Ugh - Renovation blocked, ceiling under plumbing - little help?

Hello,

We're halfway through a bathroom/laundry room renovation in the House That's Full of Surprises.

The latest is that we had some (suspected) asbestos ceiling tile formally abated while they were taking out vinyl asbestos floor tile. They found (2) layered ceilings in the 5x5ft bathroom, which sits directly under another bathroom on the 2nd floor. One layer was drywall, and the 2nd layer was ceiling tiles applied with an adhesive.

Well, I'm about to screw up some XP drywall as a new ceiling, and I realized that the upstairs shower waste line sits about 1/2 to 3/4-inch BELOW the ceiling line. I can't figure out how the heck they had the ceiling and light fixture up there, since it looks like the horizontal ceiling drywall rested ON TOP of the vertical wall drywall. They must have had a hole in the ceiling where the pipe was, or simply bowed it around the pipe so that it wasn't level. And the light fixture must have been 2-3 inches below the electrical box. I was wondering why the screws were 3 inches long. Maybe the upstairs shower wasn't original to the house?

My plan is to use furring strips to get an extra half-inch or an inch (or more) - enough to clear the pipe.

QUESTION ONE: How far beneath the pipe should the ceiling be? Does it matter? Is there a code requirement or best practice?

QUESTION TWO: If I use furring strips, the horizontal ceiling drywall won't rest on the vertical wall drywall - unless I did something drastic, like remove an inch or two off the top of the vertical panels, which seems almost undoable. Would it be OK to use a 1x1, half x 2, 1x2 or similar here ripped from some GDF studs for furring strips? I'd then have to drop the light fixture by an inch or two, screw up the XP, tape and spackle.

Thanks!

I would remove a foot or so of drywall off of the top of the walls, build the ceiling down to clear the plumbing, board the ceiling, board the top of the walls and then mud/tape.

Proper practice when drywalling is always ceiling first.

Hello,

Thanks. I know that would be "best practices" for a new room, but there's no other way in this specific instance? That's going to probably add a full day to the project, once I deal with cutting the existing drywall, getting straight and clean cuts around the door, window, extra taping, sanding, etc...

I always like to do things "right" instead of fast, but since this is only a 5x5 ceiling that will probably be 2-3 pieces of drywall, is there really much risk that it will ever end up sagging if I've got it screwed in to furring strips spaced a foot or so apart?

Thanks again.

Well, I also typically hate them...but what about a suspended ceiling in this circumstance? I guess they've got some nicer patterns these days.

ceiling

The ONLY reason for doing the ceiling first in a new application is that it makes installing the walls easier. Just run your drywall against the wall and tape it. 1x1 are COMPLETELY useless. Why not BUY 1x2's instead of ripping them, but I might even prefer 1x3's.

Thanks. All feedback is appreciated.

I think I was originally thinking about the furring strips in the wrong way.

There's already a 2x4 structure for the ceiling that sits below the joists, so I was originally thinking that I would just add strips to that to lower their height. But technically, it seems like it would be smarter to run 1x3 furring strips perpendicular to the 2x4s, which would give me the added distance.

I looked at a fire-retardant dropped ceiling at Home Depot, but it seems like you need an evenly spaced room to really make it work with the nicer, patterned tiles. If the panels are 2x2 and the room is 5ft, 5 inches, I'd end up having to cut tiles and the ceiling might end up looking asymmetrical.

hj said:

The ONLY reason for doing the ceiling first in a new application is that it makes installing the walls easier. Just run your drywall against the wall and tape it. 1x1 are COMPLETELY useless. Why not BUY 1x2's instead of ripping them, but I might even prefer 1x3's.

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Sorry, but that is not the only reason.

Good thing you're a plumber and not a drywaller.

If that was to make it easier to board the walls, why wouldn't they just do the walls first...

drywallers always do the ceiling first.... always.

Peter Griffin said:

drywallers always do the ceiling first.... always.

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Exactly.

And it's not "to make the walls easier"...

The reason you drywall the ceiling 1st is because the walls drywall supports the ceiling drywall so everything is tied in togeather. This makes it much stronger and helps with the load distribution on the house.

nonsense...the drywall screws hold the drywall up on the ceiling...the drywall on the walls has nothing to do with support of the ceiling....

If installed right a drywalled ceiling will stay up just as long with or without the walls be drywalled...

walls

It is easier to "rough cut" the ceiling then slide the walls up to meet it, than to put the walls up, then do precise cuts on the ceiling to match the walls. Drywalling is about "production" and the easier it is to install it the faster it goes.

DW on the walls is holding up the DW on the ceiling? Good grief. What about the sheets that don't abut walls?

The ONLY reason to do the ceiling first, is that this:



is a whole lot easier to fill & tape, than this:



Okay, not the only reason, as HJ points out, it's also easier to cut/fit, in the first place. But it's got nothing to do with holding the ceiling up. If you were depending on the wall sheetrock to hold up the ceiling sheetrock... oh, good grief.

frenchie said:

DW on the walls is holding up the DW on the ceiling? Good grief. What about the sheets that don't abut walls?

The ONLY reason to do the ceiling first, is that this:

is a whole lot easier to fill & tape, than this:

Okay, not the only reason, as HJ points out, it's also easier to cut/fit, in the first place. But it's got nothing to do with holding the ceiling up. If you were depending on the wall sheetrock to hold up the ceiling sheetrock... oh, good grief.

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I was told this by a professional contractor *shrugs*

frenchie said:

DW on the walls is holding up the DW on the ceiling? Good grief. What about the sheets that don't abut walls?

The ONLY reason to do the ceiling first, is that this:

is a whole lot easier to fill & tape, than this:

Okay, not the only reason, as HJ points out, it's also easier to cut/fit, in the first place. But it's got nothing to do with holding the ceiling up. If you were depending on the wall sheetrock to hold up the ceiling sheetrock... oh, good grief.

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I was told this by a professional contractor *shrugs* Maybe he was pulling my chain lol.

Why do it right, when you can do it the hack way...

Go ahead just do the ceiling, then mud and tape it yourself and be choked with the results of the inside corner.

Doherty Plumbing said:

I was told this by a professional contractor *shrugs* Maybe he was pulling my chain lol.

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If he told you it helps hold the ceiling up... ask him what's holding up the sheets that don't butt to a wall.

The only circumstance I can think of, where you depend on the wall rock to help support the ceiling rock, sort of... is in new construction, with trusses. As the lumber in the trusses dries out, they uplift, and that can crack the corner seam. To prevent cracking, in that situation, you leave the edges of the ceiling (last 8" or so) unfastened - no screws or nails - and let the wall sheetrock support it. The resulting flex, allows the joint to remain closed when the ceiling lifts. But even then, it's only supporting the edges of the ceiling, not the field. And it's not really supporting the edges, once the trusses uplift, it's actually holding the edges down.

dlarrivee said:

Why do it right, when you can do it the hack way...

Go ahead just do the ceiling, then mud and tape it yourself and be choked with the results of the inside corner.

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The hack way? You've got a lot of attitude for an amateur. How many ceilings and walls have you drywalled & taped in your day?

Oh I've never done it, I'm just a janitor.