Clorox for water treatment? sodium polyacrylate?

[Reach4]

https://www.clorox.com/dr-laundry/well-water-and-bleach-usage/ says

Our Clorox® Regular-Bleach actually has an added polymer, polyacrylate, which acts like a sponge to remove and hold the iron keeping it from reacting with the sodium hypochlorite.​

I see they are talking about sodium polyacrylate. Would this be a reason to seek out a different chlorine source for water treatment? I don't see polyacrylate listed on the SDS.

https://www.clorox.com/dr-laundry/w...-might-be-most-compatible-with-clorox-bleach/ says in response to a question about sodium polyacrylate

Finally, to answer your last question, Clorox® Germicidal Bleach1 and Clorox®Regular-Bleach1 are different products that do have different formulas — taking one ingredient out is not the only change. Since our specific formulas are proprietary, I can’t be any more specific than that.​

 

[Mikey]

Has something changed in the last 4 years:
https://terrylove.com/forums/index....e-help-getting-best-choice.52417/#post-383205

 

[Sponsor]

 

[ditttohead]

Actually yes. Lots has changed in the last 4 years in the water industry. A few new medias and system designs have become popular for Tannin reduction, H2o2 prices have also come down a bit making it a competitive choice to chlorine (for oxidizing, not bacterial control...) many new injection methods are now available that weren't before including integrated pulsed metering and now hall effect inputs in chemical injection systems... this industry has been evolving quickly the past few years.

 

[Reach4]

H2o2 prices have also come down a bit making it a competitive choice to chlorine (for oxidizing, not bacterial control...)

Are you saying that it is still premium-priced for bacterial control, or it is not as suitable for bacterial control?

 

[ditttohead]

H2o2 can be used for bacterial control but it is not widely accepted. I have been very successful in the "lab" while using h2o2 for bacterial control but... the math equations are not there... training seminar topic. Simply put, use h202 for oxidation, use chlorine for sanitization.

Here is a short article on a simple sanitization procedure. H2o2 can be used but I have simply not used it for enough years to quanitfiably give accurate numbers... unlike chlorine which is well accepted and understood far better than h2o2... hard to explain without making this thread far too long and very boring. Maybe a real chemist with decades of field experience can break it down to a few sentences but I sure cant.

https://view.publitas.com/impact-water-products/2018-catalog-final/page/282-283

 

[GTOwagon]

My wife is an organic chemist and says that Chlorine kills germs and bacterial organisms faster as a germicide. H2O2 is a superior oxidizer. Particularly if Ph is high. However oxidizing something generally kills

I have posed the question as to why the industry (a disparate group of individuals if there if it can be called one!) hasn't come up with a system to oxidize with Peroxide, neutralize and then inject a residual chlorine to sanitize and then neutralize again. I guess that would be left to Aquasana or Culligan, the bigger boys, to come up with a practical and moderately priced system. But I think there is the general concern of mixing the two chemicals. Most Americans really can't handle The simple task of adding salt or chlorine or whatever is required in the system, so refilling two chemicals safely is probably out of the question. I certainly don't see this as practical except by guys like yourselves who are interested in doing their own home treatment and who are serious and steadfast. Ideally I would prefer HP but am loath to tamper with success that's chlorine provides. HP is much safer and less toxic for ingestion and diluted, people actually drink for health reasons. Not me of course, I think just gargling with it is nasty. But no one gargles with chlorine, right?

 

[Reach4]

I have posed the question as to why the industry (a disparate group of individuals if there if it can be called one!) hasn't come up with a system to oxidize with Peroxide, neutralize and then inject a residual chlorine to sanitize and then neutralize again.

Complex.

I don't have the numbers, but I expect that a larger contact time could make the disinfection by H2O2 quite good. So a bigger contact tank could replace complexity I think. Does somebody have numbers to offer?

