Water Softener Questions

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It would be a lot easier to just leave everything in place, which would allow you to hook up the softener (with its own bypass), and completely isolate the softener and its bypass if necessary. Then just close the middle valve, leave the other two open, and use the softener's bypass alone until you have problems with it.

My problem is that I have been told not to use gate valves because they restrict flow, and more importantly, I have no idea how to solder and really dont feel like buying the tools to do it, haha. Nice title btw. Love working with computers, not so much plumbing. :(
 
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Ok, found that (same thing, different brand) tube at the hardware store. It is freaking awesome. Install should be relatively easy.

The only thing i dont understand is the bypass valve on the wall, that i'll be dismantling into 2 pipes and hooking up to the softeners bypass valve. What the hell is it? As a I understand it, a bypass valve should look like this: http://hostedmedia.reimanpub.com/TFH/Projects/Lead-Image/FH05OCT_PLUMBW_01.JPG

Mine looks like this: http://imgur.com/a/m7u3X

Anyone care to try to explain it to me? Sorry that I have the plumbing knowledge of a 10 year old. :(

As always, thanks again!
 

Mikey

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Those two bits of plumbing are functionally identical. The objective is to arrange valves so that water can be diverted through a 2nd path (in this case, a water softener). The softener bypass typically has only two knobs, but each knob can divert the water into one of two paths --- straight into the softener, or across the bypass to the other leg. Without a purpose-built bypass, you construct that same functionality using three straight-through valves, as both the pictures show. Both of the two configurations work exactly the same way, as I described in #18.
 
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Thanks for looking that over. I'm now thinking that, like you advised, it may be a good idea to keep a bypass on the valve, but instead of using whatever is there, I may take it down and reconstruct it, possibly using sharkbite fittings (i know, i know), or just learning how to solder and work with what I have. Probably a good skill to pick up anyway. If I do it using sharkbite fittings, I'm gonna have to get a ton of freaking fittings, which will suck (2x 3/4 to 3/4 ball valves, 2x copper T fittings, figure out how to construct the center bypass, etc). :(
 
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Mikey

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Soldering isn't all that hard, just takes a little practice. I sure wouldn't bother taking the existing stuff apart, only to replace it with expensive but equivalent stuff, uless you've got a real good reason I'm not seeing. BTW, one detail I forgot to mention that may or may not apply in your case: the rightmost vertical pipe in the linked image feeds unsoftened water to wherever it goes. Usually outdoor hose bibs used for irrigation don't get softened water (although those used for car-washing do), so it's handy to have a source of unsoftened water available. That's something a sharp architect or builder will consider in the early design -- lots harder to do after the house is built. Any such pre-softener branch isn't obvious in your picture, but it may be there somewhere.
 

Hiperco

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Hello,

I will be purchasing a Fleck 5600SXT 48,000 grain capacity water softener. However, before I order, I've got a few questions:

1)What place do you guys think is the best place to order from? I've been recommended qualitywatertreatment.com, ohiopurewater.com, and qualitywaterforless.com. They're all within the same amount of money, and they all seem to be pretty good.

Any comments on these places?
 
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Err, should I be considering the 7000sxt over the 5600sxt if I have 3/4" pipes? I can't tell if it's better or not (if you have 3/4" pipes)--some people say yes, some people say no.
 

ditttohead

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There is no disadvantage to using the 7000SXT over the 5600 series except for the physical size. The 7000 valve is larger, but it is slightly smaller than the old style 5600 series with the paddle wheel meters (distance out the back of the valve), most of the 5600SXT series use the turbine meter so they are slightly smaller. The 7000 has some nice 90 degree adapters available (pt# 61601) that can be used to save space and it also has 3/4" sweat adapters or 3/4" threaded plastic adapters.
The 5600SXT is a good valve, a little old in the design but a solid valve that will serve you well for many years. Both valves are very easy to maintain, but neither should need to be rebuilt for at least a decade. Check out the video below to see how simple the 7000 is.
 
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There is no disadvantage to using the 7000SXT over the 5600 series except for the physical size. The 7000 valve is larger, but it is slightly smaller than the old style 5600 series with the paddle wheel meters (distance out the back of the valve), most of the 5600SXT series use the turbine meter so they are slightly smaller. The 7000 has some nice 90 degree adapters available (pt# 61601) that can be used to save space and it also has 3/4" sweat adapters or 3/4" threaded plastic adapters.
The 5600SXT is a good valve, a little old in the design but a solid valve that will serve you well for many years. Both valves are very easy to maintain, but neither should need to be rebuilt for at least a decade. Check out the video below to see how simple the 7000 is.

