5 wires too much for a red wing nut?

[dlince]

Hey all -

Just starting to do some home electrical work, and my first attempt is to replace two light switches with smart light switches. The first one went smoothly - I shut off the breaker, double-checked multiple times with a voltage detector, watched a video (and read this forum) for instructions on how to tighten the wire nut, and it worked!

Then came the tricky one: replacing one switch in a two switch receptacle (apologies for any wrong terminology here) where instead of two neutral wires, I had 4. Reading some more, it seemed that I should wire the neutral from the light switch in with the 4 existing wires, so I used the existing red wing nut.

It seemed like it took them fine (I untwisted the nut, added in the new neutral wire next to the 4 already-twisted-together-wires, twisted until the wires themselves twisted a couple times, and then tugged to make sure). However, when I check some sites online, it seems like red wing nuts are only commonly used to connect 3 to 4 #14 or #12 wires. (I'm not sure of the size of the wires, but it's a 15 amp breaker, so probably 14 Ga?)

Am I causing potential problems here, and I should get a different wing nut (perhaps this one, which says it can handle 5 #12)? Or does this seem fine if it felt solid to a rank amateur?

Thanks in advance

 

[Afjes]

Most packages of wire nuts will have a color code chart on them to help you determine how many of what gauge conductors are safe to put under one wire nut. It is basically standardized but here is an example to show you.

Take a look at the charts in this link.

Just be sure that when you twist the conductors together you twist them well and tight and then twist the wire nut on the conductors and tighten that well. Also be sure that there is no bare metal showing of the conductors to lessen chances of a dead short.

 

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[WorthFlorida]

What model is the smart switch? I'm assuming you have to wire the neutral (wht) of the smart switch to a neutral connection. Check the amp rating of this new switch, it may not be 15 amps. Prewired dimmers, motion sensors, etc, use a smaller stranded wire to suit the amperage rating of the switch. Also, the neutral is used by the switch is to power its electronics, therefore, it probably only draws a few milliamps. Wire size can be anywhere from 14-18 gauge, most likely it is 16 gauge. When combiniting a stranded wire with solid copper, the strands will fall between the solid wires and it will not cause a problem. If it is a solid wire from the switch a larger wire nut may be needed.

 

[Kreemoweet]

Or use a 5-hole Lever-Nut: https://www.amazon.com/Wago-222-415-LEVER-NUTS-Conductor-Connectors/dp/B07CN5974J

 

[dlince]

Thanks all! I went and bought some new wing nuts (the one I linked above) and will plan to switch to the red one in it. I also didn't un-twist the 4 neutrals before I added the neutral for the smart switch, so I'll untwist, re-twist, and then put on the wing nut.

What model is the smart switch? I'm assuming you have to wire the neutral (wht) of the smart switch to a neutral connection. Check the amp rating of this new switch, it may not be 15 amps.

Kasa HS200. Looks like it is max 15A, but I don't see any other specific rating on it.

 

[dlince]

OK, update - I apparently can't count: there are six total neutral wires. However, the existing 5 wires appear to be 14 or 16 gauge (disclaimer: I don't see any labeling on the wire, so I'm judging that by how thick the copper is compared to my wire stripper), and the HS200 wire is somewhere between 14 and 18 based on comments from others.

Can someone help me understand if I can use the red wing nut shown below? I'd assume since #14 is smaller gauge than #12, and this can handle 5 #12, 6 #14 or smaller should be fine...but I'm not sure if that sort of math works here with wing nuts, and I can't find a chart that calls out 6 wires in one wing nut.

If it doesn't work, is a lever-nut the only other thing I can use? There is very little space in this light switch box, so I can't imagine being able to fit it in.

Thanks!

 

[dlince]

Or use a 5-hole Lever-Nut:

Thanks for sharing this! Do you think the 6-hole version would take up less space than a wall nut?

 

[WorthFlorida]

A red cap is good to use. Don't use these lever nuts inside a wall box. They're good for use in the for a light fixture box or the light fixture itself to terminate the wires. With A wire nut it's copper wire to copper wire. Even with five wires it's one connection. A lever nut is five connections.

 

[dlince]

Great, thank you!