2 minutes for hot water to reach kitchen sink!

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Martinmbm

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Today I took my 59 year old (female) self into the 2' tall, 2200 SF, crawl space and made a schematic of the hot water supply circuit in our house. I want to improve the 2 minutes it takes for hot water to reach the kitchen tap. We inherited this mess. It looks like previously they tried a second in line hot water heater and a recirculating loop at the hot water heater bottom, but those have both already been disconnected. I attached a sketch (not to scale). Any ideas how to improve this? Thanks! Mari

martinmby-01.jpg
 

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Breplum

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Options:
1. Dedicated recirculation line with pump.
2. New tankless WH with pump and excellent smart controls built in.
3. Add a pump with hot water bridge. Taco makes one that mounts under the sink and Grundfos makes one that mounts on the WH and has a device that mounts on the fixture in question. Major downside is that controls are limited and your cold water piping is serving as the return part time so it is always warm/hot.
 

Jadnashua

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All of the engineered hot water recirculation systems I've seen shut the recirculation off when the incoming water reaches somewhere around 100F, so the cold-water line only gets warm, and depending on how long, maybe not all that far. On mine, flushing the toilet pretty much clears out all of the warm water in the cool line.
 

Jeff H Young

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reconnect your circ line and pump is the solution unless its plumbed wrong . the drawing too annoying to read sorry.
you should have a line from kitchen sink returning to w/h for it to solve issue
 

Martinmbm

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All of the engineered hot water recirculation systems I've seen shut the recirculation off when the incoming water reaches somewhere around 100F, so the cold-water line only gets warm, and depending on how long, maybe not all that far. On mine, flushing the toilet pretty much clears out all of the warm water in the cool line.
So you're saying the recirc line doesn't really work? I kind of agree. I was hoping to reduce complexity instead of adding it. There is a passive loop in the system and I'm wondering what impact that has? Does it make the situation worse, or doesn't it matter. Also, I was thinking plumb direct to kitchen sink (then washer, then bar) might help...
 

Jadziedzic

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A dedicated recirculation line works very well when it is coupled with a small pump feeding the bottom drain port of the water heater. I used a Bell & Gossett "ecocir e3" recirculating pump which consumes about as much power as an old incandescent night light, and has the ability to run either in thermostatically-controlled or timed operation.
 

Jeff H Young

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A dedicated recirculation line works very well when it is coupled with a small pump feeding the bottom drain port of the water heater. I used a Bell & Gossett "ecocir e3" recirculating pump which consumes about as much power as an old incandescent night light, and has the ability to run either in thermostatically-controlled or timed operation.

So you're saying the recirc line doesn't really work? I kind of agree. I was hoping to reduce complexity instead of adding it. There is a passive loop in the system and I'm wondering what impact that has? Does it make the situation worse, or doesn't it matter. Also, I was thinking plumb direct to kitchen sink (then washer, then bar) might help...
jadnashuas works, many of them work its very simple martinmbm, I'd re install pump
 

Plumbserve

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So you're saying the recirc line doesn't really work? I kind of agree. I was hoping to reduce complexity instead of adding it. There is a passive loop in the system and I'm wondering what impact that has? Does it make the situation worse, or doesn't it matter. Also, I was thinking plumb direct to kitchen sink (then washer, then bar) might help...
Sir if you have a passive system already, it is lacking proper pitch flat to slightly pitched 1/8" for 100 foot run. insulated heavy r-32 if possible then install proper themo-loop designed valve on return and flush out air. This design should maintain an 15 degree differential the total length of the 100 foot line provided minimum 5 foot of head (the higher the line the fast the circulation of the line) over the gravity valve.
 

JohnCT

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Sir if you have a passive system already, it is lacking proper pitch flat to slightly pitched 1/8" for 100 foot run. insulated heavy r-32 if possible then install proper themo-loop designed valve on return and flush out air. This design should maintain an 15 degree differential the total length of the 100 foot line provided minimum 5 foot of head (the higher the line the fast the circulation of the line) over the gravity valve.

That was a while ago - don't know if OP will respond.

Personally, I would tee directly at the HWH and feed a dedicated 1/2" pipe directly to the sink - no passing Go or collecting $200. It won't be instantaneous but will cut the time in half.

John
 
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