County water with low pressure at the meter location

[Mark Alan]

The county set my 1 inch meter part ways up my driveway. I have around 22 psi coming out of the meter. I have a 1 inch PEX line at the meter to the house, and have power available for the pump. I need to go another 50 to 55 feet in rise from the meter to the house. I am not sure what pump and setup I should use. Also will the PK1A work for this? Maybe with a 10 gallon tank, low pressure cut off switch, and the CSV1A set at 80.

Thanks

 

[ThirdGenPump]

First go back and talk the the county about inadequate service. They should be able to provide 35psi where fire service is required and rural non-fire 25psi from my brief reading of your states code. I'm no expert in AL water requirements though, there could be exceptions or I'm misreading. If they aren't meeting code they may be willing to put money on the table towards correcting the problem at your location, rather than upgrading their infrastructure.

If you can put a small vault at where the meter is you could use a jet pump there, HP of the jet pump will be based on the houses demand or your desired output, if higher. A CSV with a small 4-5 gallon tank would work fine, the the one he sells with the kit, you don't gain much with a CSV and a slightly bigger tank, pumps got to be running with most activities at that volume regardless. You'd want a standard pressure switch not a low pressure cut out unless you expect the city may randomly stop supplying service. I doubt you want to be wandering down your driveway for a nuisance trip. 80psi at the pump would give you about 55 at the house. If you want more you can get there but you'll need to spec out a specific pump set up to do it, where as any generic can make 80 if it's starting with 22psi.

You could put the pump in the house but it'll be rather inefficient trying to pull through 1" PEX.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Mark Alan]

As far as the county goes, it won't happen. I am on a hill. At the bottom they have 50 psi. So I will need some type of setup to get water into the house.

 

[Valveman]

Yes the PK1A will work fine with a jet pump likse a Goulds J10S. But I would opt for the 10 gallon tank since the CSV will be at 80 with a 70/90 pressure switch.

 

[Mark Alan]

Can I specify the CSS setting, and pressure switch setting on the order form?

 

[Mark Alan]

Also will I need a back flow preventer. If so could you please point me to a diagram of the setup?

 

[Valveman]

Yes the PK1A can be factory set to any pressure you want. Any brass or stainless spring loaded check valve will work. Hope they don't make you use a double check.

 

[Mark Alan]

Thanks Cary. Single valve is all I will have.

I have ordered the pump and PK1A. Looking at the pump manual, it has 2 diagrams for connecting the pump. One is for a booster setup, and one for pumping from a water tank. I am going to assume I should set it up for the booster. It looks like you T into the main line, then go to the pump, out to the tank, then T into the main again past a check valve. I can try to post a picture if it is needed. But dose this sound correct to you?

 

[Mark Alan]

Well after further reading I don't think the booster setup would work well since I have no pressure at my house.

 

[Reach4]

I have a 1 inch PEX line at the meter to the house, and have power available for the pump.

I presumed you meant you had power for where you will locate the pump nearer the meter. ThirdGenPump in #2 discussed a vault. The frost line can't be all that deep in Huntsville.

If you put your booster into a pit/vault nearer the meter, you could power the pump via a pressure switch, which could be at the house. 14 AGW wires may be enough if your pump is efficient and you run 230V at the pump. The pressure tank would go at the switch. The CSV could be at the house if you will not branch water off before then. Otherwise, the CSV could be at the pit, because it would be before any branching takes place.

 

[ThirdGenPump]

Well after further reading I don't think the booster setup would work well since I have no pressure at my house.

By my calculation you do have pressure at the house just not much, a couple PSI, which is more than jet pumps start with their traditional applications. The can pull water up on suction. The reason I mentioned putting the booster pump at the water meter is you only have a 1" pex line to the house from there. The friction loss pulling through 1" PEX is pretty brutal in terms off efficiency and PEX isn't a particularly good material to apply suction too. Ideally if you want to do a suction line for household use it's 1-1/4 or greater HDPE or copper. It's significantly easier for a pump to push water. Pushing through the 1" PEX would be fine. If you had to you could put the pump in the house, it would run longer and produce less volume in that location.

