Does this water heater install look off?

[DanDanDIYMan]

Had my hybrid water tank installed and not sure about the build out, something doesn't look quit right... Is it just me?

 

[hj]

I don't see the condensate drain line. Looks par for the course for a PEX installation.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Phog]

I don't see the condensate drain line. Looks par for the course for a PEX installation.

I think it's the uppermost line up near the top (the PVC one, not the lower two which are PEX). I don't see a T&P discharge line in the picture but i think that comes out on the other side of this unit, which is not shown in these pictures.

 

[DanDanDIYMan]

I think it's the uppermost line up near the top (the PVC one, not the lower two which are PEX). I don't see a T&P discharge line in the picture but i think that comes out on the other side of this unit, which is not shown in these pictures.

I think it's the uppermost line up near the top (the PVC one, not the lower two which are PEX). I don't see a T&P discharge line in the picture but i think that comes out on the other side of this unit, which is not shown in these pictures.

Thank you for your assistance, there are
no other connections other than those in the pics. But I can provide pics of the other side if that helps.

 

[DanDanDIYMan]

Thank you for your assistance, there are
no other connections other than those in the pics. But I can provide pics of the other side if that helps.

Also I'm noticing condensation on the exhaust hose that's dripping to the floor. Thinking I need insulated ducking?

 

[Phog]

There is another brass fitting about 2/3 of the way up the side which is the temperature/pressure relief valve. It should have a female threaded outlet connection pointed downward. Code usually specifies that a line be connected to this outlet, either terminating within 6-12" of the floor, or into a floor drain w/ a air gap, or to outside. (Code varies locally). You can have releases of boiling water or steam out of the T&P and so just having it spew directly outward without any kind of redirection tube is typically not allowed.

Regarding the exhaust duct, where does it go (outdoors?) and can you take a picture of the top of the unit where the "inlet" air connection is? It's hard to see what's going on in those pics.

 

[Dana]

I too am curious as to how & where it's ducted.

This may have been left over from the previous water heater installation, but looks like a gross hack burying valves in what was an insulated wall, and potentially a fire code violation if the water heater is in a garage :

 

[Sylvan]

I think it's the uppermost line up near the top (the PVC one, not the lower two which are PEX). I don't see a T&P discharge line in the picture but i think that comes out on the other side of this unit, which is not shown in these pictures.

I was called to Penfield (Rochester) to check a roof drain installation and when the law firm saw my bill from traveling (by car) to the job site they said for now on they will send pictures

Beautiful area

 

[Phog]

I was called to Penfield (Rochester) to check a roof drain installation and when the law firm saw my bill from traveling (by car) to the job site they said for now on they will send pictures

Beautiful area

Ha, bet that travel must have cost them a pretty penny, I've made that drive many times 5+ hrs each way. A lot of people don't realize that just because an address is in NY doesn't mean it's anywhere near NYC haha. My Aunt and uncle live in Penfield, definitely a beautiful area... Except for January and February I'm right downtown within the city limits.

 

[Phog]

I too am curious as to how & where it's ducted.

It almost looks like the exhaust spits into the wall cavity onto one of the studs. Hard to tell from the picture though.

 

[Reach4]

I was expecting a comment on the pressure tank laying on the floor. Now that I think about it, I guess it is OK.

 

[hj]

"fire code violation" with an electric heater? My hybrid does not have a "vent".

 

[Dana]

"fire code violation" with an electric heater? My hybrid does not have a "vent".

A fire code violation with a GARAGE not having the adequate fire barrier between the garage and conditioned space.

The fact that there's a water heater next to that breach in the timed fire barrier is irrelevant.

There are sometimes similar issues with a duct passing from a garage to the conditioned space too.

 

[Dana]

I was expecting a comment on the pressure tank laying on the floor. Now that I think about it, I guess it is OK.

At least the tank is adequately supported when resting on the slab. Even if a bit floppy it's a lot are harder to break PEX than if the expansion tank were hanging sideways & unsupported on copper plumbing.

