Toilet slow to fill

[Razorhog]

Hello everyone,
I've got a Jacuzzi 1.28 gpf toilet that takes forever to fill. The water coming from the fill tube comes out with tremendous force. So hard that I had to zip-tie the tube clip to the overflow tube. Otherwise the force of the water causes the clip to come off and water shoots out from under the lid. Even with that pressure, it takes 10+ minutes for the toilet to fill up and it's quite noisy.

One strange thing I noticed is that the shutoff valve only turns a little bit. From the off position, it only turns about a quarter turn before stopping. Thanks for any comments or suggestions.

 

[Jadnashua]

Many of the shutoff valves are 1/4-turn. If yours is a multi-turn valve, and it is not fully opened, that may be the issue. WHen you flush, it requires both the bowl and the tank to refill at the same time...it sounds like the fill valve is either not adjusted properly (not all are user adjustable), or it is the wrong one for the toilet. My guess is that it is using much more than 1.28g if the balance between tank and bowl is not proper...out of curiosity, redirect the water going to the bowl into a bucket as an experiment and see how much is used while the bowl is filling. If your description is accurate, my guess is lots more than the 1.28g. If this is new, complain to the manufacturer. If you replaced the fill valve, and didn't use an OEM one, you need to get one that is user adjustable and get the balance between the tank and bowl set properly.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Razorhog]

Many of the shutoff valves are 1/4-turn. If yours is a multi-turn valve, and it is not fully opened, that may be the issue. WHen you flush, it requires both the bowl and the tank to refill at the same time...it sounds like the fill valve is either not adjusted properly (not all are user adjustable), or it is the wrong one for the toilet. My guess is that it is using much more than 1.28g if the balance between tank and bowl is not proper...out of curiosity, redirect the water going to the bowl into a bucket as an experiment and see how much is used while the bowl is filling. If your description is accurate, my guess is lots more than the 1.28g. If this is new, complain to the manufacturer. If you replaced the fill valve, and didn't use an OEM one, you need to get one that is user adjustable and get the balance between the tank and bowl set properly.

Thank you for the response. I just bought this house so I'm not sure how old it is. I've never heard the term "balance the tank and bowl" - so does the water coming from the tube going down the overflow tube fill the bowl and there is supposed to be water coming from somewhere else on the fill valve to fill the tank? If so, I don't see any water coming from anywhere else. I'll try to attach a picture of the valve.

 

[hj]

toilet

Most of the water should come out of the bottom of that fill valve, with a "residual stream" through the refill tube into the overflow pipe. I usually remove and throw that brand of fill valve away and install a Fluidmaster valve. IF that is a metal washer under the bolt head on the left hand side, then the tank is assembled incorrectly.

 

[Razorhog]

Swapped out the fill valve with a FluidMaster 400a. It now is quiet and refills in less than 30 seconds! Thanks!

 

[WJcandee]

Those sure look like metal washers in the tank. Down the road, if you start to get leaks between the tank and bowl, that's the first place you should look.

If you look around the internet, a lot of Handi-Hack forums say that you install the tank by placing the metal washer under the bolt head, then the rubber washer. Incorrect.

In an installation with two nuts and two washers, it goes bolt head and rubber washer inside of tank, metal washer and nut outside tank, then insert bolt though base and secure with metal washer and nut under base. If one nut and one washer, then it goes, bolt head and rubber washer inside tank, insert bolt though base and secure with metal washer and nut under base. Putting the metal washer inside the tank is asking for a leak down the road, and is not the way any toilet manufacturer that I know of says to do it.

PS The only thing about putting a 400A in there is that it probably runs at a 20% refill rate, which is the standard refill percentage on old-timey toilets. Many modern toilets (I don't know for sure about the Jacuzzi you have) are going to have a different refill percentage as they put less water in the tank on each flush. If your bowl isn't filling sufficiently, you may want to replace that 400A that some of our moderators love with a Korky 528MP, which our founder likes. That valve allows you to adjust the amount of refill water going into the bowl so that it is just right. It's what Jim was referring to in his post.

But if it's working fine for you, then if it ain't broke...

 

[Razorhog]

I'm resurrecting this old thread because I think there is something else wrong with this toilet. I've replaced that 400a once already and now I'm thinking I need to do it again. It's been less than a year! The problem is that the toilet gets loud when filling and takes longer to fill. Also, every 15 minutes or so it runs for a few seconds. The periodic running would be a slow leak in the flapper, right? That should be an easy flapper replacement but I can't figure out why the toilet filling is loud again and takes longer. Ideas?

