Another ? 11.25" rough-in, 10 or 12" Drake?

Discussion in 'Toilet Forum discussions' started by Treeman, Mar 2, 2018.

  1. Treeman

    Treeman Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2010
    Location:
    Michigan
    Toto CST744SL elongated.

    Title says it all. 11 and 1/4 inch from cast iron flange C/L to dry wall. Old building has 3/4 inch thick base board. About 10 3/8+ inch from flange C/L to base board.

    Can I squeeze the 12 inch C/L Toto Drake in... I will have to remove a small length of the baseboard (o.k., its a work shop). 1/4" wall gap to tank??

    Trying to figure out now what the 10" Drake model would look like - gap behind tank. 2 inch gap?

    Thank you.
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2018
  2. Reach4

    Reach4 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2013
    Location:
    IL
    You can probably slide the toilet away from the wall a bit, putting the exit a little off center but still existing into the flange hole.

    https://terrylove.com/pdf/cst744sl.pdf


    Yes, gap of over 2 inches. It is very unlikely you would have to go to a 10 inch.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 19, 2021
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  4. Treeman

    Treeman Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2010
    Location:
    Michigan
    Thank you Reach. I need to slow down and cut the panic attack before posting. This toilet has such a large footprint compared to the old one (still a 12" C/L). It threw me off.

    The 12" Drake has about 1/4" more leaway between the wall and both the tank and the base compared to the 10" model (at least per spec. sheets). My old cast flange is off just a bit in the slot alignment on top of the 11.25" C/L. I looked at the toilet outlet and took some more measurements. I should be able to offset the toilet at least 1/4" away from the C/L. It looks like I can achieve at least a 1/2" gap between tank top and wall. Gut enuf.

    I imagine the pros chuckle at us diyer's. Thank you again, Reach.
     
  5. wjcandee

    wjcandee Wise One

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2012
    Location:
    New York, NY
    It's the footprint at the baseboard that is going to be your issue, not your distance to the wall. If you have 11"+ on the basic (non-ADA) original Drake bowl CST744S, you're going to have 1/4 inch or more from the upper part of the bowl to the wall. So no problem (if the wall is plumb). The baseboard is another story.

    I have my CST744S in a space that is just about 10-3/8" from C/L to baseboard. It's not the identical bowl if you are going for the ADA one, but the non-ADA one will just fit. There's maybe 1/8 to 1/4 behind the porcelain foot of the bowl to the baseboard.

    The upper part of the bowl extends back further than that, so you need about 11" (as noted above, maybe a bit less even) from CL to wall for the upper part of my bowl. So if you have anything over 11" to the wall, you're golden there.

    Of course, there are variations in size due to variations in clay density; the thing shrinks a lot when it is fired in the kiln, and the differences in toilets can be pretty-large. TOTO is probably the most-consistent size out of the kiln, because they use special clay, so my bowl will probably fit without you needing to mess with the baseboard. But I mean JUST fit. When I put mine in, I crossed my fingers and was delighted that it fit. I just don't know whether the ADA bowl is so similar that it will work.

    Few toilets other than the Original Drake will have the ability to fit in 11" with a so-called 12" bowl.
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2018
  6. Treeman

    Treeman Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2010
    Location:
    Michigan
    Thank you, wjcandee. I stepped back from the project and will attempt install today. Broke my cardinal rule never to start a project on Friday afternoon and it bit me in the rear end. Go figure. As a diyer, I am inherently slow (but good). What becomes a stumbling block for us is the everyday routine for the pros.

    I took meticulous measurements and placed the toilet over the flange to check level, need for shims, etc. I learned you are correct about the casting dimensions being +/- . My base is a tad bit longer than spec.. I can remove a section of 3/4"+ thick baseboard with no evil effect, to gain the entire clearance to the wall. If I shift the bowl forward 1/4" I will achieve 11.5" C/L to wall. I "should" have a good 1/2" clearance both top and bottom.

    As always, your input is appreciated .
     
  7. wjcandee

    wjcandee Wise One

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2012
    Location:
    New York, NY
    Treeman: One of the few complaints about the original Drake is the size of the gap between wall and tank when folks mount it on a full 12". So, your situation may be a bit of a blessing. I should have taken a photo of the one in the bathroom on Long Island (not there right now), because the base is about 1/8 to 1/4" from the baseboard, and it looks and operates absolutely fine. It was no more difficult to install than any other toilet, once I was relieved to find that it actually just fit. So I would suggest trying it without removing baseboard or scootching it up a bit if it fits without doing so. Less work for you, and it will look nice.
     
  8. Reach4

    Reach4 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2013
    Location:
    IL
    In case he was not committed, I messaged him with UltraMax® II https://terrylove.com/pdf/ms604-specs.pdf info. It has a little extra baseboard space, but it has its downsides including cost.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 19, 2021
  9. Treeman

    Treeman Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2010
    Location:
    Michigan
    Follow up. The install went fine. I achieved a 11.5" rough in. I trimmed the thick baseboard - how did people get by without oscillating multi tools?? It doesn't look cobbled, and, again this is in my workplace office/shop bathroom and all that implies.

    My floor is slightly out of level, toilet back to front (1/8", not shim corrected) and the wall is slightly out of plumb. With toilet base 1/2" from finished wall, these conditions resulted in a full inch gap at the tank top, just the opposite of what the blue print specs. suggest.

    I am disappointed that the toilet front is 16 3/4" high, exacerbating the ADA height even more. Midwest folks barely know about bidets, let alone a squatty potty, LOL, and would laugh at the contraption.

    In Jaimie's CST744 install thread stickied at the top, he states that the Drake can be installed at a 11" rough in.
     
  10. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2004
    Occupation:
    Plumber
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    The CST744E, CST744S, CST744EL, CST744SL can be installed at 10-7/8" or more.
    The ADA bowl is at least 16.5" tall.
    The non-ADA bowls are about 14.5" tall.
    L = ADA aprox 16.5"
    F= comfort height, aprox 16-1/8" tall, which you see in the II series, which also need 11.5" to rough-in.
     
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