American Standard a Lost Cause? Toto Recommendation? Dual Flush Parts=New Toilet?

Discussion in 'Toilet Forum discussions' started by Achilles Heal, Apr 13, 2012.

  1. Achilles Heal

    Achilles Heal New Member

    Apr 13, 2012
    We had picked up a Cadet 3 at Home Depot but haven't installed it. Today I've been cruising through these forums and the trend seems to be that American Standard is a lost cause. Now I'm thinking of returning it. Comments?

    Seems like most recommend Toto. We have a Toto dealer in our city but were turned off with a four week delivery timeframe (our main bathroom is only good for that right now - bathing). We originally had a 1986 American Standard in gray that developed a cracked tank with (luckily) minimal leakage, but can't get gray anymore (seems like we can't from any manufacturer) to match the old sink and bathtub. So we went shopping around.

    If we go with Toto, are there recommendations on which unit? Here's what we had for criteria and could use comments on each:

    1. We have over 12" from bolts to wall for install in main floor bathroom.
    2. Want to install 6 litre or less flush unit. We were thinking dual flush because we were told by someone at Home Depot that a 4.8 litre flush leaves a lot less water in the bowl and results in 'messiness'. But then we were told by someone at Lowe's that we should avoid dual flush because the design is so integrated into the lid and tank that any parts replacements would require a complete toilet replacement. This sounds bizarre?
    3. We're thinking of elongated rather than round bowl, and higher height.
    4. Were told by a plumber friend that we should ensure the trap is glazed to lessen potential clogging.
    5. Guess we're stuck with getting white.

  2. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Sep 2, 2004
    Retired Systems engineer for defense industry.
    New England
    Your Cadet might install and work fine...but then again, it might not, and that's the problem.

    Many of the Toto units would meet your Terry's Toilet evaluations on his home page (link above). A solid choice would be the Drake II, but there are lots others if you like their looks better. My mother has two Drakes, I have a Vespin and a Carlyle - they all work well.
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  4. Gary Swart

    Gary Swart In the Trades

    Sep 1, 2004
    Yakima WA
    It's widely believed, although not proven, that AS unloads what might be called factory seconds or blems to discount houses at a very low price. Defects run around 25% on AS toilets purchased from discount centers. If you feel you want to go with AS, inspect the entire toilet before leaving the store. Yes, they will replace it later, but it save you a lot of time if you can discover the defects before taking it home. Defective Toto are less than 1%. Toto toilets are not sold in discount centers, but they are seldom sold at MSRP. You have a standard 12" rough-in which gives you the entire Toto line to choose from.
  5. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Aug 17, 2004
    Bothell, Washington
    Most dual flush toilets will have a bit less water in the bowl. Not a lot less though. I have some customers that really like their dual flush bowls. And parts can always be replaced if needed. The dual flush toilets I work with are easy to work with, with the exception of the WDI Ecoflush unit. I won't sell those.

    I mainly sell elongated bowls, and fewer round bowls. The taller bowl is coming into favor with an aging population.

    Most traps are glazed, even if it's a barely perceptible clear glaze. I prefer a trapway that is a little rough to prevent the paper from sticking to the smooth porcelain. A little texture allows the water to get under the paper and wash it away.

    For colors, I think Kohler has the most options. Matching your gray may be tough though.
  6. chrisf8657

    chrisf8657 New Member

    Feb 22, 2010
    Phoenix, AZ
    We've had our Cadet for about 2 years now and It works great.
    Just make sure there are no issues with the China or glazing before installing.
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