 

[DanDanDIYMan]

Thank you all for your response!!! I'll take pics tomorrow but for now...
This is in a room on the lower level of the house so heated, the in wall copper piping is pre-existing from the old 50gal electric water tank (he had mentioned something about that setup missing something but I forgot what it was and he didn't change/add anything new to the copper piping), the expansion tank was reused from the old tank (not feeling warm and fuzzy with it just laying on the floor), the duck vent exit hole leads outside and the exterior vent housing/hood is pe-existing from a dryer I had there, the vent hose was installed and has silver vent tape sealing it to the wall which I noticed had lost about three inches of its seal on the underside of the hose and had air blowing out of it onto the house, the condensation is occurring on the vent hose more towards the tank (I'll take a pic).

 

[Phog]

When you take pictures please make sure to also snap one of the air intake for the heat pump (which is on top of the unit) and the outside dryer vent that your guy reused. (Looking at the the exhaust vent from the outside of the house).

I can tell you right off the bat that if you have a standard 4" dryer vent that is probably not sufficient airflow, that system really needs minimum 6" ducting for a short run and for longer runs recommended to upsize the duct further. If the heat pump can't breathe you're not going to get the energy savings from it. It also seems like you might be pulling conditioned air from the room and sending it outside. Which also defeats the energy savings.

I can also tell you right off the bat that reusing the expansion tank is not good, the part might look fine from the outside but they have a rubber bladder inside that is the "moving part" that does the expanding. That bladder breaks down and expansion tank then stops protecting your plumbing, expansion tanks have roughly the same 10yr lifespan as your hot water tank (in fact they more often than not stop working before the old water heater is replaced, contributing to eventual hot water tank failure).

The way to tell whether the expansion tank is still working correctly is to hook up a pressure gauge and check the system. And even if it is still working now it is 100% NOT going to last through 2 water heaters. For $35-$50 in parts cost it's not worth reusing. You also need to set the pressure on the expansion tank post-install using a bicycle pump & pressure gauge after installation FYI.

Just a guess here: it is not a licensed plumber that installed the unit? It is a very nice heat pump water heater but the install looks like a hack job that is going to negate the energy savings and possibly cause premature failure of the unit.

FYI i am not a plumber but several others here are.

 

[Dana]

Expansion tanks can outlive a water heater. Checking the charge and adjusting as-necessary when the new heater is installed would be fine, as long as the customer is aware of it.

If all that exposed insulation is on an exterior wall you have (apparently) a HUGE air and heat leak in that stud bay to be concerned about. In the winter the indoor air's dew point is every often higher than the temperature of the exterior sheathing, so when there's a big air leak on the interior side the sheathing takes up moisture from the indoors, presenting a mold/rot risk. In a temperate Seattle climate you can probably get away with that if it's on the sunny side of the house, but in colder climates or on the north side of the house it's a problem. Insulated walls need to be air tight, not merely insulated!

 

[Phog]

Expansion tanks can outlive a water heater. Checking the charge and adjusting as-necessary when the new heater is installed would be fine, as long as the customer is aware of it

While I agree completely with this assessment of expansion tank longevity, I don't share your optimism regarding most homeowners being savvy enough to do the necessary monitoring, adjustments, and eventual replacement non-concurrently with the water heater. 99% of people never check the T&P, and this falls into the same category of being something that gets mentioned once by the installer and forgotten forever about 5 minutes later by the homeowner. Plus, given the state of the ducting and the apparent lack of T&P discharge tube here, I seriously doubt the installer checked the expansion tank to see if it is even still functional now! For the low cost of the expansion tank and the PTFE thread tape required, I'm very pro-replacement on the same cadence as the water heater. Opinions may vary of course, but this is mine.

 

[Master Plumber Mark]

at least he installed a thermal expansion tank for you probably as best possible on the floor...
the plumber cannot be responsible for what he has to work with coming out of the wall and all...

The wirsbo pex is good material and I guess he did as best possible for the mess he had to deal with...
and he did install the unit into a pan for you.....

carry on

 

[Clog]

I don't share your optimism regarding most homeowners being savvy enough to do the necessary monitoring, adjustments, and eventual replacement non-concurrently with the water heater.

Now, now... you need more optimism than that.