1941 Toilet Flange

Discussion in 'Toilet Forum discussions' started by 67Gizmo, Feb 16, 2008.

  1. 67Gizmo

    67Gizmo New Member

    Feb 16, 2008
    This is 1941 ranch house with a cement floor between the main floor and basement. It has cast iron pipes. The flange has finally rusted away. The hole is an oval shape that the pipe goes through and it looks like they used grout or some type of cement between the pipe and base of the flange to wedge the pipe for rigidity. I have access to everything through the unfinished basement. It looks like there is something like lead holding the flange and pipe together. How do I remove the old flange? Once I get it off, I think I have to attach a replacement flange to the pipe as was done before, because the hole is too large and there is not enough surface for 4 bolts, only the back two. I need to know how to remove the old flange and replace it.
  2. Gary Swart

    Gary Swart In the Trades

    Sep 1, 2004
    Yakima WA
    Since you have access to the pipe under the floor, I'd suggest you cut the cast iron pipe and transition to PVC. You can rent a cast iron cutter. Make the transition with a banded coupler that is sized on one end for cast iron and for PVC on the other. The new flange should set on top of the finished floor and be screwed though the finished floor into the sub floor. Obviously, the sub floor and finished floor should come pretty close to the flange for support, so you may need to take up at least some of the floor to do this.
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  4. 67Gizmo

    67Gizmo New Member

    Feb 16, 2008
    Thank you for responding. The problem is I don't have a wood floor and subfloor. It is cement between the upstairs and downstairs and I think that is where I have to be careful to not crack the cement floor. I think that is why I have to use cast iron to keep the rigidity.
  5. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Sep 2, 2004
    Retired Systems engineer for defense industry.
    New England
    Assuming it is a 4" pipe, cut things off, replace with pvc, get the part going through the floor nice and plumb at the proper position (leave it maybe a foot long so you can check it easier), then anchor it well using hydraulic cement. This stuff sets fast and expands as it sets...it will give you a strong anchor for the pipe. Once you've got that in, you can cut the pipe off flush with the floor and glue in an internal flange. Give it a few hours and drill some concrete anchors to then anchor the flange properly to the floor. If it's 3", then you don't want to use an internal flange. You could pack it with the hydraulic cement from below - you could set the flange flat on the floor - have someone hold it down flat while you pack the cement in from below.

    A pro may have some other thoughts, but this should work.
  6. 67Gizmo

    67Gizmo New Member

    Feb 16, 2008
    pictures of the toilet plumbing in concrete floor
  7. Dunbar Plumbing

    Dunbar Plumbing Master Plumber

    Apr 18, 2005
    Service Plumber, Outdoor Temperature Relief Owner
    Northern Kentucky/Greater Cincinnati Area
  8. Redwood

    Redwood Master Plumber

    Dec 15, 2007
    Service Plumber
    Boy oh boy this sure looks familiar see my answer to it in your other post I answered!
  9. MG

    MG New Member

    Jun 29, 2005
    Illinois - Near St. Louis
    I'd cut it in two places. First cut it off just above the cast iron hub (just below the floor). Then cut off the rest of it near the tee w/side inlet leaving a couple of inches or more to put a no-hub connector on. Then you'll have room to work to get that old flange and pipe piece out. If its rusted bad it should come out w/a bit of effort, then you can go w/PVC.

    Just my unprofessional opinion.
  10. Master Plumber Mark

    Master Plumber Mark Master Plumber

    Feb 6, 2005
    Sensitivity trainer.. plumber of mens souls
    indianapolis indiana - land of the free, home of
    The lost art of pouring a flange

    Of course I realize that this is a lost art, but hear me out ....

    Uless you want to replace the whole thing with PVC

    Before you do any of this you might want to go
    look for an OATY expansioin flange that fits
    down into that pipe.....and save yourself a lot of greif..

    to replace the FLANGE ONLY

    All you have to do is get a nice sharp cold chisel
    and get a nice East-wing hammer......

    then all you got to do is hit the cast falnge till is snaps
    and cracks into many peices,,,

    then all you got to do is break off that flange and clean off
    all the debris and lead that is around the flange.....

    then all you got to do is replace the flange with a NEW ONE
    for about $15 bucks....

    Now here is the lost art part...

    then all you got to do is get some oakum, re-use the lead
    that fell out of that flange or maybe get more.....

    pack the flange tight with oakum, so that their
    is about an inch of fall from the lip of the flange down to the packed oakum...

    Heat the lead up in a ladel and then pour the lead
    into the gap between the flange and the pipe.

    let it cool then use a chisel and tap down the lead..

    pouring hot molten lead to make a joint is kinda fun..
    My dad used to let me do it when I was 10
    years old and I still got the scars to prove it.......

    I should take pics and post them to
    show how this is done the next time I
    got to tangle with one.......

    if you dont have the time, tools or patience, I
    would try the OATy expanding flange first..........

    have fun
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2008
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