Toto Soiree or Guinevere review, installing, comments and pictures

Discussion in 'Toilet Forum discussions' started by Plunger, Jan 23, 2006.

  1. timcurtin

    timcurtin New Member

    Messages:
    2
    Location:
    NJ
    I saw a post that said -

    The standard 12" with the Guinevere will work at 11-1/4" from the wall to center.
    A standard rough-in should be 12" from the finished wall, leaving 3/4" behind the tank.

    Is this the same for the Soiree?

    I want to make sure I have just enough room to wipe down my tile wall if needed with something like a swiffer or something like that.

    Thanks,
    Tim
  2. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    15,012
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    At 12", you will have 3/4" behind the tank.

    [​IMG]
  3. timcurtin

    timcurtin New Member

    Messages:
    2
    Location:
    NJ
    What is the recommendation for drill bit to drill into porcelain tile to install the PVC outlet connection?
  4. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    22,023
    Location:
    New England
    You'll have the best luck with a diamond core bit. Depending on what you have available locally, Lowes sells some made by Hitachi that work. Since this type of bit is essentially a piece of pipe with diamond chips on the rim, it takes a little finesse to get the hole where you want it. Also, the things work best if you can keep them cool, so water helps. If you have some plumber's putty, make a little dam around where you want the hole and put some water in it. To start the hole, hold the drill at about a 45-degree angle and then make a divot with the edge. Once you have a divot, slowly raise the drill to vertical keeping the edge in the divot you made. This will keep it from walking all over the place. Once vertical, just keep going. Once you are through the tile and backer, you can switch to a regular drill to go through the wooden subflooring. Keep in mind that this type of bit is grinding the hole, not really cutting it like a wood bit does. I have used a carbide bit, but you may need more than one as carbide and a good, hard porcelain are often about the same hardness. Depends on the tile, some are softer than others. I've never had good luck with a steel or carbide glass bit, but they do make them with diamonds that should work; they work on wall tile, which is often quite soft, but not on a good porcelain.
  5. glnow

    glnow New Member

    Messages:
    41
    Location:
    CA
    Rear Tank Spacing

    Hi,

    Question: Does the gap between the wall and back of the tank change when using one of the non-standard uni-fit adapters?

    I've had a Guinevere for 4 years, using the 14" UF adapter. For me, the gap is just ~0.2", not 3/4" as listed in the spec sheet. Just wondering if it's because of the adapter or (more likely) my rough-in is only 13.5-ish". The reason I'm wondering now is that the wife would like subway tile on the wall behind the toilet, but there isn't room. I still have the original 12" UF, I'm thinking of using that and just having a bit of a gap with the added tile.
  6. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    22,023
    Location:
    New England
    It's likely that your rough-in wasn't exactly 14". You can fudge the position of the toilet on the flange a little bit, but not after you've already drilled the holes for the Unifit. If you substitute the 12" Unifit, the whole toilet will move out 2" from where it is now.
  7. glnow

    glnow New Member

    Messages:
    41
    Location:
    CA
    Thanks! Just so I'm clear, you're referring to fudging the position of the uni-fit on the flange, correct?

    The floor tile is being replaced soon, so I'm going to have a chance to re-do the holes for the uni-fit. So this may work. Any idea how much play the uni-fit has on the flange? It's been a while since I installed it so I don't remember what the fit was like.

    One last thought, is there a chance that by sliding the uni-fit forward on the flange I risk smearing the wax ring enough to block the drain?
  8. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    22,023
    Location:
    New England
    You'd need a new wax ring, as sliding it would likely create a void and therefore a possibility of a leak. You could probably get 1/4", more and it might be a problem getting the screws to hold on the flange.
  9. travelined

    travelined New Member

    Messages:
    2
    Location:
    Idaho
    Hi gang, one of our Guineveres is off-center in the commode area - is it possible to move these left and right at all? I'd need about 1 1/2" of play to make up the difference. It's really noticeable, since the toilet is 8" from the wall on one side and 11" on the other. It's in the basement level - the floor is slab. Thanks
  10. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    22,023
    Location:
    New England
    The toilet can't be moved sideways (or front to back) more than a very small amount (maybe 1/4" if you are lucky) without moving the flange. I'm not sure if that toilet uses the UniFit adapter, if it does, then no, you can't move it even the 1/4" without drilling new holes in the floor. To meet code, the toilet should have 15" on either side of the centerline to any wall or other obstruction.
  11. travelined

    travelined New Member

    Messages:
    2
    Location:
    Idaho
    thanks - that's what I was afraid of . ..
  12. spitnfire

    spitnfire New Member

    Messages:
    12
    Location:
    nj
    Soiree with sanagloss

    Hi Terry:

    Is the sanagloss really worth it? I hear stories that stuff clings to it more or it might stain? How do you clean the sanagloss? Also I hear that some sanagloss may be removed if the wrong cleaner is used and it would make toilet have a yellow hue? Also how are Toto toilets compared with vs Kohler toilets or other toilets?
  13. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    15,012
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    I have a bowl with Sanagloss downstairs, installed in 2006. It looks like the day it was installed.
    I have a customer in Issaquah that after installing one, changed the rest of his toilets to Sanagloss. He swears by it.