 

[Mark Alan]

I was never able to get water up the total rise on my place. I am not looking to suck water up the hill. What I am doing is placing a pump halfway up the hill where I know I have water and some pressure. I found the location by opening the valve on the meter and filling the pipe with water. Then I went up the hill to my drive. I opened the valve on the line and no water. So I started down the hill. I went down 20 feet or so and cut the line. No water in the pipe. I went down another 20 feet and cut the line had some water, but no pressure. I then went down another 20 feet, and cut the line. It had about 20 psi on the line. I plan to locate the pump at this point. So I have power and water line going to the pump location now. The plan is to push the water up the hill with the pump. The J10S came in yesterday, and the PK1A is being delivered today.

The only thing that I am not sure of is the pump came with a pressure switch installed, and the correct pressure switch is with the PK1A. I think I will just install the PK1A switch on the pump to make setup easier. I will just plug the location on the PK1A where the switch should be mounted, unless there is a reason to not do this. So if anyone knows of a reason not to do this please let me know. I plan on installing the pump tomorrow, weather permitting.

Thanks
Mark

 

[Reach4]

So I started down the hill. I went down 20 feet or so and cut the line. No water in the pipe. I went down another 20 feet and cut the line had some water, but no pressure. I then went down another 20 feet, and cut the line. It had about 20 psi on the line.

There is a blockage in the line between your last two cuts.

 

[Mark Alan]

Nope, because I used the old pipe to run the power and new pipe down to the pump location. Other then wearing me out, I never hit anything in the pipe. I thought the same thing.

 

[Reach4]

Nope, because I used the old pipe to run the power and new pipe down to the pump location. Other then wearing me out, I never hit anything in the pipe. I thought the same thing.

Consider your description. The other explanation is that the city water pressure changed a lot between cuts. 20 PSI would have driven the water up another 46 feet of altitude. The horizontal component could have been very long.

 

[Mark Alan]

I don't know. But I have a work around, so we will see what I end up with.

 

[Reach4]

This will give the pump the water it needs even during higher flow conditions. Measuring pressure at zero gpm has its limitations, and by having the pump lower, you will be able to maintain flows better.

Will your pressure tank and switch go at the house, or at the pump house/pit?

 

[Mark Alan]

I was going to put it with the pump. I was not sure about putting it at the house.

 

[Reach4]

I was going to put it with the pump. I was not sure about putting it at the house.

That can work. In that case, it is more important that the pipe from the pump to the house have lower pressure drop. With higher flows comes more pressure drop. If the pressure gauge and tank are at the house, the loss to the house will be compensated for.

SIDR poly tubing will have less pressure drop than PEX for a given nominal size, because it is larger.

 

[Valveman]

and the PK1A is being delivered today.

The only thing that I am not sure of is the pump came with a pressure switch installed, and the correct pressure switch is with the PK1A. I think I will just install the PK1A switch on the pump to make setup easier. I will just plug the location on the PK1A where the switch should be mounted, unless there is a reason to not do this. So if anyone knows of a reason not to do this please let me know. I plan on installing the pump tomorrow, weather permitting.

Thanks
Mark

No you do not want to use the pressure switch mounted to the side of the motor. The pressure switch has to sense pressure AFTER the CSV. So you can either extend the little black line from the existing pressure switch to the side of the CSV1A, or use the switch that comes with the PK1A kit and wire around the existing switch on the motor. Wiring instructions for the PK1A show how to wire around the old switch.

Oh and you can just turn up the pressure switch to make up for the elevation after the pump and kit. The J10S can be turned up to as high as 45/65 without any incoming pressure. If you have 10 PSI incoming pressure, the pump can work with up to a 55/75 pressure switch setting.