Backflow protection + waterless trap seal?

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Jack.Straw

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Hi guys. I have 2 floor drains in my basement that I would like to install backflow protection in. We had a backflow last year during a crazy hard rain that briefly put sewage all over our basement. We've only had that happen once in the last 15 years, but I want to go ahead and put in some kind of protection. However..

One of the 2 drains in my basement that I'd like to install backflow protection in suffers from fairly frequent odor problems. The water in the trap is either evaporating or is being sucked out by back pressure or something. I simply have to pour water into the drain to fix the smell. While researching my backflow protection options I stumbled upon a product called "waterless trap seal" which seems to be designed to prevent sewer gasses from passing through if there is no water in the trap. I'm also seeing some (possibly questionable) products that say "anti-odor backflow preventer." It would be really great if I could find a product that does both jobs, but I have no experience with such things.

The inside diameter or the drain pipes is 3". Can anyone recommend a product the would perform both functions? If not, i would still appreciate recommendations on the backflow side. Thanks for your time!
 

Reach4

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If not, i would still appreciate recommendations on the backflow side.
Overhead sewers are best. Sometimes there are programs to pay a portion of that installation, but I did not find one in your area. https://msdprojectclear.org/customers/problems-tips/sewer-backups/financial-assistance-building-backups/

A flood control system like this is very good: http://www.floodexperts.com/wordpre...4/08/flood-control-and-seepage-prevention.jpg

Backwater valves in the basement serving basement loads that are normally open, and shuts as water rises are next best.

Backwater valve with a normally closed flapper will leak because solids collected with time will hold the flapper open.
 
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Jack.Straw

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Overhead sewers are best.

A flood control system like this is very good: http://www.floodexperts.com/wordpre...4/08/flood-control-and-seepage-prevention.jpg

Backwater valves in the basement serving basement loads that are normally open, and shuts as water rises are next best.

Backwater valve with a normally closed flapper will leak because solids collected with time will hold the flapper open.

Thank you Reach. I'm looking for something simple, as this isn't really a big problem. I was thinking more along the lines of the float style valves that push closed if water rises up.
 

Jack.Straw

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Those (1 and 3) are just trap seals that don't prevent backflow, correct? The 2nd one appears to be specific to the drain it comes with, and my drain is built into the concrete floor.
 

Reach4

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Those (1 and 3) are just trap seals that don't prevent backflow, correct? The 2nd one appears to be specific to the drain it comes with, and my drain is built into the concrete floor.
First one says
Trap Seal Insert solutions help increase indoor air quality, protect the public health, and provide sewage backflow protection while preventing drain odors, pest infiltration, sewer/radon gas infiltration, and harmful biologic aerosols.
I'll let you read the others.
Some put an expanding test plug into floor drains until they want to drain something.
tp-10-1.jpg
 

Jack.Straw

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First one says
Trap Seal Insert solutions help increase indoor air quality, protect the public health, and provide sewage backflow protection while preventing drain odors, pest infiltration, sewer/radon gas infiltration, and harmful biologic aerosols.
I'll let you read the others.
Some put an expanding test plug into floor drains until they want to drain something.
tp-10-1.jpg

Ok, i see now on the 1st link does mention backflow at the end, but oddly isn't mentioned at all in the PDF. I guess I can email them to see if it really does do backflow protection. The other link has no backflow protection, it's just for gasses.

Unfortunately I need both drains to be open all the time for drainage. One serves the condensation overflow in the furnace room, and the other drain needs to be open in case water enters through the basement door. Sometimes I fail to keep the leaves swept outside the walkout door, and in a heavy rain the leaves can block the drain's grate holes. I have an atrium gate on the way that should help prevent that, but it's happened often enough over the years that I'd like the drain near the door to be open just in case.
 

Reach4

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https://drainbrain.com/en/products/flood-guard/ is another. See the middle of the page for their other offerings.

If your drain was 3 inch, you could use their standpipe model to accept condensation, or use a condensation pump that can bring the condensation upstairs. For the outside basement door, you could put a utility pump in the well outside of the door, or you could dig a pit there, and put in a sump pump. That water should play into the yard in most areas.
 
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Jack.Straw

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Thanks Reach. That flood guard is the type i'm looking for if I can't find one that also prevents gasses in addition to backflow. I like that there are screws that tension the seal, as apposed to just rubber rings/flaps to hold it in place.

The outside drain is below the level of the yard and is all concrete. It drains just fine unless there are leaves, at which point the wet leaves suck up against the drain holes and prevent fast draining. My solution until now has been a raised steel screen contraption that I made to fit over the grate. It works great, but over the years it has been stepped on numerous times, and it also prevents the screen door from being opened past the drain. I think the atrium gate, after i've made some modifications, will be a good enough solution. But, I will have to swap it out for the normal drain when people come over so that it doesn't get stepped on, and prevent the door from opening all the way. Knowing me, I will likely forget to swap it back after such an event, so would like the inside drain functional as a precaution.
 

Scotchy

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For what it's worth. We had a few floods coming back from the street main sewer. After we switched to an overhead sewer it finally stopped. Basically add sump pit to basement where floor drain now connects to. Sump is sent to the ceiling of the basement and slopes to the main stack (overhead) Main stack drain is plugged up permanently as this is being serviced by the new sump pit.
 

Jeff H Young

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Reach4 a lot of good possibilitys for him to look at!
They allow rain water down sewer in your area?
Are the leaves blocking your own sewer and therefore your homes waste goes in basement ?
If this is case You need to find a method of not stopping up sewer and possibly halt dumping stormwater into sewer depending on city requirements.
Traps shoudnt suck dry unless there is a problem but its normal to have evaporation .
 

Jack.Straw

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Reach4 a lot of good possibilitys for him to look at!
They allow rain water down sewer in your area?
Are the leaves blocking your own sewer and therefore your homes waste goes in basement ?
If this is case You need to find a method of not stopping up sewer and possibly halt dumping stormwater into sewer depending on city requirements.
Traps shoudnt suck dry unless there is a problem but its normal to have evaporation .

Yes, rain water is allowed. In fact, our gutters go direct to sewer. We've talked about changing this.

The leaves are just blocking the grate holes on the drain in the walkout basement exterior. It isn't sewer water... it's just rain water that can't drain into the sewer fast enough due to the leaves. When this happens, it starts to fill up the walkout area and eventually leaks in around the basement door.

It's possible that it's just evaporation, as it is often very warm in that room due to it being the furnace room and also being very small in size. However, I think the washing machine in the room next door drains through that same pipe and often creates a gargling sound in the furnace room drain. I thought that perhaps something to do with that might be causing a suction or something. It's probably just evaporation i guess.
 
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