City Water - Low Pressure and Volume - CSV or PT?

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JKTrevecca

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If this isn't the correct forum them I apologize in advance. I'm no plumber but about 12 years ago when I was renovating my first house I learned of this website and the advice I received back then was great! I have a new situation at a new house and would love any input anyone would like to offer. I've read about Cycle Stop Valves but most of what I read is in reference to well water. Here is my situation.

My home is on city water with low pressure and low volume. When we bought the house 2.5 years ago, there was/is still a Grundfos pressure booster pump in the crawlspace. The model # is MQ3-35.

About 6 months ago, it began leaking. At that time, I learned that many people install these thinking they have low pressure when they really have low volume. My static pressure w/o the pump was between 20-28psi, sometimes up to 32 psi depending on the time of day. I'm told that my pressure w/o the pump is borderline low but with the pump, the post-pump pressure was about 80-90psi which is too high and likely caused the pump to leak. So... I installed a pressure reducing valve *before* the pump so the input pressure would only be 15psi thus reducing the output pressure to an acceptable level and eliminating the leak. It worked.

All of that information may be useless but I wanted to share in case it matters for my real question. The Grundfos pump has officially bit the dust today (Motor/Bearing) and I am wanting to know the pro's and con's of the following 3 options and any suggestions if there is a 4th or 5th option that would be better.

1. Replace it with a new identical pump. (This would be easiest for me but I've learned these Grundfos pumps don't have the best reputation)
2. Ditch it and get a traditional pump with pressure tank. (I have plenty of room in the crawlspace)
3. Get a CSV setup

We are a family of 4 with high water usage. My wife and kids are home all day every day and water is used in large and small quantities regularly throughout the day. I'd estimate that 1 hour rarely goes by w/o water being used. My wife takes eternal showers and my kids take baths and have to pee every 5 minutes I swear.

Thank you! I look forward to any responses and help you might have!
 

Valveman

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Well #1 is off the table as they no longer make the MQ. They have a new constant pressure booster that has variable speed (VFD) and is easy to just plug and play. They are not cheap but they are so easy to plug in that you shouldn't mind having to plug in a new one every couple of years right?

#2 would mean a regular 1HP jet pump with about a 40 gallon size pressure tank and maybe a 50/70 pressure switch setting. 40 gallon size pressure tank holds about 10 gallons of water. So the pressure will vary from 70 down to 50 as 10 gallons is used, then when the pump starts the pressure will quickly rise to 70, which shuts off the pump. And this process is repeated over and over as long as you are using water. The pump will cycle on and off and the pressure will vary from 50 to 70 when using water, but this type system may last 30 years.

#3 has some benefits using a Cycle Stop Valve with the same 1HP jet pump. You would only need a little 4.5 gallon size pressure tank (1 gallon draw) as the CSV would give you water on demand instead of filling and draining a pressure tank. Instead of cycling between 50 and 70, the CSV would hold a constant 60 PSI while you are using water. This makes shower pressure stronger and tankless water heaters work better. Even with the small tank toilets can be flushed as much as needed and the pump should last as long as when using a large pressure tank.

You can even widen the pressure switch band to 25/70. This would allow toilet flushes and hand washing to come directly from the city static pressure of 28-32 PSI, and the pump would not even come on. But when larger flows are used and the pressure drops to 25 PSI, the pump is started and the CSV delivers a constant 60 PSI for as long as the shower is on. When the shower is off the pressure would increase to 70, the pump would be shut off, and low flows would bring it back down to static pressure again. But I think you will like the 60 PSI constant so much that you won't mind if the pump cycles for a few toilet flushes and will stay with the 50/70 pressure switch setting.
 

JKTrevecca

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Well #1 is off the table as they no longer make the MQ. They have a new constant pressure booster that has variable speed (VFD) and is easy to just plug and play. They are not cheap but they are so easy to plug in that you shouldn't mind having to plug in a new one every couple of years right?

#2 would mean a regular 1HP jet pump with about a 40 gallon size pressure tank and maybe a 50/70 pressure switch setting. 40 gallon size pressure tank holds about 10 gallons of water. So the pressure will vary from 70 down to 50 as 10 gallons is used, then when the pump starts the pressure will quickly rise to 70, which shuts off the pump. And this process is repeated over and over as long as you are using water. The pump will cycle on and off and the pressure will vary from 50 to 70 when using water, but this type system may last 30 years.

#3 has some benefits using a Cycle Stop Valve with the same 1HP jet pump. You would only need a little 4.5 gallon size pressure tank (1 gallon draw) as the CSV would give you water on demand instead of filling and draining a pressure tank. Instead of cycling between 50 and 70, the CSV would hold a constant 60 PSI while you are using water. This makes shower pressure stronger and tankless water heaters work better. Even with the small tank toilets can be flushed as much as needed and the pump should last as long as when using a large pressure tank.

You can even widen the pressure switch band to 25/70. This would allow toilet flushes and hand washing to come directly from the city static pressure of 28-32 PSI, and the pump would not even come on. But when larger flows are used and the pressure drops to 25 PSI, the pump is started and the CSV delivers a constant 60 PSI for as long as the shower is on. When the shower is off the pressure would increase to 70, the pump would be shut off, and low flows would bring it back down to static pressure again. But I think you will like the 60 PSI constant so much that you won't mind if the pump cycles for a few toilet flushes and will stay with the 50/70 pressure switch setting.


Thank you! I see your posts on this forum as an advocate of the CSV's. Is there any reason, in your experience, I wouldn't want to pursue that route in my situation?

Also - I called the plumbing supply place near my home and they have never heard of CSV's. Am I going to have to mail-order this or did I just call a red-neck plumbing supply place? Any suggestions on if/how/where a guy can get this setup today locally vs. waiting for the mail-order setup? My wife is lacking patience and I'd prefer she be happy so I can also be happy. Lastly - What pump would you suggest? brand/size etc? are all 1hp jet pumps the same?

I'm in Nashville, TN
 

Valveman

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It would not surprise me that a plumbing supply has not heard of a Cycle Stop Valve. The pump companies they buy from try not to mention our name. The CSV makes pumps last longer and use smaller less expensive tanks, so they hope you don't find out about it.

Just to be clear I am the inventor and owner of Cycle Stop Valves, so I am very biased. :)

But I am only biased because I know the CSV has many advantages and solves many problems.

Nobody keeps anything in stock anymore. Even your plumber will be waiting on something to show up on the freight truck. I have 10 distributors in Tennessee. But they will all want to sell to the installer, not the homeowner. And they will all want to sell something that is more expensive and doesn't last as long as a CSV system, like the MQ that you had.

Just Google a J10S for the pump, and a PK1A for the Cycle Stop Control kit. Then a check valve and a few pipe fittings are the only other things needed.
 
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