Is the air gap also a vent or does it need a vent after the P trap and before entering the sewage drain line on the outside?
An AAV 2 or more pipe diameters after the U of the trap is a vent. You still should have an air gap.
 

Jeff H Young

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airgap protects the drain from softener from getting contaminated and getting into the water supply.
the vent protects trap from siphoning and having an open stink pipe . of cource its out doors but we dont allow open sewer lines anywhere. installing an AAV properly will work fine. I avoid AAV personaly and never have been convinced or certain they meet our code in UPC and or California. but they are in widespread use.
using one (aav ) outdoors like that , I cant really fault and see no reall problem with it. I just reserve actually recomending it since Im not sure its code
 
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Rich617

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Thanks Guys! I think I got it now. I'll install an AAV right after the P-trap inside the garage.

https://imgur.com/a/GjNMY6U

GjNMY6U
 

Rich617

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While researching more I just found that AAV are illegal in CA. I think I'm just going to run 50 feet of 1/2" tubing across the garage and down a sink.
 

Reach4

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While researching more I just found that AAV are illegal in CA. I think I'm just going to run 50 feet of 1/2" tubing across the garage and down a sink.
That will work. The softener service manual says to use 3/4, but 1/2 will work fine.

PVC or CPVC might look better. If you inject the drainage with 1/2 inch pipe or tubing one inch above the rim of the sink, that will be sufficient air gap.
You can also route the drain up, across, and then down if that is a better path
 

Jeff H Young

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While researching more I just found that AAV are illegal in CA. I think I'm just going to run 50 feet of 1/2" tubing across the garage and down a sink.
Thats why I dont recomend the AAV. I hear the same that they arent legal here Personaly cant confirm havent seen the code myself if you have more info go aheadvand let us know. All I know is I keep hearing they are illegal
 

Rich617

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Yeah I didn't find anything in the code just reading what others have wrote on this forum and other places. Looks like in California they want all drain line to vent above the house. Also read somewhere that mentioned water softener drain line should be no more than 30 feet so that might have put an end to my second plan of running it to the sink. It'll be below the 8 feet from softener drain line.

My next issues is my main water line goes from 1-1/2" copper from the outside and then inside the walls it elbows up another foot then transition to 1-1/2" PEX A. I'll probably have to change the 1-1/2" to 1" or 3/4" Pex A depending on which softener I go with. Currently looking at the Fleck 5600SXT or 9100SXT for a 2500 sqft two story 3 bathroom house. Currently 3 people living probably max amount of people will be ~5. Will the transition to a more restrictive (smaller diameter) pipe mess with my water pressure/flow for my faucet/shower head/outdoor spigot?

The more I look into this the more I think I might end up just hiring a plumber for this job.
 

Reach4

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Also read somewhere that mentioned water softener drain line should be no more than 30 feet so that might have put an end to my second plan of running it to the sink. It'll be below the 8 feet from softener drain line.
If you are potentially worried by "elsewhere", maybe look in the service manual for your softener.

For the 5810 or 5812 the service manual says
The pipe size for a residential drain line​
should be a minimum of 1/2" (13 mm). Backwash flow rates
in excess of 7 gpm (26.5 Lpm) or drain line length in excess
of 20' (6 m) require 3/4" (19 mm) drain line.

Will the transition to a more restrictive (smaller diameter) pipe mess with my water pressure/flow for my faucet/shower head/outdoor spigot?
Not really, regardless of how I interpret that within reason.

Don't route the softener water to a spigot that will be used to water plants.
 

Bannerman

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The drain line directly from the softener will be pressurized by the water supply. The drain line length can usually be extended a considerable distance so discharging to your sink or through an air gap to a dishwasher type drain connection below the sink should be OK. Recommend increasing the pipe diameter to reduce flow restriction through the extended length to ensure the correct drain flow rate needed to correctly backwash the softening resin. Poly pipe will usually allow one continuous run with fittings typically only needed at each end.

Your drawing for the exterior connection shows the 1.5" standpipe drain being reduced to 3/4" after the P-trap. As positive water pressure from the softener's drain line will be eliminated where the 1/2" line is discharged into the 1.5" standpipe which will then flow more slowly the remaining distance by gravity, restricting the rain pipe diameter will likely cause drain water to back up within the standpipe which may lead to overflow. The diameter required for DWV piping is typically 1.5" or larger.

I'll probably have to change the 1-1/2" to 1" or 3/4" Pex A depending on which softener I go with.

As the 1.5" copper transitions to 1.5" PEX, the smaller ID for PEX will be approx equivalent to 1.25". The connections to water treatment equipment are not to be reduced so an appropriate control valve will be needed. A Fleck 5600 and 9100 will be inappropriate. Consider a softener equipped with a Fleck 5812 or Clack WS 1.25 control valve.
 
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