Best way to replace flange ring and to fill around the flange

[Aceman]

Okay so if you check the video, this is at my daugther's house toilet started to leak--took it off and found that the flange "ring" was rusted out like tin foil. So I removed it.

The wood rotted away or broke away at one end and also some rotted areas I cleaned up, but otherwise the wood is very solid no need to replace it.
So my plan is to grout or use some sort of quick cement around the flange. I will fashion something on the one end the large gap to hold the grout (probably a piece of wood dropped in vertically with a screw and wire attached then pull it back into place and screew in from the top to fill the large gap. Then I'll fashion something to make a nice "circle" around the pipe and then use grout/cement to make a nice even surface up to the level of the flange upon which to place a new flange ring.

Two options. The easier one is to order an "adjustable" ring so I can fit it under neath the plastic flange piece It has a groove where the old rotted ring had been. The flange top is a bit low (about even with the floor) but can use a Danco Perfect seal to adress that problem.

The other option is to remove the flange which is fitted over top of the 3 inch drain pipe and put a new one on.

So what do you think? I want to avoid the hassle of cutting out the old flange an reinstalling a new one but I can do that if it makes a significant difference in the quality of the install.

I also included a picture from underneath the crawl space. VERY DIFFICULT to get there and work there so I'd prefer to do all this from above.

 

[Reach4]

The easier one is to order an "adjustable" ring so I can fit it under neath the plastic flange piece It has a groove where the old rotted ring had been.

I suspect you are describing a split repair ring
Sioux Chief 886-MRM is a split repair ring. May be galvanized. Not sure

Oatey 42777 Moss Bay is a split repair ring. Split repair rings
can go under plastic edge. Seems to be galvanized, even tho some say stainless

https://www.lifeandhome.com/products/william-harvey-014710-toilet-flange-repair-ring-1-4
Harvey's 014710 is stainless split.

Then there are the repair rings that go over the top.

PASCO 21013, Jones Stephens C85000, Oatey 42775, and Superior 21015 are repair rings with mounting tabs outside. Those have holes in the legs and holes in the ring part that can be used to hold the ring down. Then the repair flange itself can hold the toilet closet bolts down.

The flange top is a bit low (about even with the floor) but can use a Danco Perfect seal to adress that problem.

I have read that the adhesive can have a problem holding if the bottom of the toilet has residual wax. You might also take a look at the Danco Hydro Seat. It is like a repair ring with a tail. Use wax ring under.

I suggest you put "repair ring", with the quotes, into the search box above.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Aceman]

Thanks for the reply but what I am really looking for are ways to "sure" up the area around the flange without having to go back in the crawl space.

 

[Eman85]

I'm not a plumber. I had a bad spot in the floor around a flange and I went under for my fix. I cut a piece of plywood to fit in the spot, cut a hole in the plywood big enough for the pipe to go through and then cut the plywood in half. Went under and placed the plywood while a helper screwed it from above while I held the pieces. Then I could securely mount the flange. I know you didn't want to go in the crawlspace but I think it's the better fix.

 

[Master Plumber Mark]

they make a flange with a long snout that would go down into that 3 inch abs pipe
its about 6 inches long and you simply glue it into the inside of the pipe.... let it set up
and it wont be moving again in our life times

and of course it has a metal ring that you can adjust correctly and maybe secure down to the wood that is
available.....

you could also saw off that old flange with a Dremil saw to get the new flange to seat
down into the cavity better.....

 

[Reach4]

Thanks for the reply but what I am really looking for are ways to "sure" up the area around the flange without having to go back in the crawl space.

A closet flange has two main purposes. One is to hold down the closet bolts, and the other is to push up against the wax. The remaining plastic might be able to provide the up-push, but your idea of mortar under the plastic would certainly do that. Mortar is strong in compression.

So the part the mortar does not address on its own is the hold-down. You could put concrete screws thru the new mortar, but a repair ring with ears or Danco Hydro Seat would let you put screws into wood farther out.

If you don't get screws into good wood, I think you would need a solution that takes you, or somebody else, to the crawl space.

 

[Aceman]

So I think the linked product "should" work. It goes on top of the floor and I can drill holes deep enough to reach the wood underneat the tile/grout.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000K13TL6/

 

[Aceman]

they make a flange with a long snout that would go down into that 3 inch abs

So they make this which I think might be better because there is a "bend" in the pipe fairly close to the top of the flange. 6 inch depth I think would be too much unless it can be cut.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002YG2D9E/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

[Reach4]

So I think the linked product "should" work. It goes on top of the floor and I can drill holes deep enough to reach the wood underneat the tile/grout.

