Do I need a new flange or just wax ring?

[Mark Ezrin]

I seem to have a leak of some sort as I could see some moisture and damage to hardwood flooring coming from under the toilet.

I inspected around the toilet - bowl, tank, water line, etc and I'm pretty sure it's just from the wax ring.

1) Is there any proactive way to avoid wax ring issues or do we just have to wait for them to happen? Should I consider replacing all the others. We've been in the house 20+ years and I have no idea when some were replaced beyond doing so with replacement toilets.

2) Please see the attached pictures (updated).

The flange is above the floor and anchored by screws (removed for better cleaning).

Do I need to replace the entire flange, put a repair ring on it, or leave it alone and replace the wax ring?

3) I'm sure I'll start an ongoing firestorm but here goes - traditional wax, synthetic or hybrid wax ring?

For now, I bought this.

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Danco-Perfect-Seal-with-Bolts-4-75-in-Blue-Plastic-Toilet-wax-ring-with-bolts/5001939931

Thank you, as always, for your advice.

 

[Eman85]

No firestorm and I am not a plumber but have set toilets. From your pics it looks like a floor was added raising the level of the floor but they didn't raise the flange, the flange should sit on top of the finished floor. Is the steel ring on the flange good and the bolts hold? If you have no desire to replace the flange and raise it then it' is time to use the hacks. I have used the Danco ring that you pictured with success, it is a hybrid with wax under the silicon. I would clean up the toilet real well and take some measurements and you'll understand the gap you're filling. I'd then dry fit the toilet with no ring and see if it sits flat with no rocking. If it sits good then you can reinstall, if it rocks you can buy toilet shims and yes you can buy plastic toilet shims. fit the toilet with the shims and position the shims before you set the toilet. With the hybrid Danco seal you have some leeway unlike a wax ring so it gives you the ability to get the shims right even if you wiggle the toilet.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Eman85]

Sorry double post

 

[Jeff H Young]

ring looks ok but a bit low and not fastened to floor bad recipe . screw it down solid use thick wax

 

[Eman85]

Didn't catch the flange not screwed down, that is important. Brass screws are nice or stainless.

 

[Mark Ezrin]

@Eman85 @Jeff H Young

Thank you for your time. I've edited my OP & added pictures and comments to clarify what is in or should be in the pictures.

1) it's a bad picture angle. It is above the floor. See updated OP/pictures.

2) There are screws. I removed them to do a better cleaning from the old wax. I'll probably replace them anyway, unless I can get them clean of wax and minor minerals/corrosion (soaking in vinegar). And, there are small pieces of what looks like PVC or something to also keep it elevated. The screws go thru them like tubes. See updated OP/pictures.

3) I've scrubbed the floor, flange and underside of the toilet pretty well to remove the majority of the wax.

4) I forgot I've used that danco before as well, with success. I found a danco box in the basement that I had repurpesed to hold some small plumbing parts.

My biggest concern is should I leave the flange as is, add that reinforcement bracket or replace the whole flange?

Thanks again.

 

[Jeff H Young]

its not new some surface rust id keep using it

 

[Eman85]

Those sleeves for the flange screws is pretty creative! looks like someone possibly raised the flange in the past and wanted to be sure it was supported. As Jeff said it it's just surface rust use the flange the way it is. I'd put the Danco seal on and set the toilet if it sits good on the floor and doesn't rock at all.
You'd have a lot to fill under the flange but that would be the right way instead of the tubes. Then you could seal the flange to the floor so any leak would come out from the back of the toilet instead of going under the floor.

 

[Jeff H Young]

if its a unfiniashed basement below id rather it not 100 percent sealed it will breath a little and water will run out you might catch a drip in basement befor the wood is damaged

 

[Master Plumber Mark]

you can always just install a new flange into that pvc drain if you so choose

I have used these to get me out of nasty troubles many times

you just cut them to the correct size and glue them into the 3 inch pvc pipe and it
keeps from having to cut out the old flange .... which is especially nasty on a slab floor.

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Jones-Stephens-3-X-6-PVC-Closet-Flange-With-Stainless-Steel-Ring-Less-Knockout/5015565569?store=&cm_mmc=shp-_-c-_-prd-_-plb-_-ggl-_-PMAX_PLB_000_Priority_Item_Omni-_-5015565569-_-online-_-22871716687-_-&gclsrc=aw.ds&gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=23536707241&gbraid=0AAAAAD2B2W_GGtVrK6bz9TPZHBehA4Yrd

 

[Reach4]

Consider Danco Hydroseat

DANCO HydroSeat Stainless Steel Toilet Flange Repair 10672X - The Home Depot

Offer the most powerful solution to enhance your toilet with NEXT by Danco HydroSeat Toilet Flange Repair.

www.homedepot.com

Use wax between it and the existing flange.

