TOTO Ultramax II, Gwyneth MS604114CEFG toilet reviews & pictures

Discussion in 'Toilet Forum discussions' started by Terry, Jul 19, 2008.

  1. rrsears

    rrsears New Member

    Messages:
    3
    Location:
    chandler, az
    Ultramax II Test--Consumer Reports

    I read your opinions on Consumer Reports testing. I do have a concern, though, about the Ultramax II that I'm looking to buy. I saw the video from Toto showing the flushing of the blue liquid. They showed the blue liquid flushed completely. The video produced by Consumer Reports actually showed that the blue liquid did not flush completely on the first flush but had to be flushed a second time to remove the blue liquid. What would cause that to happen? Are you still very confident in the flushing ability in the Double Cyclone flush? Thanks a lot.


    Rick
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 19, 2014
  2. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    14,889
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    I have the Ultramax II in my main bath.

    So after reading your post, and watching the CR video, I went upstairs and tried the same thing on mine.

    It worked fine.

    I have no ideal what Consumer Reports is doing to make their Ultramax II fail a test like that.

    Neither mine, nor any that I have installed for customers work like the one on the Consumer Reports Video.

    So the big question is, What have they done?

    Are they still unhappy with my report to the point that they now need to make stuff up?
    Here are a few emails I got from Consumer Reports on 2000

    Video of performance of the Ultramax II
  3. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    14,889
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    I would put it just below the Sanagloss version of the Drake and Ultramax.

    I still like those a bunch.
    I have the Sanagloss Ultramax downstairs.
  4. rrsears

    rrsears New Member

    Messages:
    3
    Location:
    chandler, az
    Thanks for your quick response. We cannot get the Ultramax with Sanagloss in Bone. Which would you recommend, the Ultramax without the Sanagloss or the Ultramax II with Sanagloss? We are not going to get the Drake because we want a one-piece toilet. Thanks again.

    Rick
  5. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    14,889
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    It bepends on your water.
    If youir water leaves rings, then the Sanagloss II in Bone may be better, or the Carlyle, with comes in Bone and Sanagloss.
  6. rrsears

    rrsears New Member

    Messages:
    3
    Location:
    chandler, az
    Thanks a million for your help, Terry. With our horrendously hard water in Arizona, I think the answer is clear--Ultramax II with Sanagloss it is! You've been of great assistance to me--Your website ROCKS!!!

    Rick
  7. susanna

    susanna New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Denver, CO
    Ultramax ll

    Have had my Ultramax ll for several months now and I can't say enough about how well it works and how easy it is to clean! I did a lot of research on your site before spending that kind of money and am so pleased that I didn't get the American Standard Cadet. I absolutely love the Ultramax ll's cyclone flush...it is so quick, and the refill time is fantastic. The cleaning is easy too. I just spray a little cleaner on it, flush and the yuck is gone. I bought a soft brush for cleaning and haven't needed to use it once. The interior bowl configuration does have a shadow at the water line which can make the bowl look dirty when it isn't. And I do wish the seat was a little easier to clean where the bolts meet the bowl. There is opportunity for liquids to get under there. There is a bit of splash back on the front underside of the seat, but it is easy to clean, so that's ok. I have considered getting a Bemis seat instead. Any thoughts?
    All in all, I wouldn't trade my Toto for any other toilet!
    No need for a plunger yet either! Woohoo! And that was a big consideration with the guys in the house...
    Installation would have been easy but my contractor made a "minor" error in measuring the distance from the wall to the drain. Was off a quarter inch and I was being told I would have to get a different toilet. We finally decided to make a niche in the wall to accomodate the difference, but when they got in there the cast iron vent pipe was in the way. So the tiler curved the wall behind the toilet to fit. I am so glad I insisted that there must be a way to make it work! It actually looks really cool, like we planned it that way!

    Anyway, thanks Terry and everyone who helped!
    Su
  8. slpknt10l03

    slpknt10l03 New Member

    Messages:
    1
    Location:
    rapid city, SD
    Awesome Toilet!

    I love this tiolet! Definently worth the money. This is my first Toto and i think I'm hooked.

    [​IMG]
  9. fred54

    fred54 New Member

    Messages:
    7
    Location:
    central massachusetts
    Consumer Reports blue dye explanation??

    Terry, as someone who is actively looking to replace an old toilet, I have been looking into my various Toto options and came across both the Consumer Reports article and your great web site.

    It seems really crazy that CR could get such a drastically different result than other people, including you, seem to have experienced.

    So I took a careful look at both the Toto video and the CR video of the Ultramax II flush with blue dye. What seemed fairly apparent to me was that the water level in the bowl (prior to the flush) was much lower in the CR video than the Toto video.

    In the Toto video, it appears that the water level exactly fills the depression in the bottom of the bowl, and then slightly overflows the depression when they add the blue dye. However, in the CR video, with the dye added, the water does not seem to fill the depression.

    Could this be a clue as to why CR got a different result?

    I don't know how interested you are in doing more experiments, or if you still have your Ultramax II, but you might like to try scooping out some water from the bowl and then re-trying the dye test. Perhaps that would reproduce CR's result?

    In any case, thanks for this really valuable and informative web site!
  10. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    14,889
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    It's more then just that.
    When I showed the CR video to Jamie, he immediately came to the same conclusion I did.

    Somebody had plugged the bowl.

