What Causes the Brine Draw to be Very Slow in Water Softener?

Discussion in 'Water Softener Forum, problems, installation and r' started by Biddle, Apr 2, 2011.

  1. Biddle

    Biddle New Member

    Messages:
    14
    Location:
    Tolland, CT
    I have two water softeners plumbed in line with each other to remove iron. The brine draw by water softener #1 is very slow: a guess is that is takes about 30 minutes to draw a gallon of brine from the brine tank. The brine draw from water softener #2 is very fast: a guess is that it takes 5 or 6 minutes to draw a gallon of brine. I'm concerned that water softener #2 isn't getting sufficient brine to backwash the resin because it draws brine so slowly. Both softeners have Fleck 2510 control heads. Water softener #1 (the slow one) was just recently installed. The Fleck 2510 control head I put on it was previously used with an iron filter tank. At the advice of a water softener parts company, I replaced the DLFC button in the control head with a 2.0 gpm DLFC since it was now going to be used on a water softener as opposed to an iron filter. Any thoughts as to why one water softener is so slow while the other is so fast and how I can fix it? Thanks for your help.
  2. Akpsdvan

    Akpsdvan In the Trades

    Messages:
    1,483
    Location:
    Alaska
    What color is the injector throat and nozzle?
    What size tank is this challenge valve on? 8" 9" 10" 12" 13"
    It is possible that the injector is gray......... that is used for the pot perm or greensand units.....
    It has a different flow than that of the softener set ups.

    What color is the injector throat and nozzle in the one that is working ?
  3. Biddle

    Biddle New Member

    Messages:
    14
    Location:
    Tolland, CT
    Injector is white. Throat is gray. Tank is 9" diameter. When the back wash part of the cycle starts there is a high squealing sound until it moves on to the brine and slow rinse part of the cycle.
  4. Akpsdvan

    Akpsdvan In the Trades

    Messages:
    1,483
    Location:
    Alaska
    Throat and nozzle need to be a matched set, ie same color for it to work correctly.

    White is the correct one for the top, you just need to get a white nozzle.

    The gray is used for the pot perm.
  5. Biddle

    Biddle New Member

    Messages:
    14
    Location:
    Tolland, CT
    I understand. Thank you. I'll order one right away. Do you think the mismatch is what was causing squealing during the back wash as well as causing a slow brine draw?
  6. Akpsdvan

    Akpsdvan In the Trades

    Messages:
    1,483
    Location:
    Alaska
    I would say that it is a high likely hood....

    The noise in the backwash is more from the water going through the flow control and then that adapter then tube to the drain.. if there is a 90 elbow right at the exit and small tubing that can some times get the noise level up..

    But the slow brine draw............ oh very most likely......
  7. Biddle

    Biddle New Member

    Messages:
    14
    Location:
    Tolland, CT
    Thanks for all your help.
  8. Biddle

    Biddle New Member

    Messages:
    14
    Location:
    Tolland, CT
    I see on internet sites I can buy the Fleck 1650 assembly, which includes the piston for $34 or the 1650 value body for $8. Does any one sell just the piston assembly if the body is good? My problem is that the piston is stuck. Should I buy the Fleck 1650 assembly, the valve body only, or the piston assembly only? Thanks for your words of wisdom.
  9. Akpsdvan

    Akpsdvan In the Trades

    Messages:
    1,483
    Location:
    Alaska
    One might be able to find a dealer that would sell just the piston for the 1650, but the only real challenge that I could see it that there is an O ring in the plastic housing ,, it might still be good or it might not be good..

    I am trying to remember the last time that I had a 1650 body go bad........ it is possible...... but low on the list of things going wrong.

    Are you able to get the piston out of the housing?
  10. Biddle

    Biddle New Member

    Messages:
    14
    Location:
    Tolland, CT
    The housing is brass. What could go wrong with a brass housing? Intuitively, I would think it is the piston assembly that is bad. Don't know how to get the piston out of the brass housing. I tried pullining on it. It did not seem to want to give. I was reluntant to grab it with a plyers and pull on it for fear I would scratch it all up.
  11. Akpsdvan

    Akpsdvan In the Trades

    Messages:
    1,483
    Location:
    Alaska
    Brass body....... it is easier to work with on getting the piston out.
    With the body with the piston off the system.
    Remove the retaining ring.. then tap the piston out with the use of a table top .. that is often the best way to get the piston to get pushed out through the back or where the brine valve seat is at.... with the tip of the piston now flush with the front side the seat should almost be out of the housing.
    I have used silicon grease for water treatment on the shaft after using a finger nail to clean off build up on the piston off.. the silicon goes on and then the piston goes in tip first from the front of the housing and moved back and forth til it is sliding with ease and then the whole thing goes back together.

    I have done this to many and gotten years on brine pistons.
    If the coat on the shaft is cut up then it will need to be replaced.
  12. Biddle

    Biddle New Member

    Messages:
    14
    Location:
    Tolland, CT
    Tried to remove the piston from the housing tonight. No luck. I placed the housing piston side down so that the piston was against a block of wood. I tapped on the back of the housing with a hard rubber mallet. The piston moved as far as the valve seat and then would move no more. I was hoping it would push the seat out as it came out. No such luck. I tried to take the seat out with a screw driver since that seemed to be stopping the piston from coming out. I just seem to be carving up the seat so I decided I'd best give it a rest and check with you.
  13. Akpsdvan

    Akpsdvan In the Trades

    Messages:
    1,483
    Location:
    Alaska
    Sounds like the assembly is going to need a good soak in some citric acid....
    There sounds to be a good build up around the piston and the inside of the housing and also on the o ring that keeps the water from coming out around the piston.
  14. Biddle

    Biddle New Member

    Messages:
    14
    Location:
    Tolland, CT
    If I manage to get it out, does any company on the web sell just the piston and seat? The gray surface coating of the piston is now scratched up from me trying to get it out.
  15. Akpsdvan

    Akpsdvan In the Trades

    Messages:
    1,483
    Location:
    Alaska
    So far I have not seen one of the on lines selling just the piston that you are looking for..
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