Fleck 5600 SXT not suctioning brine.

[sully5981]

So I have read this https://terrylove.com/forums/index....-technician-is-scratching-is-head-help.73584/ extensively.

I have tried everything to included replacing the entire brine injector assembly. For some reason during brine draw, water flows out instead of suctioning. I am almost to the point of just getting a whole new system. The brine tank float assembly seem to be working good. I am kinda scratching my head lost now. Does anyone know what else it could possibly be before I get an entire new fleck 5600sxt? Also drain flow during brine draw is strong too.

For background the system is about 5 years old and has worked flawlessly sorta (the water meter counter will work off and on/get stuck, not really a big issue as the fleck can also regenerate after x days). But over all, no issues other than the recent brine draw problem.

 

[mbg225]

I had this issue and the washer in the drain line was facing the wrong direction. Once I turned it around so the beveled side was facing the unit the problem was solved.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[sully5981]

I had this issue and the washer in the drain line was facing the wrong direction. Once I turned it around so the beveled side was facing the unit the problem was solved.

I'll try flipping it around. you are talking about the rubber washer with the numbers on it? I asked cause i don't recall a beveled washer. the drain one has kind of a lip to it on one side and numbers on the other. Also it would be strange since i bought the injector assembly as a whole (put together) so hopefully who i bought it from (afwfilters) knows what they are doing.

 

[mbg225]

thats the one...if you look at the little who closely you will see where it is beveled to help channel the water going fast enough to create suction from the brine tank.

It may not be the problem but something to double check.

 

[Reach4]

I have tried everything to included replacing the entire brine injector assembly. For some reason during brine draw, water flows out instead of suctioning.

Water flows out? Into the brine tank or the drain? Water goes out of the drain during brine draw normally.

A rebuild kit would get you a new piston, seal set, and brine valve.

You did replace the brine injector assembly. What color is your injector? Injector has two parts, both the same color. The injector assembly would have those plus the injector screen.

 

[sully5981]

Water flows out? Into the brine tank or the drain? Water goes out of the drain during brine draw normally.

A rebuild kit would get you a new piston, seal set, and brine valve.

You did replace the brine injector assembly. What color is your injector? Injector has two parts, both the same color. The injector assembly would have those plus the injector screen.

Water flows both in the drain and into the brine tank during brine draw. Initially it was just no suction from the brine tank. So i cleaned everything and still no suction.

I replaced the whole assembly with https://store.afwfilters.com/fleck-...njector-drain-assembly-for-fleck-5600-valves/ and now it it flows into the brine tank a good amount instead of suctioning (both drain flow and brine flow during brine draw). the old assembly and new assembly both have white injectors as I have a 10inch tank.

 

[sully5981]

I had this issue and the washer in the drain line was facing the wrong direction. Once I turned it around so the beveled side was facing the unit the problem was solved.

just double checked, that washer was facing the right way.

 

[Reach4]

Water flows both in the drain and into the brine tank during brine draw. Initially it was just no suction from the brine tank. So i cleaned everything and still no suction.

So I expect you need new seals and softener piston, but there is one more thing to check first:

Is the VT setting set to dF1b? That would go along with the most common 5600sxt configuration. If not, what is yours set to?

 

[sully5981]

So I expect you need new seals and softener piston, but there is one more thing to check first:

Is the VT setting set to dF1b? That would go along with the most common 5600sxt configuration. If not, what is yours set to?

yea mine is set to df1b. I think it may be time to get it sent in for a rebuild? it is unfortunate as it has been only 4 years and 8 months. not sure how the warranty thing works for fleck.

 

[Reach4]

Water flows both in the drain and into the brine tank during brine draw. Initially it was just no suction from the brine tank. So i cleaned everything and still no suction.

As far as I can tell, your symptom is that the brine tank is full and stays full. Is that a fair statement?

You could remove the brine line from the softener, and see if you can suck brine. You probably could if you tried, but is it worth checking? A problem with the float valve could maybe stop flow. The air check valve could be stuck. A small air leak could prevent building the vacuum needed to suck brine.

 

[sully5981]

As far as I can tell, your symptom is that the brine tank is full and stays full. Is that a fair statement?

You could remove the brine line from the softener, and see if you can suck brine. You probably could if you tried, but is it worth checking? A problem with the float valve could maybe stop flow. The air check valve could be stuck. A small air leak could prevent building the vacuum needed to suck brine.

Yea that's pretty much the symptom.

I have tried sucking the water from the brine tank, works with no issues and a little bit nasty. I even tried getting the brine draw with water in the hose and the hose submerged in a bucket... still no suction and it fills the bucket even more.