    They plugged the bowl up, and then ran their test.
    When you plug a bowl, the water doesn't siphon out.
    So how do you make a "bowl test" fail? You stuff it with rubber sponges,
    and then make a video of it.

    However, they did mention two other toilet models in their test nine times.
    One Gerber toilet got five mentions, and the Kohler they listed four times.
    The Gerber had a round bowl, an elongated bowl and an ADA bowl, and the same tank.
    The Kohler was the same toilet, with the choice of a big box, two boxes, or two boxes with a different label.

    I have the Ultramax II in my main bath.
    Works great!
    I sell lot's of the Ultramax II, many of those are referring their friends and neighbors.
    Anytime CR needs tips on toilets, they can give me a call.

    And I promise I won't write reports on car batteries.

    Consumer Reports wants to flush "Consumer Toilet Report" site
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2010
  11. SteveW

    SteveW DIY Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,052
    Location:
    Omaha, NE
    I can't speak to why the CR test is so different from others' experience, but would just add my real-life experience. I have 2 Ultramax II's, and 1 Soiree. Both have Double Cyclone technology and both work well. I think the Ultramax II works a little better, since it really seems to kind of "suck" the waste out of the bowl rather than "push" it out. It is truly amazing to see just how rapidly, and how completely, it does so. Suffice it to say that my family and I have given these toilets a very good workout and they really do perform nearly flawlessly.

    The other discrepancy is that the one-piece Ultramax IIs, like I have, have a MaP score of 500, which is acceptable but lower than the two-piece models, and lower than many other Toto toilets. Despite this, I really think the real-world experience I've had with them would suggest a much higher score than was seen in the lab.
  12. SteveW

    SteveW DIY Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,052
    Location:
    Omaha, NE

    What's up with the base of the toilet? Looks like a couple inches of caulk? Or is it sitting on sort sort of elevated base?
  13. lazypineapple

    lazypineapple New Member

    Messages:
    8
    Location:
    Texas
    Just bought 2 MS604114CEFG , UltraMax II.
    Installed the 1st one,(remodeling),
    Very nice unit. , clean flushing, and quick,
    this Throne, does a complete flush in 20 sec, from the time you push the handle til the water shuts off.
    very pleased ,
  14. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    14,889
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    I've been selling a lot of these lately.
    Most are repeat or referred sales.
    Washington Towers in downtown Bellevue is on location that is just popping right now.

    [​IMG]

    We're pulling a lot of Sterling toilets to make way for them.
  15. Reader Review

    Reader Review Comments by readers

    MS604164CEFG Ultramax II

    Utltramax II installed by owner and working great! The base of the old toilet was a little different in shape than the Ultramax but you can't tell. I'm ready to do your installs for $175.00. In fact I'll do them for $150 and send you $25.00. But I don't think I can carry the toilets over one shoulder.
    Thanks,
    Alan P
    Friday Harbor
  16. Menghsiu

    Menghsiu New Member

    Messages:
    2
    Location:
    CT
    Leaking in the tank!

    Dear Terry,

    I just remodeled the bathroom and installed a Ultramax II. It was fine for the first 3 weeks, but now there's this dripping sound and then the tank will refill after about 30 minutes. For a while I couldn't see where the leak was coming from, then this one time when I heard the tank was being filled, I opened up the tank and see that underneath the green cap (where Cyclone was written) I can see water dripping from it. I unclip the green cap and there were three small jet streams shooting to three different directions. Now instead of dripping sound, it has turned into a hissing sound! I just turned the water feeding the tank off as not to waste water until I have to use it... Does this sound like a serious problem? Is this a easy fix that I can do? I don't know anything about plumbing...
  17. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    14,889
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    Turn off the water to the tank.
    If the tank level goes down, the flapper is leaking.

    If the tank level is steady, then the fill valve may need cleaning or replacement.

    Water dripping from the top of the fill valve is the anti-siphon action of the valve and is most likely normal.
  18. Menghsiu

    Menghsiu New Member

    Messages:
    2
    Location:
    CT
    I think I might have found the problem. When I first looked at the tank I saw this brown floating wings stuff right above the flapper and thought it was part of the tank's guts (some where in the forum I thought I saw someone mentioned the floating wing stuff was to help the flapper from closing too soon?!). Since the tank won't hold water I had to keep opening it up to check, and then finally the brown floating stuff sort of had a small rip, and one part of the wing was caught under the flapper. When I took it out (it wasn't attached to anything) I realized it was just cardboard, and I think the plumber didn't take it out when they installed the toilet. Strange. What kind of inexperienced plumber were they? I hope that that was the problem, and the tank hadn't leak since.

    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 18, 2010
  19. Reader Review

    Reader Review Comments by readers

    MS604114CEFG Ultramax II

    Hi Terry,

    Thanks for installing toilets at my house on August 19. I'm very pleased with the product, installation and service

    Nel L
    Shoreline WA
  20. birdman

    birdman New Member

    Messages:
    8
    Follow up on Gwyneth / Ultramax

    I am in the process of building a house, and about a year ago, when I thought I was going to be ready to order toilets, it seemed that the Toto Gwynneth (sp?) with sanigloss was the way to go for a good flush one piece high end toilet.
    It is now about a year later and after lots of delays, I really am almost ready to order toilets. Has the landscape changed? I recall reading something about some problems with the Toto Ultramax but I confess I have lost sight of the names and what may be new out there.
    Any thoughts? (I am in Canada, so not sure if the product line names are different here).
    TIA (thanx in advance)
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