What might I have hit between brick & bearer?

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Dragan322

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I'm trying to add an outdoor electrical outlet box to the corner of my 1985-built ranch home. I chose a spot 7 inches from the electric meter that had me drilling into the mortar between brick on the outside and into what I believe is called the bearer (wood) that sits on top of the cinder block of my basement inside. I could not get the two holes to line up to fish wiring through, although I did get a string through. There seems to be something in between the brick and bearer.

Here's what may be the stupid part of what I did next. Because I didn't have a bit long enough to drill into whatever the barrier is, I took a long flathead screwdriver and began twisting it slowing and with pressure to try and get through whatever is blocking my way. I figured it was maybe Tyvex.

I got about 1/4" to 1/2" through from the outside when I heard what sounded like a faint pop inside. It seems I somehow I shorted the fuse to our electric range. What really bewilders me, though, is that the 220 line from the breaker box to the range comes nowhere near the hole I made. Neither does any electrical line. I followed every single line out of the breaker box, and nothing goes into that space between the outside brick and the inside wood bearer. Even if a line went up into the house and back down into that area, it would not be the range wiring and I wouldn't think any wiring would be in a location like that. I am totally bewildered as to what I could have hit and what connection it has to the range.

When I reset the range breaker, the range works fine, but I'm worried that I may have a bigger problem now because maybe I exposed something electrical there?
Thanks
 

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hj

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Logically, if whatever you hit tripped the range breaker, it WAS the range supply wire. You probably removed the insulation from at least one of the two hot wires and the screwdriver shorted out without breaking them. The screwdriver should have a black mark on it. If this is what happened, then the wire may have been compromised.
 

Dragan322

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Logically, if whatever you hit tripped the range breaker, it WAS the range supply wire. You probably removed the insulation from at least one of the two hot wires and the screwdriver shorted out without breaking them. The screwdriver should have a black mark on it. If this is what happened, then the wire may have been compromised.
Thanks for your response, HJ. I'm certain I didn't hit the 220 range line, as I know exactly where it is (and it's nowhere near that cavity I drilled into. Is there anything else I could have hit that might have caused the range fuse to trip? I did think to check the screwdriver, and there was no black mark on it at all.
 

Jadnashua

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Well, think about it...if it wasn't the range, how would you have blown that fuse? Unless you can see every inch of the wire from the range to the power panel, it could have been run anywhere, and shorting it is the only thing that will cause it to blow (well, an excessive load that isn't a short can do it, too).
 

Dragan322

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Well, think about it...if it wasn't the range, how would you have blown that fuse? Unless you can see every inch of the wire from the range to the power panel, it could have been run anywhere, and shorting it is the only thing that will cause it to blow (well, an excessive load that isn't a short can do it, too).
I can see every inch of that range line, from the fuse in the circuit panel box to the range receptacle. About five years ago I replaced the original aluminum wiring with copper and also that receptacle. You mentioned the "excessive load" possibility. Do you mean that only in regard to the range line? Thanks.
 

Dragan322

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Was the stove in use at the time of the incident?
Funny you ask, because I wondered that as well -- and checked with my wife. She hadn't used the range that day at all, and she said that there was nothing in particular that happened the day before. No spilled water, using multiple burners, etc. One thing I'm going to do tonight is to pull the range out to see if there's anything suspicious.
 

DonL

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How is your electrical Panel / Meter Grounded ?

Was you using a Insulated Drill ?

If you did short 220 out, I do not think you would be able to get the screwdriver back out, because it would most likely be welded to the wire.


Good Luck, Poke the screwdriver back in the hole, Wearing your PPE , and please report back.
 
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Dragan322

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How is your electrical Panel / Meter Grounded ?

Was you using a Insulated Drill ?

If you did short 220 out, I do not think you would be able to get the screwdriver back out, because it would most likely be welded to the wire.


Good Luck, Poke the screwdriver back in the hole, Wearing your PPE , and please report back.
There's a copper ground wire that goes from the electrical panel into the same hole as the big thick bundled wire that goes outside to the meter. Outside the hole, the ground wire goes straight down into something buried into the soil there. It does not go into that cavity I stuck the screwdriver into. I didn't use an insulated drill -- just a screw driver with a plastic handle.
I don't have PPE and I'm thinking I might not want to poke anything inside that hole again. If I can't figure this out, maybe I'll cut the brick out to get a look at what's inside. Thx.
 

Dragan322

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underground. Never thought about that.
Here a few photos that show the situation, along with indication where the holes I drilled are.
 

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hj

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quote; Dragan, does your power come in overhead or underground?

The power line would NEVER be exposed wiring, always in a conduit. What a rat's nest of wiring, but it does not give us any clue as to what happened.
 
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JWelectric

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anyone ever hear about flashing? That is a brick wall is it not? Then there will be flashing in the area of the two holes outlined in the photos. Many contractors use a metal flashing. Could it be metal flashing?
 

FullySprinklered

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Dragan, you're wearing me out. Maybe you're being pranked, I don't know. One last thing to consider is the possibility of a weak breaker kicking due to the vibration caused by all that hole drilling, etc. I've seen that once or twice. So, take a large hammer and pound on the osb around your panel and see if any breakers kick out. If so, you may have found the smoking gun we've all been looking for. Good luck, man.
 

Dragan322

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Not sure what you mean about being pranked, but I'll definitely try the hammer idea. If that's a possibility (I would never have guessed this is a possibility), that to me is one of the more plausible ideas. When I was trying to get through whatever it was (now believe it was flashing as jwelecrtric suggested) last Saturday, I was hammering the end of the screwdriver alternately with pushing and turning it when I heard the pop and later found that the range fuse was tripped. I've exhausted all ideas (and probably all of you) with this. I just didn't want to kill myself by punching into a 220 line! If the hammer idea doesn't trip the breaker, then I'm going to chisel out a brick and find out what's really there. Thanks for all your suggestions and help, everyone.
 

FullySprinklered

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Actually, no problem. The underground line comes up through a conduit and into the electric meter. It does not enter the area where I have a problem.
I asked him about the underground vs overhead service to try and get a better visual on where the cables were in relation to the hole he was drilling. The service cable is in conduit of course, but the cable from the meter to the panel is not. I did mention something about grasping at straws.
 

Bluebinky

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anyone ever hear about flashing? That is a brick wall is it not? Then there will be flashing in the area of the two holes outlined in the photos. Many contractors use a metal flashing. Could it be metal flashing?
I like the metal flashing theory. Don't know why I didn't think of that.

The vibration theory came to mind too, but that's probably not it since it was prying with a screw driver not pounding with a hammer that tripped the breaker.
 

Dragan322

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I think the flashing possibility makes sense also. I was both hammering and twisting the screwdriver that day. I tried last night to trip the range switch by hammering against the OSB. Then I tried hitting the breaker box a bit with the side of the hammer. It finally did trip one 120 breaker though, so maybe it was a fluke thing that hammering the flashing caused vibration that tripped the 220 range line. I think this case is closed. Thanks all!
 
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