 

[ditttohead]

My wife is an organic chemist and says that Chlorine kills germs and bacterial organisms faster as a germicide. H2O2 is a superior oxidizer. Particularly if Ph is high. However oxidizing something generally kills

I have posed the question as to why the industry (a disparate group of individuals if there if it can be called one!) hasn't come up with a system to oxidize with Peroxide, neutralize and then inject a residual chlorine to sanitize and then neutralize again. I guess that would be left to Aquasana or Culligan, the bigger boys, to come up with a practical and moderately priced system. But I think there is the general concern of mixing the two chemicals. Most Americans really can't handle The simple task of adding salt or chlorine or whatever is required in the system, so refilling two chemicals safely is probably out of the question. I certainly don't see this as practical except by guys like yourselves who are interested in doing their own home treatment and who are serious and steadfast. Ideally I would prefer HP but am loath to tamper with success that's chlorine provides. HP is much safer and less toxic for ingestion and diluted, people actually drink for health reasons. Not me of course, I think just gargling with it is nasty. But no one gargles with chlorine, right?

That design is very simple, I just don't see the numbers being there to justify the equipment cost. A simple ORP sensor, pH sensor, some chemical injection pumps etc.. far too complex for most people and it would really only be a toy that somebody who has way too much time on their hands would enjoy maintaining. not to mention the pH and ORP meters typically need constant calibration . H202 and Chlorine can be used in place of each other in most applications, one is better than the other in some applications. I personally prefer to use H2o2 in most applications, when necessary I will recommend chlorine instead.

 

[GTOwagon]

That design is very simple, I just don't see the numbers being there to justify the equipment cost. A simple ORP sensor, pH sensor, some chemical injection pumps etc.. far too complex for most people and it would really only be a toy that somebody who has way too much time on their hands would enjoy maintaining. not to mention the pH and ORP meters typically need constant calibration . H202 and Chlorine can be used in place of each other in most applications, one is better than the other in some applications. I personally prefer to use H2o2 in most applications, when necessary I will recommend chlorine instead.

I am constantly considering switching to H2O2 but hate to tamper with success. How hard would it be to change over? I would think I need to drain the contact tank and pressure tank. And then change out the pump lines to put th eperoxide in so it doesn't make contact with the chlorine.

 

[GTOwagon]

That design is very simple, I just don't see the numbers being there to justify the equipment cost. A simple ORP sensor, pH sensor, some chemical injection pumps etc.. far too complex for most people and it would really only be a toy that somebody who has way too much time on their hands would enjoy maintaining. not to mention the pH and ORP meters typically need constant calibration . H202 and Chlorine can be used in place of each other in most applications, one is better than the other in some applications. I personally prefer to use H2o2 in most applications, when necessary I will recommend chlorine instead.

The other thought I have had is to use the chlorine system as is and inject a residual and tiny amount of H2O2 in with a timed Stenner pump, once a day or so like enough to maintain freshness in the plumbing lines, and not remove it. .??? It is something I wondered about seeing as it isn't harmful in small amounts.

 

[Reach4]

I am constantly considering switching to H2O2 but hate to tamper with success. How hard would it be to change over? I would think I need to drain the contact tank and pressure tank. And then change out the pump lines to put th eperoxide in so it doesn't make contact with the chlorine.

I don't think it would require replacing the peristatlic pump tube, but you are supposed to do that about once per year anyway I think.

I would think empty the solution tank, add water. Run water thru. Then dump the water, and run H2O2 solution through. I doubt that anything drastic would happen when mixing diluted (solution tank level) of the chemicals. Maybe go a tad heavier on H2O2 initially.

Have the H2O2 test paper, so that you can tune things.

However I have never done that stuff.

 

[ditttohead]

H2o2 reacts with Chlorine... it basically gets consumed when mixed. Just rinse things out very thoroughly, you will be fine.

 

[GTOwagon]

Should the 120 gallon contact tank and the pressure tank be drained off?