CSV troubleshooting

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Old Fixer

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I've read many of the discussions on this subject from some years back, but haven't found the information I need. I have some type of flow regulator on my household system made by Jacuzzi [BRO8] that was installed in 1974, but I don't know if it's a CSV or VFD or XYZ. It is installed near the pressure tank on the 1" line from the well that feeds a 1" line into the house and is connected to a Welltrol WX203 of the same vintage. From all descriptions, I think it's a CSV, anyway, it's worked well for 42 years.

A problem arose several months back when I heard the pump running continuously with no apparent water usage. The pressure stayed at 40# although the pressure switch was set at ~35-55#. With reports of well problems from neighbors and finding my water level had dropped considerably over the years, my first thought was the well was going dry, although there were no burps in the water line suggesting it was sucking air. We pulled the pump, checked it for leaks along the line and replaced it several feet deeper. When I started the system again there was no change. I connected a garden hose to a hose bib on the well side of this installation and it pumped ~8gpm @ 50# for 20 minutes, so I figured the well and pump were OK and suspected this valve was the problem. I checked the pressure charge on the empty Welltrol which was ~38#--no change.

At this point, adjustments were made to the set screw according to some info I gleaned from similar sounding valves on the web. With a 2 gpm flow, I had to adjust the screw all the way in to achieve shutoff and that was only after I adjust the pressure switch down to ~50#. For the most part is has allowed us to have water, but it sometimes (such as filling a bathtub) only runs at ~30# and after shutting all water off will rise to 40# and just hang there. I've adjusted repeatedly and can get to 50# where it shuts off as prescribed.

Do these valves wear out or stick? There has been slight, fine sediment and sometimes sand in the water at times, and I wondered if there may be sand or such accumulated in the valve. There is a fine screen filter built in and I've found no significant residue in it whenever I've checked and that should preclude any sediment from entering the flow control chambers anyway.
 

Craigpump

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Is your electric bill abnormally high?

You pulled the pump, but was it tested for shut off pressure and volume?

Was the offset line from the well to the house pressure tested?

What condition is the O ring at the pitless in?
 

Boycedrilling

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Sound like you have a Jacuzzi Aqua-genie. Haven't seen one of those since I was a kid. My parents built a new house in 1966. It had a jacuzzi pump with the Aqua-genie and hydrocells instead of a pressure tank.

The first pump dealer I worked for in the 1980's sold Red Jacket pumps. They had a valve called the hydro servant. It was usually packaged as part of a jet pump, tank combo, preplumbed as a single unit. We sold quite a few of them for summer cabins. The homeowner could pull the whole unit out and take it home for the winter.

At some point valveman should log on. He can tell you the differences between the AquaGenie, Hydro Servant, and his Cycle Stop Valve. There are also at least two other companies making some type or copy of a pump control valve.
 

Old Fixer

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Is your electric bill abnormally high?

You pulled the pump, but was it tested for shut off pressure and volume?

Was the offset line from the well to the house pressure tested?

What condition is the O ring at the pitless in?
When this has occurred, I am on top of it and shut off the pump until I adjusted the Aqua-Genie (that's the name of it), so there was no noticeable power loss. The pump and the lines were effectively tested after it was reinstalled in conjunction with the 20-minute flow/pressure determination. Recall that only the line from the pump to this spigot is involved now and after shutoff it maintained pressure. The O-ring on the pitless adapter was good and this is further supported by the fact there was no loss of line pressure between the well and the pressure gauge.
 

Valveman

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Well, well, well, this makes my day. An Aqua Genie makes a pump last 42 years. Is there any wonder why Franklin and Red Jacket quit making those and started pushing VFD's for their constant pressure systems? Kind of makes fools out of anyone who says the backpressure from a CSV will hurt a pump.

The only difference between an Aqua Genie and a Cycle Stop Valve is the way the 1 GPM bypass works. The Aqua Genie was really designed to replace a pressure relief valve, in that if the pressure increased 20 PSI above the set point, the rubber disk would seal off the bypass notches and keep the pressure from increasing any higher. This way the company claimed a pressure relief was no longer needed. This turned out to not be such a good idea in that without proper adjustment the Aqua Genie could deadhead and destroy the pump. Over time the rubber in the disk gets weaker and would seal off the bypass at an even lower pressure, which is what I assume is happening here. Either the rubber disk has gotten weaker or you have a 1 GPM leak in the system. Closing off all water outlets and making sure the pressure doesn't drop over time would determine if there is a leak in the system. If the pressure holds, then the rubber disk in the Aqua Genie is the problem.

The Cycle Stop Valve improved on the workings of the Aqua Genie as the rubber disk cannot seal the bypass. The CSV was designed to never be able to completely close. This makes sure the pump is never in a dead head condition. And as long as the CSV is used in conjunction with a standard pressure relief valve, the pump can never be dead headed, even if the pressure switch fails to shut it off. There will always be 1 GPM coming through the CSV no matter what. If the pressure switch fails to shut the pump off, this 1 GPM would be discharged through the pressure relief valve, and the pump would protected from dead heading.

Get a new CSV1A and you should be good for more than 42 years this time. :)
 
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