 

[Reach4]

I have tried sucking the water from the brine tank, works with no issues and a little bit nasty. I even tried getting the brine draw with water in the hose and the hose submerged in a bucket... still no suction and it fills the bucket even more.

Good test. I think replacing piston and seals would be the action item here. Let's see if anybody has a different idea.

 

[Bannerman]

Rebuild the valve with new seals, spacers and O rings. These are wear items that are not warranty items. I suspect your water is chlorinated as the chlorine will cause the soft items to degrade more rapidly.

The piston will not likely need to be replaced unless the friction reducing coating is scratched or flaking.

You can order the rebuild kit and install it yourself as it is an easy task that does not require specialty tools.

https://www.softenerparts.com/fprbkse-sxt-downflow.htm

 

[Bannerman]

Double post

 

[sully5981]

Rebuild the valve with new seals, spacers and O rings. These are wear items that are not warranty items. I suspect your water is chlorinated as the chlorine will cause the soft items to degrade more rapidly.

The piston will not likely need to be replaced unless the friction reducing coating is scratched or flaking.

You can order the rebuild kit and install it yourself as it is an easy task that does not require specialty tools.

https://www.softenerparts.com/fprbkse-sxt-downflow.htm

Before i get the rebuild kit, i kinda want to rule out something else.

Does it seem right the brine plunger will activate before the drain flow. .. as in when the fleck is going through the brine draw cycle, it will activate the brine injector plunger and water will flow into the brine tank, then a couple seconds later, it will activate (move the main plunger) and the drain water will start flowing. is that the right order or does some timing seem off?

 

[Reach4]

Does it seem right the brine plunger will activate before the drain flow. .. as in when the fleck is going through the brine draw cycle, it will activate the brine injector plunger and water will flow into the brine tank, then a couple seconds later, it will activate (move the main plunger) and the drain water will start flowing. is that the right order or does some timing seem off?

Page 22 of the H revison of the service manual shows that the brine valve should be open during BD and BF.

If you are discussing how fast this opening and closing should happen, I don't know.
It is possible that the cam could wear and inhibit opening. If you think the valve is not opening during BD, I guess you could force it open for your testing. While drain flow happens during every cycle (not counting in-service) there may be a brief interruption as the path changes as the cycle changes.

 

[Bannerman]

The brine valve will be opened by the brine cam to allow suction created by slow rinse flow through the injector, to allow brine to be drawn from the brine tank into the injector which then flows into the media tank.

The position of the piston within the seals and spacers controls the flow path within the control valve. When a seal becomes worn or damaged, that can allow pressurized water to leak past which can cause flow to the brine port during Brine Draw when there should only be suction during that cycle.

When a seal(s) is damaged, that can cause friction on the piston, often slowing or even jamming the movement of the piston. This can alter when each stage of regeneration will commence, and in extreme cases, can cause the entire regeneration cycle to be extended several hours before completion, if it does ever finish.

 

[sully5981]

The brine valve will be opened by the brine cam to allow suction created by slow rinse flow through the injector, to allow brine to be drawn from the brine tank into the injector which then flows into the media tank.

The position of the piston within the seals and spacers controls the flow path within the control valve. When a seal becomes worn or damaged, that can allow pressurized water to leak past which can cause flow to the brine port during Brine Draw when there should only be suction during that cycle.

hmm, I think that helps. during brine draw, there is very high flow of the drain (as if it is doing a backwash). I'll watch the cams turn as brine draw is enabled. I will see the brine piston activate (which then starts water going into the brine tank), then a few seconds later, the main cam moves and then there is a high flow to the drain.

Hopefully it is the seals and spacers which i have just ordered. I was just wondering if the timing of the cams were off. Thank you for your help.

 

[Bannerman]

The highest flow to drain, is only during the Backwash and Rapid Rinse (sometimes called Rinse) stage of regeneration. For a 9" diameter tank, this will be typically 2.0 GPM, 2.4 GPM for 10" & 3.5 GPM for 12".

During Brine Draw (BD & Slow Rinse are combined as 1), the flow rate to drain will be low, often less than 1 GPM depending on which specific injector is installed.

If the flow rate to drain is high during Brine Draw, that can be another indicator of a worn or damaged seal.

 

[Reach4]

Inspect the piston carefully.
Use silicone release compound, such as Dow Corning 7 or Molykote 7 or Chemplex 862, lightly on the mating surfaces of the piston and seals.

https://terrylove.com/forums/index....y-wheel-not-rotating.90433/page-2#post-651370