I am guessing that you mean that the pump goes on every 15 minutes.
If so, your next leak is smaller than the one you found already.
Do I need a pressure tank?
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If so, your next leak is smaller than the one you found already.
Stephenson
Member
Gah ... yeah ...same sort of leak then, but smaller ...
Will that sort of cycle time damage the pump? I need it to keep the line pressurized to find additional leaks, right?
Will that sort of cycle time damage the pump? I need it to keep the line pressurized to find additional leaks, right?
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Losing 2 gallons every 15 minutes is an 8 gallon per hour leak. It won't hurt the pump too bad to cycle every 15 minutes. But 100 cycles per day is not good for the pump, so you need to find and fix the leak as soon as possible.
Stephenson
Member
Been trying to watch for cycles but can't stand around and wait ...been going back every few hours ... the loss if pressure may be less than yesterday ...
What would constitute a "normal" or "reasonable" loss of pressure on a system like this ...lake pump, small pressure tank with integrated irrigation system and 500 feet of line with three bibs?
What would constitute a "normal" or "reasonable" loss of pressure on a system like this ...lake pump, small pressure tank with integrated irrigation system and 500 feet of line with three bibs?
I would try to translate minutes into gallons. Right after the pump turns off because the pressure rose, open a faucet, and measure how much water comes out by the time that the pump turns on again. You can fill one or more buckets. You can use a 5-gallon bucket, and estimate the fullness. Or check for the change in weight.
If you had a larger tank, the cycle would be longer.
If you wanted to know how often the pump is cycling, you could get a time laps camera application for a smart phone and watch the pressure gauge.
Stephenson
Member
Latest ...
Sat and watched on and off as pressure dropped from 37 to 30 and made the switch.
Took one hour seven minutes ...
Then took no more than one second to pump up to shutoff at 50.
Sat and watched on and off as pressure dropped from 37 to 30 and made the switch.
Took one hour seven minutes ...
Then took no more than one second to pump up to shutoff at 50.
You need a new larger pressure tank. You old one is probably waterlogged in addition to being too small. Rule of thumb.... if you have a 10 GPM pump, you need about a 40 gallon pressure tank. That gives you about a 10 gallon drawdown, and that would let the pump run for a minute or more each time it turned on.
Stephenson
Member
Hmmm ...have a space and mounting limit on the size ...current FP7100-0 has around 2 gal drawdown ...it is a vertical tank mounted sideways (see photo) ...local folks have limited options (Flotec) ...how much larger can I got and still hang it horizontally off the pump?
You may not have much of a leak. The tank is bad if it only takes one second to pump up. So an hour to leak off maybe only a teaspoon of water. A CSV will make it take longer to fill a pressure tank, then a 4.5 gallon size tank like the one you have would be all you need, And you can mount the tank in any position.
Stephenson
Member
Thanks, valveman ...
Does the CSV mount between the T and the pressure tank in my application? Is the CSV strong enough to hang the tank on horizontally?
Does the CSV mount between the T and the pressure tank in my application? Is the CSV strong enough to hang the tank on horizontally?
Yes
Cacher_Chick
Test, Don't Guess!
When there is no leak and no water being used, the pressure should hold steady for weeks without any loss.
Stephenson
Member
Out of town couple days ...
Found new Flotec 7100 tank same size, but with plastic fitting so built support for the end of the tank and mounted until I can get a csv.
Tested old one with air pressure through Schaefer valve ...just blew straight through ...big surprise
Now takes 30 seconds to pump from 30 psi to shutoff ...then can use dock hose for st least 90 seconds before pressure bleeds to 30 psi.
Still bleeds down over several hours.
Been digging in yard for the sprinkler system ...big mess ...found three of eight valves .,,some heads buried under the driveway ...gah.
Found new Flotec 7100 tank same size, but with plastic fitting so built support for the end of the tank and mounted until I can get a csv.
Tested old one with air pressure through Schaefer valve ...just blew straight through ...big surprise
Now takes 30 seconds to pump from 30 psi to shutoff ...then can use dock hose for st least 90 seconds before pressure bleeds to 30 psi.
Still bleeds down over several hours.
Been digging in yard for the sprinkler system ...big mess ...found three of eight valves .,,some heads buried under the driveway ...gah.
Stephenson
Member
Update - pulled off looking for the leak (there MUST be one cause it bleeds down) and started locating the sprinkler heads ...found four of eight valves - all well underground with only a round plastic access tube and cover (all buried, some as much as six inches into clay soil). Got the additional three valves working - one may have bad solenoid.
Four of the heads on one zone were 15" down, and under poured concrete post supports so had to shorten line and replumb to surface. Found several others under the edge of the asphalt driveway ...sigh.
Turned pump off and left for a few days then back and turned on the pump ... next morning neighbor comes over and tells me he noticed water draining down the hill. Pretty much just pumping out underground in an area on the opposite side of the poured driveway from where two of the valves were.
Dug it up and found 1" rolled plastic pipe had been whacked off , likely by a backhoe or loader or bobcat, etc - no other pipe in the immediate area as I was looking to see what it was connected to - found nothing within two fee it any direction... cut it back and plugged it. History -none of the heads/zones on this side of the driveway ever worked ... heads and zone on the other side do work ... I suspect this is the main crossover supply for that side of the driveway ... if it is I may just leave it plugged (not much on that side needing water anyway).
Watched pump build back to 50 psi and shutoff ... stayed steady ... will check in a few hours to see if this was the last leak.
So - what do you think ... could the pipe have been so plugged with clay and so far underground it leaked so little as to only bleed a tiny bit ... then, wham, the plug dislodges and starts blowing water?
Four of the heads on one zone were 15" down, and under poured concrete post supports so had to shorten line and replumb to surface. Found several others under the edge of the asphalt driveway ...sigh.
Turned pump off and left for a few days then back and turned on the pump ... next morning neighbor comes over and tells me he noticed water draining down the hill. Pretty much just pumping out underground in an area on the opposite side of the poured driveway from where two of the valves were.
Dug it up and found 1" rolled plastic pipe had been whacked off , likely by a backhoe or loader or bobcat, etc - no other pipe in the immediate area as I was looking to see what it was connected to - found nothing within two fee it any direction... cut it back and plugged it. History -none of the heads/zones on this side of the driveway ever worked ... heads and zone on the other side do work ... I suspect this is the main crossover supply for that side of the driveway ... if it is I may just leave it plugged (not much on that side needing water anyway).
Watched pump build back to 50 psi and shutoff ... stayed steady ... will check in a few hours to see if this was the last leak.
So - what do you think ... could the pipe have been so plugged with clay and so far underground it leaked so little as to only bleed a tiny bit ... then, wham, the plug dislodges and starts blowing water?
Stephenson
Member
Eight hours and from what I can tell, 50 psi, still.
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