    I just use a standard liquid cleaner every once in a while.

    If you read comments about "any" new bowl installed since 1992, they will mention the need for some cleaning.
    Toilets are now 1.6 or 1.28 with more porcelain surface area, and a lot less water. You have to take those comments with a grain of salt. If you compare an 80's bowl to one from 2011, yes there will be a difference. But if we are comparing "new" toilets to "new" toilets, then it's clear that Sanagloss is the way to go.
    I don't sell old bowls, I make sure old bowls are disposed and removed.

    The Toto with Sanagloss is a big improvement over the Kohler class five and class six.
    It's not even close.
    In fact, the Toto without Sanagloss is still a big improvement over Kohler.
  14. spitnfire

    spitnfire New Member

    Messages:
    12
    Location:
    nj
    is the soiree w/ sanagloss the best non electrical toilet out there? in your opinion.. in terms of function, and durable?
  15. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    15,012
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    I don't see how having an electric pump would matter.

    I view the Soiree as top of the line.
  16. spitnfire

    spitnfire New Member

    Messages:
    12
    Location:
    nj
    As a plumber, not a consumer.
    According to a plumber on another site about a problem with Toto: Is there any truth to this? Thanks

    Every single Toto toilet I installed, I had to return within 2 years and take out/remove the Gmax Fill Valve and replace the original flapper that came with the toilet.


    The fill valve is a Korky, aka Hunter fill valve. This company (Toto) is fully aware that they are sending out a fill valve that has a known problem, a $3.47 fix that even the smallest piece of dirt and debri can cause the fill valve to malfunction in these toilets.

    Fluidmaster 400A, the fill valve that is now in nearly all name brand toilets is the cure for this problem, not replacing the GMAX fill valve.
  17. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    15,012
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    I have a Korky installed over at my mothers home in a Cadet wall hung that has been in use for 15 years.

    You can use any fill valve in a Toto; there's plenty of options there.
    The Fluidmaster can overfill the bowl, but most plumbers wouldn't care about that. It's water down the drain, which can add to a water bill.
    All flappers need replacement at some point. Korky also makes replacement flappers for all toilets. If you are having problems with flappers, then there may be a chlorine tablet in the tank.

    We installed a Kohler Memoirs one-piece toilet the other day that was just junk.
    The bowl fill alternated between full and party full. Therefore the flush varied between flushes.
    The bowl was not even , so sometimes the water line was smaller on the left.
    The bottom of the bowl was uneven, so I had to shim on two opposite sides.
    Water sprayed on the wall with the tank lid off.
    That was a top of the line Kohler product.

    I've sold thousands of Toto products over the years, with less then 1% returns. Nobody else can come close to that.
    Sanagloss has been a very good product. Like I said in the previous post, the ones in my home look like the day they were installed.
    I've been selling Sanagloss since 1998, and they are all in use.
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2011
  18. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    22,023
    Location:
    New England
    The porcelain in a toilet should last for eons...the plastic and rubber parts certainly won't. As Terry said, the nice thing about Totos is that they use readily available wear parts that are reasonably priced. Try that with some Kohler stuff where it can cost over $100 to replace a worn out part! Depending on your water, the amount of chlorine in it and probably some other things, the rubber parts will degrade over time. That's a fact of life with parts immersed in that soup of chemicals. This is true with most any brand.

    As to which Toto is 'the best', it is a two part question: one is subjective, as to how does it look to YOU, the other is by design and execution. Toto has proven to be very well designed and executed. They also don't sit still, and their designs evolve to improve on things, so the toilets that have a II designation are improvements over the original. This is not to say the originals were defective or deficient, it's just that they figured out a way to make it better.
  19. spitnfire

    spitnfire New Member

    Messages:
    12
    Location:
    nj
    which is better the toto soiree or toto drake or American Standard Traditional Champion 4 ??? and why? What makes the Soiree top of the class as you said?
  20. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    15,012
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    The American Standard Champion is not a top choice.

    Mostly quality control, but I also don't like the flush as well. There's nothing wrong with it, but the Toto does seem nicer, not so gulpy and sloshy. Getting parts for the Champion has been harder too.

    The Drake II will be similar to the other double cyclone products by Toto. It comes with the rinse that spins around the bowl.
    The Soiree adds:
    one-piece
    Skirted bowl
    Nicer handle and style (if that's important)

    It doesn't work better then the Drake II though.
    It's like my SUV. I could have bought one with the same engine and drive train, but I opted for things like electric rear door, keyless locks, 4-wheel drive with traction control. It doesn't go any faster, though it does do a nice job on the road down from Whistler Mountain at 90 MPH on the winding roads.

    Quality control.
    I don't know what you do for work, but if I have to return items that I've taken the time to install, that's a huge waste of billable time. Save a few bucks, lose hundreds.
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2011
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