The legs fit on the floor, and you can hold the Hydroseat in place with wood screws thru the holes in the feet. So the legs and new screws take the stress.

 

[Jeff H Young]

maybe i missed the problem why would that need replacing ?

 

[Mark Ezrin]

maybe i missed the problem why would that need replacing ?

Sorry for the slow reply. Been traveling for business. I'm back home now.

I wasn't sure if the rust was an issue, if it was compromised because of my leak (or if that was due to the wax ring).

I'll take your advice, and that of the others and just replace the wax ring.

Thanks.

 

[Mark Ezrin]

maybe i missed the problem why would that need replacing ?

Sorry for the slow reply. Been traveling for business. I'm back home now.

I wasn't sure if the rust was an issue, if it was compromised because of my leak (or if that was due to the wax ring).

I'll take your advice, and that of the others and just replace the wax ring.

Thanks.

 

[Reach4]

I'll take your advice, and that of the others and just replace the wax ring.

Add screws to hold the ring down. The toilet closet bolts pull up to hold the toilet in place. So have new wood screws to take that vertical force.

 

[Sylvan]

POI

The NYC plumbing code states toilets are to be installed on a non-absorbent flooring ( NO WOOD)

You can install a toilet on a wood subfloor, but the New York City Building Code requires the finished floor surface in toilets and bathrooms to be smooth, hard, and nonabsorbent. Therefore, an exposed, bare wood-finished floor cannot be set directly under a water closet without a waterproof or nonporous covering.

We used to install a marble slab under the toilet to meet the code requirements

 

[Mark Ezrin]

Hi all,

My last questions.

I've cleaned everything, reinstalled the flange bolts, installed the Danco hybrid wax ring, put the toilet on and tightened the bolts.

1. Is there a rule of thumb on how tight the bolts are without cracking the base?

2. Do the washers need to be centered?

3. Any guidance on breaking or cutting the bolts so I can put on the caps?

4. Does this look flush? The Danco instructions said to remove an insert if it wasn't flush. The base isn't rocking or moving.

Thanks for your time.

 

[Mark Ezrin]

POI

The NYC plumbing code states toilets are to be installed on a non-absorbent flooring ( NO WOOD)

You can install a toilet on a wood subfloor, but the New York City Building Code requires the finished floor surface in toilets and bathrooms to be smooth, hard, and nonabsorbent. Therefore, an exposed, bare wood-finished floor cannot be set directly under a water closet without a waterproof or nonporous covering.

We used to install a marble slab under the toilet to meet the code requirements

I'm guessing, and hoping, NYC code is different than where I am in MD.

 

[Fitter30]

Wax ring squished down when setting toilet? Id not use two rings with the plastic insert or

https://www.homedepot.com/pep/DANCO-Perfect-Seal-Toilet-Wax-Ring-with-Bolts-10826X/206393853?g_store=3025&source=shoppingads&locale=en-US&fp=ggl&pla&mtc=SHOPPING-BF-CDP-GGL-D26P-026_007_PLUMB_REPAIR-NA-NA-NA-PMAX-NA-NA-NA-NA-NBR-NA-NA-NA-HighPriority_National&cm_mmc=SHOPPING-BF-CDP-GGL-D26P-026_007_PLUMB_REPAIR-NA-NA-NA-PMAX-NA-NA-NA-NA-NBR-NA-NA-NA-HighPriority_National-17697605195--&gclsrc=aw.ds&gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=17688323656&gbraid=0AAAAADq61UfK8bbuHLJEcCuy9smejbDMC&gclid=CjwKCAjw9NjRBhATEiwA_p2J8fjXdhHPyxCmHE_NxOdgfbq2KBRl1MKbrUteKInrz5hWDVFjrw1m3hoC3RUQAvD_BwE

 

[Reach4]

You did not mention screws into the wood to hold down the flange.

You did not mention shims, although you did say that you could not detect rocking.

4. Does this look flush? The Danco instructions said to remove an insert if it wasn't flush. The base isn't rocking or moving.

Does what look flush?