Basement Vent/Waste piping

[BrianAg95]

I am finishing my basement. The rough in only had 2 outlets, and my wife wants a shower , so I am using the 2 rough in's for the toilet and shower. The sink is going to end up 6.5-7' from the main drain stack so I as planning on simply tieing it's waste into the main drain stack... I really don't want to deal with busting out concrete and putting in new pipes below grade.


I have attached both a floorplan, and a side view of the plumbing I will need to add. It is not very much and seems straightforward to me.. but I want to be sure it is up to code and will function as intended..

So here are my questions, and if something I haven't though of I am missing, please comment on that as well.

1: Most stuff I see talking about venting shows after the P trap the drain is connected into a vertical stack, with the vent going up and the waste going down.. all vertical... I cannot do this on the sink and washer, since I need to tie into the main drain stack above the flexible coupling.. it will be sloped downward certainly, but it cannot be vertical... Is this OK? (the 2 diagrams on the right side of my image show this question.. )

2: The washer is 2 feet from the main drain stack and the sink will be 6.5-7 feet from the main drain stack.. Is this an acceptable distance for the drain lines have just a sight slope to them?

3: As I was drawing up the diagram I realized that the existing vent stacks, and the drain stack have flexible coupling, but in my diagram I did not put flexible couplings in the new vent stacks... I think I need them.. Do I?

4: As long as my proposed layout is acceptable... Do I need any cleanouts in any of the new lines?

5: Is there anything I am missing?

In the diagram the blue pipes represent vent piping, and the red is waste/drain piping, and the green is the connection the the fixture. Only those three colors are new piping, all the black and gray exists already.

Edit though of one more question...

6: Since the floor would likely move as one unit if it ever heaves in the future would it be better to tie the drains in BELOW the flexible coupling, and add flex couplings to the new vent stacks...? (kind of a different slant on questions 3) IE since the base of the main drain stack and the new fixtures are on the same slab, if it moves in my mind it makes sense they would move together, as opposed to the floor above not moving.... so it seems like it might make more sense if the lower fixtures were tied in below the flex coupling... This would also make sense for me then to indeed have flex couplings in the two new blue vent stacks to isolate the fixtures from the ceiling..

Thanks
Brian

 

[BrianAg95]

Ok so after my own writing last night and sleeping on it...

Here is my new proposed plumbing setup..... Will this all work, and it is code, etc... of course any of my questions from above still apply...

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Jadnashua]

See what the pros say, but the only thing I see wrong is that you should be using no-hub banded connectors. These are reinforced with metal over a thin neoprene rubber sleeve, and anchored with hose clamps. You cna' tuse the thick rubber sleeve with just the hose clamps above ground.

The drain for the washing machine needs to be 2", and the standpipe has special spec's about how high it needs to be. The drain line needs a minimum of 1/4" per foot slope and the vents need slope to them as well.

 

[Terry]

I like the second drawing.

Santee's on the veritcal there,

On the horizontal, wye fittings and long sweeps.
metal wrapped couplings similar to no-hubs

 

[BrianAg95]

Thanks.. As far as the flexible coupling.. I didn't know the name of them... so they may be no-hubs....

They look like rubber bulbs sort of, and have hose clamps holding them on both ends of the fitting. The reason for these fittings in this application is we have clay soil, which is prone to heaving. so the slab of the basement can move independent of the foundation walls. meaning the pipes coming out of the slab could move over time. This also means i have to deal with floating basement walls and other such annoyances in my basement finish project...

Got the subfloor in last week, and installed the sump pump yesterday. Though I find this weird.... all the sump pump check valves at both lowes and HD connect only to flexible tubing... I have always seen sumps put in with PVC pipe.. and I find it weird that sumps now use that flexible junk for discharge lines...

Is this really the "new" way of piping discharge from sump pumps?

A legal shielded coupling.

 

[Redwood]

I wouldn't use the flexible hose for a sump pump...

 

[BrianAg95]

This house is less than 2 years old.. so I would assume it is correct for code here (Castle Rock, Colorado)... but those are not the same couplings that I see in my basement.

Every vent stack and every waste stack, has one of these flexible couplings just above the cleanout. What are these, since these do not look like what you have posted above?

 

[hj]

couplings

Those are "Fernco" couplings and are illegal almost everywhere inside the house. They do not provide ANY remedy for a moving slab, since they are too heavy to stretch and the pipes should be touching inside them so they cannot compress. Your second drawing appears to be correct, but until you actually install the pipes we cannot be sure if you will DO it correctly. What about the shower? If it was supposed to be a sink drain it will not have a trap under the floor.

 

[Terry]

The one of the left is the illegal Fernco and the one on the right is the legal shielded coupling.
The metal cover prevents the pipes from shifting.

 

[BrianAg95]

Thanks, looks like I have some questions for the permit review, about the original installation. Hmm I am outside my 1 year warranty, but if something isn't up to snuff.. the builder better still deal with it... shoot they have 2 warranty issues they still have to deal with anyway.

PS the builder may have done that wrong.. but dang at least I don't have a jackstand holding up a framing member, like the photo on the right.

 

[BrianAg95]

Ok so I got done with the permit office today.. and the couplings in my basement are what they require. so thats one issue down... Also the office confirmed I have a rough in for a toilet and shower, but nothing for a sink... so I was told I can run the sink drain to one of the existing vent stacks, and that will become a wet vent for either the shower or toilet... Or I can go into the main drain stack, which is my plan. The weird thing when he was talking about going to the vent pipes and using a wet vent was, he made it sound like I wouldn't need to run a separate vent for the sink even though this would be a 7.5-8 foot horizontal run, but all the charts I found on distance to vent pipe, made this illegal to do... Maybe that is what they usually suggest if the rough in is spaced well... but mine is a bit dodgy on spacing.

Now here is my proposed layout of piping and connectors.

Couple questions.
1 - I believe I have correctly chosen the type of connectors for each connection location. Each is labeled on the drawing. Are these correct?

2 - The washer stand pipe, from my research must be between 30" and 48" long, but all I could find for a sink tailpiece requirement is max of 18" Is there a minimum length?

I am using this convention that pipes must fall 1/4inch for each foot they travel horizontally. The Washer is 2" pipe all the way, and the sink is 1 1/2" to before the vent pipe, and the up sizes to 2" and is 2" the rest of the way.

3 - Where the drain for the sink joins the drain for the washer, do I need to upsize the pipe? or is 2" sufficient? (My research indicated a 2" horizontal drain can handle 8 fixtures, but since one is a washer I was unsure if there might be a special case or maybe I missed the boat on what I was looking up)?

Thanks
Brian

Edit Question 4: I read that wherever you do a vertical to horizontal, you need a cleanout... SO if I go with picture 1, Do I need a cleanout just past the sink, where it goes from down from the vent to the horizontal run.... And if So.. Wouldn't I be better off going with picture 2.

 

[Terry]

The santee for the vent on the washer should be replaced with a wye fitting since it's on the horizontal.

 

[Sciberras89]

I always get a real good laugh when I lookup something plumbing related and get taken to some yankee site, you guys wouldn't last a minute north of the 49th

 

[Terry]

You're a bit South of the cabin we had. I don't think you would last either. This was heading to our cabin in April.
My family also had a place at Whistler. I still get there a few times a year.

I believe this is the Canadian site for plumbing. Mainly USA, but definitely Canadian.