Thanks for the info dittohead. I guess the question is...what advantages does the 7000sxt have over the 5600sxt? All I have heard about is that it has larger internal valves and something about microswitching and resolution. :p
 

robshobs

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Lending my two cents to the plumbing question, I installed my system on Monday. I cut into the main copper line and installed a bypass valve system using Sharkbite connectors and valves from Home Depot. I then used flexible tubing to tie the softner to the water lines. It took me less than 20 minutes from the time I cut into the main line until I was done.

I intend to put a quick frame behind the PEC tubing to secure it better.

Rob

Softener Plumbing.jpg
 
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Thanks for the picture and info! Your area definitely seems much cleaner than mine, haha.

Bah, trying to decide if I need a 64,000 grain softener or not. This is maddening. I hate our water company.
 

Frieso Pouwer

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When I saw the picture, I had to laugh! I spend roughly an hour and half setting up softeners, installing them, and then testing them to make sure they work well, so when you said 20 minutes, I think that is awesome! Shark bite fittings are great and there is a valve from Clack Corporation that you get those fittings right in the back of them, but you made good use of what you had. Just a quick question though, The stainless steel braided hose you put in, there wasn't anything longer was there in home depot. Would have been nice keep it all in copper. Don't get me wrong pex is good, just not as straight as copper. Oh and amateurplumber1 unless you have a house with like 6 bathrooms and about 18 residents living you don't need 64kGr softener. Its all about the flow for that. There is roughly 2 cubic feet of resin in a tank that large and will handle flows of up to 10 gallons per minute. So unless it is a big house on an acreage with a well pump that can do that, then just go for a 33kGr or a 45kGr water softener depending if you can get 5gpm or 7gpm out of your lines.
 

robshobs

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When I saw the picture, I had to laugh! I spend roughly an hour and half setting up softeners, installing them, and then testing them to make sure they work well, so when you said 20 minutes, I think that is awesome! Shark bite fittings are great and there is a valve from Clack Corporation that you get those fittings right in the back of them, but you made good use of what you had. Just a quick question though, The stainless steel braided hose you put in, there wasn't anything longer was there in home depot.

OK. It was 20 minutes to cut into the piping, make all of the Shark Bite connections and connect to the water softener. It took us about hour and a half more to fill the take with resin, connect everything together and get it running. I didn't think that was too bad for having never installed a water softener.

No. Home Depot did not have any longer braided connections. It would have been nice if they had.
 

Gary Slusser

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Oh and amateurplumber1 unless you have a house with like 6 bathrooms and about 18 residents living you don't need 64kGr softener. Its all about the flow for that. There is roughly 2 cubic feet of resin in a tank that large and will handle flows of up to 10 gallons per minute. So unless it is a big house on an acreage with a well pump that can do that, then just go for a 33kGr or a 45kGr water softener depending if you can get 5gpm or 7gpm out of your lines.

I'd like to see your data to back up your claim for the 6 bathrooms and 18 people only needing a 2.0 cuft and the data for Amateurplumber only needing a 1.0 or`1.5 cuft.
 

Tom Sawyer

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I second the motion and, you guys with the sharkbites and flex supplies. Any idea how much restriction all that mess adds to the system?
 

Lifespeed

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Did you notice a drop in water pressure/flow after this install, particularly at the tub? Sorry to criticize your handiwork, but that would have been easily done in copper, and should have been.

Pretty cheap and easy to fix. Soldering is not hard, especially when you have free access to the pipes.
 

robshobs

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Did you notice a drop in water pressure/flow after this install, particularly at the tub? Sorry to criticize your handiwork, but that would have been easily done in copper, and should have been.

Pretty cheap and easy to fix. Soldering is not hard, especially when you have free access to the pipes.

No, I have not seen any significant pressure drop. My soaker tub in the master bath has always had high pressure and continues to do so. I do wish I had measure the gpm before and after. The other day I was showering and noticed low pressure but that is pretty typical when three of us are showering at the same time. I am sure some of the pressure loss is from the SharkBite but I'm guessing the softener is part of the loss as well.

The price of copper has risen so much that the SharkBite solution was not that much more. I am a pretty good ameatur as soldering but it is a slow process for me. I like the SharkBite solutions ease.
 

Mikey

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Not a factor in all cases, but another advantage of the Sharkbite-style fittings is that they're easily removable and reusable.
 
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Btw, just wanted to thank everyone for all the help here, especially dittohead (I think I have PMed him like 20 times; I have no idea how he puts up with my questions and actually answers everyone in detail lol :eek:). I'm pretty close to wrapping this thing up, and I've learned a lot about plumbing and DIY stuff in the process! I would have been screwed without you guys, haha.
 
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