 

[WJcandee]

I'm resurrecting this old thread because I think there is something else wrong with this toilet. I've replaced that 400a once already and now I'm thinking I need to do it again. It's been less than a year! The problem is that the toilet gets loud when filling and takes longer to fill. Also, every 15 minutes or so it runs for a few seconds. The periodic running would be a slow leak in the flapper, right? That should be an easy flapper replacement but I can't figure out why the toilet filling is loud again and takes longer. Ideas?

Don't know what the water quality is where you live, but it could be that some gunk is getting in the valve and clogging something. The 400A is often a little louder than the Korky 528 that many of us here (including Terry) like, although the 400A is one that zillions of plumbers swear by. One thing I like about the 528 is that if/when it wears out, you just pop the colored cap off the top and you can replace all the working parts by replacing a quarter-size little cap (costing $3) inside the valve without having to remove the valve. If there's gunk in there, it will be caught in a little strainer that you just pull out. You don't have to unlock the valve, remove the main water connection from the wall or anything else. Just rinse the strainer, reinstall the cap and you're back in business. So...if you need a new valve, try the Korky 528MPK at Lowe's (it's the one with the silver cap). http://www.lowes.com/pd_336988-868-528MPK_0__?Ntt=528mpk&UserSearch=528mpk&productId=3284948&rpp=32 It's easy to install and adjust.

As to the constant refilling, you are right, that's most likely a flapper issue. Easy enough to replace. If that's a 3" flapper, you can just get the Korky Large 3" Flapper, also at Lowe's. http://www.lowes.com/pd_166789-868-3060BP_0__?productId=4742114&Ntt=korky+flapper&pl=1&currentURL=?Ntt=korky+flapper&facetInfo= If it's a 2" flapper on a low-flow toilet, this one is probably the most universal: http://www.lowes.com/pd_579153-868-100PK_0__?productId=50146574&Ntt=korky+flapper&pl=1&currentURL=?Ntt=korky+flapper&facetInfo=

From the looks of it, it's a 3", but it's sometimes hard to tell in photos. At least for me.
EDIT: I looked at the literature. It's a 3" flapper. So... http://www.lowes.com/pd_166789-868-3060PK___?productId=3205079&pl=1&Ntt=korky

Let us know if you have any issues replacing any of this stuff. Korky has some good videos on youtube on how to install the 528MaxPerformance and another on how to service it. The 2" flapper has pretty good instructions, which are HERE: http://www.korky.com/sites/default/files/media/product/pdf/100BP_1.pdf

For the 3" flapper, HERE: http://www.korky.com/sites/default/files/media/product/pdf/3060BP_1.pdf


Those instructions actually tell you the setting for your model of Jacuzzi toilet. And the recently-massively-upgraded Korky.com web site is a weath of information on toilet guts, although their "input the model number" feature isn't really well-stocked yet, which is something I just sent them an email about. Better to use the Brand search.

 

[Razorhog]

It's strange because the 400a is so quiet and fast for several months and then all of a sudden it gets loud and takes longer. When I get time I'll take it out and see if I can find anything clogging the valve. I'm in a small town so Lowe's is out. I have a Ace hardware though I don't think they carry the Korky stuff but I'll check. Thank you!
Edit: Water quality is fine. A little on the hard side but I've seen worse, and this is happening so rapidly I'm not sure what is going on.

 

[WJcandee]

My local Ace carries the 528MP (the K is a Lowe's thing). With a 1.28gpf toilet, don't let them tell you that the regular white-cap one will be fine; it won't because it has the wrong refill ratio for a modern 1.28gpf toilet. Same thing, frankly, with that 400A, but if it's working I won't suggest you replace it. I just always reference the Lowe's link because it shows a picture and a fair price and a lot of our participants want to know if it's at the big box store. You want the one with the silver cap. My Ace also carries that 3" adjustable flapper. But your mileage may vary.

(not one of its rip-off merchant participants) also sells the 3060BP flapper I mentioned as well as the 528MP if you can't find it locally. Lowe's will ship it to you as well. It's a commodity, so you can compare prices including shipping.

 

[Jadnashua]

The Fluidmaster has an easily replaceable, inexpensive rubber seal. If you have sand or other crud in your water, the valves may have become problematic because of that getting trapped in the valve. Taking it apart and replacing the seal may or may not solve it, but is quick and easy thing to try.

