They won't install my new dishwasher!

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice, Tips & ' started by tnichols, Mar 30, 2012.

  1. tnichols

    tnichols New Member

    Messages:
    21
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    The installers came to install my new GE dishwasher and they said they would not do it. I have a very small kitchen. A quick description of the layout is: (from left to right) a walk way, 18" dishwasher space, range, corner cabinet and sink. They said they would not run the drain line behind a range! There is enough room. They just didn't like it behind the range.

    So now what do I do? It looks like I will have to put in my own drain pipe down to the basement. There is no room to the left of the dishwasher as it is the end of the cabinet run. To the right of the dishwasher I only have 2.5" of a filler. Then the range. I could dill a hole in the floor, but there is a requirement of the drain hose has to go up first 32" before it goes down. I don't know how I will get this done in 2.5" filler/spacer cabinet. Behind is a outside concrete wall, so that is not a good place to put a pipe.

    Is there some restriction that a drain hose can not go behind a range? Do I need to get different installers? Even if I get a drain pipe installed in the 2.5" filler, how would they connect it as there would be no access to it once they push the dishwasher in the cabinet?
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2012
  2. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,279
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    There may be room behind the range to run the drain line. There is no requirement that the drain has to rise to 32" before going to the sink.
  3. tnichols

    tnichols New Member

    Messages:
    21
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
  4. tnichols

    tnichols New Member

    Messages:
    21
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    There is no room behind the range... It is a solid concrete outside wall.
  5. Hackney plumbing

    Hackney plumbing Homeowner

    Messages:
    1,174
    Location:
    Alabama
    In the 1st post you said there was enough room behind the range. Now you have decided its not enough room? Hj said theres no requirment that the hose rises 32" BEFORE running over to the sink. And he is right. Read it again.
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2012
  6. tnichols

    tnichols New Member

    Messages:
    21
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    I am sorry, I really don't see the difference... I don't see what I am reading wrong... The installation manual says the drain hose must rise to a minimum of 32" above the floor before going to the disposal. On page 10 of the installation manual says:

    "IMPORTANT - Either one of the above methods must be used or the dishwasher will not operate properly"

    Method 1 uses a Air Gap and Method 2 uses a 32" high loop before going to the disposal or waste tee.

    So what am I reading wrong? Is this just a requirement of GE's?
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2012
  7. tnichols

    tnichols New Member

    Messages:
    21
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    There is room for a little drain hose behind the stove. I cut a grove in the floor that holds the hose and it just runs to the next cabinet. There is not room for a drain pipe. And this is the point, the installers did not want any water, hose or pipe around the stove, like it was some kind of safety issue.
  8. Chad Schloss

    Chad Schloss Member

    Messages:
    328
    Location:
    USA
    why would you argue with seasoned plumbers? they do this stuff for a living.
  9. tnichols

    tnichols New Member

    Messages:
    21
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Sorry, I am not trying to argue, I really don't understand. Why they are saying one thing, but the manufacture of the appliance is saying something totally different? They both can't be right. Is the manual wrong??? I talked to GE today and they said unless the dishwasher was installed according to the manual, they would not honor any warranty.

    Its been a very frustrating day... We ordered a dishwasher, range and microwave. They would not install the dishwasher and they would not split the order. So we do not have a dishwasher or range. I knew they were coming today, so I pulled the range out myself to save them time. The range was trash so I just cut the wires. So now we have nothing. I think we will be eating out for a long time.
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2012
  10. Jerome2877

    Jerome2877 In the Trades

    Messages:
    397
    Location:
    BC
    It states either an air gap or a high loop. So if using the air gap there is no need for the loop.
  11. tnichols

    tnichols New Member

    Messages:
    21
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Yes, but the air gap is higher than the high loop. The air gap is even worse. Its the same problem. I still can't just drill a hole in the floor and drain it that way.
  12. tnichols

    tnichols New Member

    Messages:
    21
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    I will repeat my original questions:

    Is there some restriction that a drain hose can not go behind a range or do I need to get different installers?
  13. LLigetfa

    LLigetfa DIYer, not in the trades

    Messages:
    3,836
    Location:
    NW Ontario, Canada
    Can the high loop not be put anywhere? My dishwasher has a high loop right on the side of the unit put there by the factory. I also created a high loop under the sink.
  14. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    21,817
    Location:
    New England
    You've been given the answers, but in pieces...

    The hose does need to go up high, but it does not need to go there immediately or stay there...it can be run along the floor THEN rise...it just must go high, per the manufactuer, somewhere BEFORE it gets to the drain. So, running it anywhere you want is okay as long as you eventually get it to run high. Once you reach that high point, it should go down to the drain. Now, you don't want it to go up/down/up again, but that's a different story.

    There is no restriction about running plumbing behind a stove. Now, there may not be a huge amount of room, but the stove is designed to be in contact with flamable materials on the sides and back. I don't think I'd want to run it under the stove, but behind it should be fine. Without seeing your stove, can't tell how much room there is, but normally, there's at least a little bit of room for either the power connection or the gas connection, so the drain hose should be able to make it.
  15. cacher_chick

    cacher_chick Test, Don't Guess!

    Messages:
    3,237
    Location:
    Land of Cheese
    There is nothing to say that the drain hose cannot be run behind the stove.
    There must be a high loop or an air gap fitting somewhere between the dishwasher and the disposal.
  16. tnichols

    tnichols New Member

    Messages:
    21
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    I might be able to put it in the 2.5" filler/spacer. This little filler provides support for the counter top. Its only 2.5" wide and that would have to hold the loop and drain pipe. I think this might be my only option. This little filler is only open on the dishwasher side. The other side facing the range is closed. So once they push the dishwasher in to the cabinet, there is no way to get at the hoses. So everything would have to be hooked up before the dishwasher is pushed in the cabinet. I am not sure where the extra drain hose. Maybe I will have to cut a access hole in the cabinet. I don't know.

    Is your dishwasher with the factory installed high loop a GE 18"? That would be real nice. I would guess if GE had that, they would not put the requirement in their installation manual.

    They told me I have two weeks to solve the problem or they cancel the order.
  17. tnichols

    tnichols New Member

    Messages:
    21
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Thank you Jim....
  18. tnichols

    tnichols New Member

    Messages:
    21
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Here is a picture... dishwasher on the left and range on right... just 2.5" between them.

    Attached Files:

  19. tnichols

    tnichols New Member

    Messages:
    21
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    DSCN1779s.jpg

    Here is another picture... As you can see, there is a walk way to the left, dishwasher space, 2.5" filler (holding up the counter top), and area for the range. The plan was to run the drain hose behind the range at the bottom of the wall. The wall is concrete and is an outside wall. If I can't run the drain hose there, I have to put in a drain pipe and high loop in the 2.5" filler/spacer.
  20. tnichols

    tnichols New Member

    Messages:
    21
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    DSCN1704s.jpg

    This was the before photo... I ripped out the range and cabinet with four drawers. This was the only place I could squeeze in a dishwasher. So I built the new cabinet to hold the dishwasher in the previous photos and removed the range. I did all the carpentry and electrical work. But i had a professional plumber put the hot water line in. I don't do plumbing. Everything I touch leaks. But I can do the rest.
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