Cast iron sewer trap + pipe encased in concrete.

[DIYorBust]

A bonus I like about my house trap is that any backup can drain out to the street vent before backing up into a shower drain. It's never happened to me, but I've seen it happen. We have combined sewers so a storm can cause the sewer level to rise.

 

[Reach4]

A bonus I like about my house trap is that any backup can drain out to the street vent before backing up into a shower drain.

What does a street vent look like?

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Reach4]

Adding a house trap is just adding another means of protection

While I am not going to turn to liking building traps, I now see positives that I had not seen before. Very good points. The downside of clog-point and hard to rod the sewer are why I am not switching to be an advocate. That flammable fumes thing was compelling. I don't think that is common, but I could see it happening.

I have septic, so it is not directly relevant to me.

 

[Sylvan]

I never knew that house traps were considered dispensible. Can you explain the logic?

It takes a certain mindset to take away protection to save a few dollars for the price of a running trap


Although on a storm line a single cleanout (P TRAP) is allowed I use a double running trap so it is easier to snake or water Jet up or downstream

This is what separates those who take plumbing seriously and not just dabbling in it installing bare minimum code requirements

 

[DIYorBust]

Zoom in on this picture, you will see the vent between the bottom two windows. Sometimes I've also seen them hidden in the wall behind a round grate.
https://www.dwell.com/home/brooklyn-townhouse-f93ea0e3/6614995625054478336

 

[Reach4]

Zoom in on this picture, you will see the vent between the bottom two windows. Sometimes I've also seen them hidden in the wall behind a round grate.

They sometimes put sewer vents in yards in California, but they may be more overflows. They are named after some California city.

 

[Reach4]

It takes a certain mindset to take away protection to save a few dollars for the price of a running trap

Then the whole house traps in NYC can be running traps? Or is that for just storm drain traps?

 

[Sylvan]

While I am not going to turn to liking building traps, I now see positives that I had not seen before. Very good points. The downside of clog-point and hard to rod the sewer are why I am not switching to be an advocate. That flammable fumes thing was compelling. I don't think that is common, but I could see it happening.

I have septic, so it is not directly relevant to me.

Unfortunately, trap seal loss in boiler rooms can and do cause fires and some explosions did occur when either the boiler or the order types of water heaters fired up

Not very common but when it happens people wonder how it did occur

Sewer gases are highly flammable and carcinogenic

As I got older I realized pulling 3 and 4-foot wrenches may not be as easy so I looked into the expert witness gig and there is a gold mine testifying against incompetent contractors

The problem with a public sewer connection is you have no idea what some moron may have poured down their sewer line

One of the cases I had was the Russians have a compound in Riverdale (Bronx) and they used gasoline as a cleaning fluid and poured the old gasoline down a drain

A ROTO company did the main sewer stoppage in a one-family home across from the Russians and the idiot forgot to put a fits all plug on the street side of the running trap

There was a slight rain and the gasoline vapors entered the lady's basement and her gas driver came on and cause a major fire. She and her 6-year-old son did escape. I was hired to replace the furnace and repipe the gas lines and testified how the ROTO company was responsible ( we could not sue the Russians)


https://www.washingtonpost.com/arch...-blasts/6c7525de-807c-4d16-a53f-a84c597904fd/


and

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louisville_sewer_explosions

 

[Sylvan]

I actually worked for them and they do pay their bills BUT offer vodka before 9 AM seriously as to them its normal

https://nypost.com/2018/07/21/residents-near-russian-diplomat-building-say-spies-are-everywhere/

 

[Jeff H Young]

Its not a wonder of why they were /are installed . But I think they are not widely used outside a handful of states. Im not so sure it would even be legal everywhere to put house traps. and Jim caps are for temporary use dont take place of ibco or blind plug. not many of our citys allow any stormwater into sewer.

 

[Jeff H Young]

Other than NYC IPC and upc not only dont require house traps but they are Specificaly prohibited from being installed Maybe thats why we dont put them in they appear to be illegal. i didnt see pictures of cracked sewer lines or explanation just code chapters prohibiting them

 

[Sylvan]

Its not a wonder of why they were /are installed . But I think they are not widely used outside a handful of states. Im not so sure it would even be legal everywhere to put house traps. and Jim caps are for temporary use dont take place of ibco or blind plug. not many of our citys allow any stormwater into sewer.

Correct the Jim caps were replaced

 

[Sylvan]

Then the whole house traps in NYC can be running traps? Or is that for just storm drain traps?

Running traps are for the main sewers Storm / Sanitary.

Old code required that a storm trap had to be 40 pipe diameters upstream before connecting to a sanitary line

No vent required on a storm trap

 

[Reach4]

OK. I am now thinking that you would class the trap you showed in #24 as a running trap. I had had too narrow view of what a running trap is.

 

[Sylvan]

 

[Sylvan]

Storm trap

 

[Jeff H Young]

Why are all those traps prohibitted? seems like a good idea but cant install them even if I wanted to unless I was someplace without codes.

 

[Sylvan]

I would like to meet a code official and ask why they are against main sewer traps and would allow Cheater vents

I can understand why they would want to eliminate a trap that is outside the building subject to freezing which I did come across from a home built in 1860. Other than possible freeze up I would like to know why they would be against it

 

[Reach4]

Main objection to whole building traps is they tend to cause clogs and make cleaning the sewer lines difficult. Plus it vents the city sewer through roof vents of the houses, although that could be addressed if the clogging and cleaning things were not problems.

 

[Sylvan]

Main objection to whole building traps is they tend to cause clogs and make cleaning the sewer lines difficult. Plus it vents the city sewer through roof vents of the houses, although that could be addressed if the clogging and cleaning things were not problems.

Actually, a running trap is very easy to either snake (rod) or water Jet and use a wet-dry to remove debris (coins, jewelry), etc from the belly of the trap

By having a double opening it is very easy to go up and downstream and there is a lot of space before the outlet or inlet are blocked

Funny how people will have the oil changed for their car, have an HVAC system checked yearly but think once the plumbing is installed they take it for granted it will never need service

Once you educate the accounts you will have very little downtime

For example when I first started out I used to offer a discount for a yearly cleaning of all the leader lines and yard drains and main sewer being snaked and the main house trap cleaned (WET DRY or Laddle)

What I did was schedule several jobs a day for October and November for jetting and snaking because of the fall season and leaves blocking lines

Each call is a minimum of $750 and on average it takes one man less than an hour

I had two accounts around the corner from each other and I charged by the leader /floor/yard/area drains $125 each

One lady has 23 drains and it took me almost 4 hours and the other account had 18 drains and took about 3 hours ...7 hour day $5,125 per day and I have 30+ houses not to mention old age homes and the commercial accounts

Because I was doing it once a year the actual jetting of each drain was normally less than 15 minutes the set it took most of the time

The first time I did it took over an hr a drain as this house never had routine drain cleaning and has a total of 23 leader lines and it belonged to the Gambles (Procter and Gamble) below

The reason I was able to convince them to do it yearly is their copper leader lines were blocked and split open from a freeze-up Behind the bushes I installed cleanout Tee's to law easier access to the storm lines

I told them to call a roofer I know to clear the gutters and the next day I would do the leader lines or I would show up the same time the roofer was there and he would pass my hoses down the leader lines

Look how easy it would be to run a Jetter hose or 3/4" cable in either direction