 

[Razorhog]

I took the valve out and inspected it, it looks brand new and I can see no obstructions anywhere. I didn't take it apart to look for a seal as I was afraid I wouldn't get it back together. Upon inspection of the flapper, there was a bubble in the rubber seal. I poked it with my pocket knife and squeezed out the air. So far so good, the toilet is not periodically running but I didn't have long to test it. As for the flush valve, I've turned down the water pressure at the wall valve to get the hissing noise to stop.

 

[Razorhog]

I'm going to try this later, and will report back.

http://www.fluidmaster.com/fill-valve-is-very-loud-during-flushing.html

 

[WJcandee]

I took the valve out and inspected it, it looks brand new and I can see no obstructions anywhere. I didn't take it apart to look for a seal as I was afraid I wouldn't get it back together. Upon inspection of the flapper, there was a bubble in the rubber seal. I poked it with my pocket knife and squeezed out the air. So far so good, the toilet is not periodically running but I didn't have long to test it. As for the flush valve, I've turned down the water pressure at the wall valve to get the hissing noise to stop.

A good way to test your "refurbished" flapper is to mark the water level in the tank with a pencil after a refill and then turn the water off at the wall from a couple of hours or overnight. Come back and see if the water level is at the same place. If it isn't, time to spring for a new flapper.

 

[Razorhog]

Thank you for that idea on testing the flapper! I took the top off of the flush valve and there was a little rock or something in one of the little holes. I took it out but it didn't seem to help. Still makes the hissing sound if I turn the water on full blast at the wall.

 

[WJcandee]

Huh. That's a clue that there may be some grit or something occasionally making it into the water line. Are there cleaning instructions on the Fluidmaster web site for the 400A?

(PS You mean the "fill valve". The flush valve is the thing the flapper attaches to.)

 

[Razorhog]

I'm resurrecting this thread because it looks like I'm going to need to replace the fill valve in this toilet again. I think this is the 4th time in less than 2 years. The last time I used a Korky 528 silver top and balanced it according to the instructions. Now it's back to taking forever to fill. It probably takes 5 -10 minutes. I took the valve apart and everything is clean. Nothing in the strainer. It's like the flow has been obstructed - even with the adjustable valve on the fill tube wide open, the water barely comes out of the tube. I haven't taken the line off yet to check for clogs, but I suspect it will be just like the last several times - the water coming out of the fill line has tremendous pressure. Maybe too much pressure is causing the fill valves to fail?
As always, thanks for the insight and this forum.

 

[Reach4]

While the parts are off as shown in the video, you could invert a drinking glass over the fill tower. Then turn on the supply valve. I would expect water to flow up at a good rate. Maybe that flow will dislodge an obstruction.

http://www.korky.com/index.php?p=QuietFILL-Troubleshooting

 

[Razorhog]

While the parts are off as shown in the video, you could invert a drinking glass over the fill tower. Then turn on the supply valve. I would expect water to flow up at a good rate. Maybe that flow will dislodge an obstruction.

http://www.korky.com/index.php?p=QuietFILL-Troubleshooting

I've tried that before with other fill valves and it never made a difference, but it's worth a shot.

 

[Georgie3]

Fill Valve Workaround
I have a Jacuzzi toilet that was taking several minutes to fill as well. After reading this thread I realized the reason was that most of the water was coming out the small flexible refill tube into the overflow drain tube, indicating a problem with the fill valve and wasting a lot of water every flush. I did a simple workaround: I positioned the refill tube so it empties into the tank, not the overflow drain. Now this could cause the toilet bowl not to fill enough after flushing, but this was not a problem in my case -- the toilet bowl fills up with water almost as much as before. I don't know why, but it does. Toilet fills in about 25 seconds now.

I also had to use a bit of glue to fix the refill tube clip in place (on the near side of the drain tube) because the water comes out with such force that the clip gets pushed loose... I just used a bit of Goop which is easy to peel off later.

This workaround might help some people and save replacing fill valves, if your toilet bowl also fills up enough without supply from the refill tube. I even did this on our second non-Jacuzzi toilet and results were good as well.

Just a final note that if you have a slow-filling toilet, especially Jacuzzi, first check and clean the water supply line filter. Took me a while to find it... on my toilet it's right where the water supply line attaches to the tank. Has a small black plastic stick in the middle so you can pull it straight out with pliers (from outside, after disconnecting the water supply).