It looks like, from the instructions, that would go under a repair ring, and the supplied sheet metal screws would supply the downward force on repair ring, which in turn supplies the downward force for the closet bolts. So maybe you still plan to put a split repair ring under the plastic to hold that up. So order of the cross section from top to bottom would be existing plastic ring, split repair ring, Sioux Chief Closet Flange Floor Support, wood. Will your plastic sit high enough to be the top layer?

https://www.siouxchief.com/docs/default-source/spec-sheets/specs-sheets-drainage/490-11322---Closet-Flange-Floor-Support---Spec-Sheet

 

[Reach4]

I think mortar under and repair ring on top would be a better solution unless the outer screw holes are not wide enough apart.

How about this one? https://www.homedepot.com/p/Oatey-Fix-it-Toilet-Flange-Repair-Ring-42775/300279621

 

[Master Plumber Mark]

So they make this which I think might be better because there is a "bend" in the pipe fairly close to the top of the flange. 6 inch depth I think would be too much unless it can be cut.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002YG2D9E/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

that will work if you cut it to size so it will go down in the pipe

the better option is the type that literally glues down into the abs pipe

good luck

 

[Aceman]

So I managed to attach a couple pieces of wood from underneath by using some wires to hold it and then a ver small clamp to hold it while drilling screws threw it. I used DAP Plastic Wood wood filler and cut a piece of wood to encircle the Flange. I was able to screw in the adjustable ring with no issue all of the screws hit wood and bit tight. The flange was in solid did not move. Installed the toilet with the Danco All-in-One Toilet Installation. Its flushng no leaks. So hopefully it will be fine.

 

[Master Plumber Mark]

So I managed to attach a couple pieces of wood from underneath by using some wires to hold it and then a ver small clamp to hold it while drilling screws threw it. I used DAP Plastic Wood wood filler and cut a piece of wood to encircle the Flange. I was able to screw in the adjustable ring with no issue all of the screws hit wood and bit tight. The flange was in solid did not move. Installed the toilet with the Danco All-in-One Toilet Installation. Its flushng no leaks. So hopefully it will be fine.

That looks pretty good to me...

I suggest that you should take some clear alex dap and put a ring around
the base of the toilet at the floor.... force it under the toilet with your finger
and clean off the excess with a wet sponge... once the alex dap sets up
it will be as solid as a rock

 

[Aceman]

That looks pretty good to me...

I suggest that you should take some clear alex dap and put a ring around
the base of the toilet at the floor.... force it under the toilet with your finger
and clean off the excess with a wet sponge... once the alex dap sets up
it will be as solid as a rock

Why "clear" rather than white? And I assume you mean this:

Alex DAP Clear

 

[Aceman]

Also my son-in-law says it seems like its flushing slower than it was. Not sure if that's any issue with the installation. But this all started with sewage smell and when we took the toilet off, there was no was ring at all. It was gone (or never installed). So it had a "poop" ring instead. I thought it may be because there was no seal. but the toilet is only about 3 feet from the sewer pipe so not a lot of gravity either.

 

[Aceman]

that will work if you cut it to size so it will go down in the pipe

the better option is the type that literally glues down into the abs pipe

good luck

I was never "keen" on the idea of reducing the diameter of the pipe from 3 inches. But when I tried the screw-in one it didn't work I "think" because the pipe takes a curve too close to the opening. I just couldn't get it to seal I could easily pull it back up and out. So I thought gluing one in but ultimately I decided it best to leave the flange opening a 3 inches.

 

[Reach4]

Why "clear" rather than white?

See https://terrylove.com/forums/index....ions-for-family-of-5.62393/page-2#post-463592

 

[Master Plumber Mark]

Why "clear" rather than white? And I assume you mean this:

Alex DAP Clear

I dont know,,, either one will work fine..

I am just partial to clear because that is about all I carry around in my truck

that alex dap clear or white is very easy to work with and I have found it to
be a god-send when dealing with those "peskey" toilets that no matter how
much you tighten them down they still do not feel "solid"

once it sets up it wont budge

 

[Aceman]

Yes I noticed the toilet can be moved left-right fairly easily now which makes sense since it's hand tightened although I'm gonna use the washers and tighten it with a wrench a bit more (don't worry I know you cannot tighten too much! ). But also the fact that the connectors are so far back and there is "play" in them so even tightened down as hard as you can go the toilet still probably moves a bit in the front. So the caulking will "anchor" it.

 

[Reach4]

(don't worry I know you cannot tighten too much! ).

Don't count on that.

But yes, the caulk can be structural, and the Toto Unifit toilets rely on that.

Some use plaster of Paris on the bottom of toilets. That is a regional thing.